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View Poll Results: Which circuits would you drop? (4-8 options please)
Mid-Ohio 8 9.76%
Lime Rock 29 35.37%
Mosport 5 6.10%
Austin 10 12.20%
Barber 36 43.90%
Indianapolis 44 53.66%
Virginia 14 17.07%
New Jersey 57 69.51%
Long Beach 23 28.05%
Detroit 37 45.12%
Baltimore 47 57.32%
Houston 64 78.05%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 82. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 15 Mar 2013, 03:07 (Ref:3218671)   #1
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2014 United SportsCar Racing schedule - which circuits to drop?

We all agree on the classics: Daytona, Sebring, Road Atlanta, Watkins Glen, Laguna Seca, Road America. But what should we do with the less frequented circuits, the odd ones, the new ones, street races? Also, instead of dropping circuits, they could get split races, or only some classes.

So, I turn the question around: which circuits would you drop, supposing that only 11-13 will survive the merger?
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Old 15 Mar 2013, 03:16 (Ref:3218672)   #2
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Mosport has one of the largest attendances so far, so it needs to stay. I'm not a fan of street circuits or rovals... outside of Daytona. I left Indy for now because of the name... but meh.
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Old 15 Mar 2013, 03:22 (Ref:3218673)   #3
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From the 2013 calendars:
Kansas
Indianapolis
Barber

That gets it down to 14, after you've eliminated the 5 redundant events. I feel like I'm cutting bone to go further, and I really don't care that this total is still more than 12 rounds.

The three temporary courses cover key areas that are otherwise unserved: Mid Atlantic, Detroit, and Southern California.

Personally, I don't see much point in only putting on a partial show at a circuit (i.e. not having all the classes there), nor would I see nearly the same value in going to such an event.

Split races offer some critical challenges as well. Do you have the track time to do full-length races? Also, would the GT race even get a broadcast? Would the Continental Tire Series have to forfeit broadcasts to provide a slot for the separte GT races to be shown?

P.S. BTW, New Jersey was already dropped for this season, and neither series is scheduled to be at Houston this year. So, I'm not sure why they're being included in the poll. You also left Kansas off the list, and that IS a venue on the 2013 calendar.

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Old 15 Mar 2013, 03:35 (Ref:3218676)   #4
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I'd say Baltimore and Houston for sure. I think Long Beach and Detroit as two street circuits is fine and they both serve a key demographic. Baltimore is kind of surrounded by lots of other, far superior tracks, and with COTA now in Austin, Houston seems kind of irrelevant.
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Old 15 Mar 2013, 03:43 (Ref:3218678)   #5
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What other tracks is Baltimore actually surrounded by? It's hundreds of miles to VIR, Mid Ohio, Watkins Glen, or Lime Rock. Summit Point is not even close to being up to FIA Grade 2 standard, so that's NOT an option.

Also, given the D.C./Baltimore, Philadelphia, and N.Y.C. metro areas, it's not just the distance that's an issue to go elsewhere, but potentially spending additional hours in heavy traffic to even try to get there.
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Old 15 Mar 2013, 04:12 (Ref:3218688)   #6
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What other tracks is Baltimore actually surrounded by? It's hundreds of miles to VIR, Mid Ohio, Watkins Glen, or Lime Rock. Summit Point is not even close to being up to FIA Grade 2 standard, so that's NOT an option.

Also, given the D.C./Baltimore, Philadelphia, and N.Y.C. metro areas, it's not just the distance that's an issue to go elsewhere, but potentially spending additional hours in heavy traffic to even try to get there.
NJMP?
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Old 15 Mar 2013, 04:25 (Ref:3218693)   #7
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Grand-Am already dropped Thunderbolt. It would suffer from the same length constrains as several of the others (lap of 2.250 miles), and it's layout has been prone to produce traffic bottlenecks with just the Rolex field on its own. So, there's no compelling reason to add it back now.

(It doesn't help either that it's rather featureless, apart from the one hill, which has been neutered with a chicane, and the barriers are so far back everywhere that there is little if any close-up viewing to be had.)

I might add that one track 100 miles away does NOT equal "surrounded", not even close.

(I don't normally directly compare road courses and street circuits, but in my estimation, it's going to have to be a rather poor street circuit to lose out to a relatively flat and/or featureless road course. Baltimore without the Pratt Street chicane is a rather good street circuit in my book. On the other hand, I don't find Thunderbolt that much more appealing than Miller, a track that BOTH series tried multiple layouts at, and then dropped.)

P.S. I'm going to feel like dope-slapping anybody who picks either Mosport or VIRginia out of that list in the poll.

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Old 15 Mar 2013, 05:35 (Ref:3218704)   #8
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My list/schedule.

Daytona (Jan.)
Barber (Feb.)
Sebring (Mar.)
Laguna Seca (April)
COTA (May)
Road America (late May)
Mid Ohio (July 4th)
Belle Isle (July)
Mosport (Aug.)
Watkins Glen (Sept)
VIR (Sept./Oct.)
Road Atlanta-PLM (Oct.)







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Old 15 Mar 2013, 11:54 (Ref:3218820)   #9
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I see no reason to keep Kansas in the future, or New Jersey, or Detroit, or even Indy. Just my personal preference, but I like seeing the traditional road courses in North America being used. If there is an economic reason to expand into a new market and try an roval, fine. Otherwise stick to what the fans want to see.
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Old 15 Mar 2013, 13:12 (Ref:3218855)   #10
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I see no reason to keep Kansas in the future, or New Jersey, or Detroit, or even Indy. Just my personal preference, but I like seeing the traditional road courses in North America being used. If there is an economic reason to expand into a new market and try an roval, fine. Otherwise stick to what the fans want to see.

I agree only one i might add to that is VIR, but thats just me being selfish because I've never been able to figure that track out.
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Old 15 Mar 2013, 13:57 (Ref:3218874)   #11
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How about this:

24h Daytona (Protos / GTLM / GTD)
12h Sebring (Protos / GTLM / GTD)
10h Road Atlanta (Protos / GTLM / GTD)
6h Watkins Glen (Protos / GTLM / GTD)
4h Laguna Seca (Protos / GTLM / GTD)
4h Road America (Protos / GTLM / GTD)
3h Mid-Ohio (Protos / GTLM / GTD)
3h Mosport (Protos / GTLM / GTD)
3h Austin (Protos / GTD)
3h Lime Rock (Protos / GTLM)
2h Long Beach (Protos / GTLM)
2h Detroit (GTLM / GTD)
3h Barber (GTLM / GTD)

The reason why I removed GTLM from Austin is to encourage them to join the WEC race
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Old 15 Mar 2013, 14:59 (Ref:3218899)   #12
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Nice line-up, but will they broadcast all of it?
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Old 15 Mar 2013, 15:02 (Ref:3218903)   #13
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I wonder if they will race on Sundays? Grand-Am shows usually race on Saturday so they don't conflict with the cabs on Sunday.
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Old 15 Mar 2013, 15:20 (Ref:3218916)   #14
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Of the new circuits they have to keep VIR on the calender, as far as a circuit goes it ranks up there with Spa in my books. Fast, undulating and with little room for error making it a proper track. Baltimore can go, it's too slow and tight for multi-class sports car racing IMO.
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Old 15 Mar 2013, 15:26 (Ref:3218917)   #15
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NBU38, I would also be concerned about people simply not watching Barber and Detroit because of the lack of the "halo" cars in those events.

One thing people seem to overlook is that, even though IMSA frequently had split events, or GT-only events, most current viewers are NOT used to them now. Grand-Am tried it in 2007 at several tracks, some of which I think it was silly for them to do so at (VIR, for instance). However, they dropped the idea for 2008, even though there wasn't a substantial drop-off in entries.

Finally, this is just a technical note. The reason the current sprint races are 2 hours, 45 minutes, instead of 3 hours, has to do with FIA circuit rules about how many cars a track is supposed to be able to have run in a particular type of race.One of the crieteria for calculating the value is race duration, and one ofthe cut-offs, for whatever reason, occurs at 2 hours, 45 minutes. (Now, since this isn't an official FIA-sanctioned series, there is likely to be some extra flexibility allowed in this department, but you get the picture.)
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Old 15 Mar 2013, 15:35 (Ref:3218921)   #16
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NBU38, I would also be concerned about people simply not watching Barber and Detroit because of the lack of the "halo" cars in those events.

One thing people seem to overlook is that, even though IMSA frequently had split events, or GT-only events, most current viewers are NOT used to them now. Grand-Am tried it in 2007 at several tracks, some of which I think it was silly for them to do so at (VIR, for instance). However, they dropped the idea for 2008, even though there wasn't a substantial drop-off in entries.

Finally, this is just a technical note. The reason the current sprint races are 2 hours, 45 minutes, instead of 3 hours, has to do with FIA circuit rules about how many cars a track is supposed to be able to have run in a particular type of race.One of the crieteria for calculating the value is race duration, and one ofthe cut-offs, for whatever reason, occurs at 2 hours, 45 minutes. (Now, since this isn't an official FIA-sanctioned series, there is likely to be some extra flexibility allowed in this department, but you get the picture.)
2:45 also works well for TV packaging.






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Old 15 Mar 2013, 15:53 (Ref:3218924)   #17
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That had occurred to me as well, though I would imagine keeping the FIA off their backs was Priority #1 when they initially went to this duration. The TV thing just turned out to be a convenient side-effect.

DJ, if they leave the Pratt Street chicane in indefinitely, I might just agree with you. However, if they find a way to deal with that issue of the tracks, and thus can remove the chicane, then I don't see Baltimore being any worse than Long Beach or Detroit.

(The Baltimore circuit is wide (3-5 lanes for the entire lap), and has 4-5 decent, high-speed stretches (helped by moving Turns 5/6 down further), and doesn't have really awful traffic bottlenecks. The Turn 5/6/7 complex is slow enough that there isn't a huge variation in theoretical apex speeds between the different classes, which reduces the desperation factor for Prototype drivers to get past GTs right there.. Conversely, dealing with traffic fomr Turn 1 to Turn 5 at Long Beach is a very tricky proposition.)

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Old 15 Mar 2013, 17:21 (Ref:3218959)   #18
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NBU38, I would also be concerned about people simply not watching Barber and Detroit because of the lack of the "halo" cars in those events.
911, 458, Corvette, Z4, Viper, Aston Martin aren't halo enough to you? They do standalone 24 hour races at Spa and Nürburgring, and people seem to love them.

About television coverage, if NBC air network will broadcast SEVEN of the Robby Gordon's Stadium Super Truck events, I'm sure Fox Sports 1 or 2 can show ten 2:45 races
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Old 15 Mar 2013, 17:43 (Ref:3218980)   #19
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The process of boiling that down to a 2014 schedule is formidable, but what a great problem to have. In very short terms, it will be a schedule made up of the most iconic, historic venues in the most important business markets for our stakeholders. Think about it for a minute: You open the season with the 24 Hours of Daytona, you follow it with the 12 Hours of Sebring. From there it's on to Indianapolis, it's on to any number of street circuits, it's Watkins Glen, it's Circuit of the Americas, what an incredible addition that's been for road racing. And then we close it all out at Petit Le Mans.
This is tricky, we know.
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Old 15 Mar 2013, 17:46 (Ref:3218983)   #20
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911, 458, Corvette, Z4, Viper, Aston Martin aren't halo enough to you? They do standalone 24 hour races at Spa and Nürburgring, and people seem to love them.

About television coverage, if NBC air network will broadcast SEVEN of the Robby Gordon's Stadium Super Truck events, I'm sure Fox Sports 1 or 2 can show ten 2:45 races
I'd like to think that too....but those stadium truck events (whether viewed in person or on TV) draw in the young 'energy drink'-gulping crowd.....a much bigger demographic that we are.
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Old 15 Mar 2013, 17:47 (Ref:3218984)   #21
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They're not the "top class" in the series. I might add that there already are the World Challenge and Continental Tires series that are fully production-based, not to mention NASCAR for tin-tops, if you will. The production/stock racing scene is a different animal here than elsewhere, and I don't see a GT-only event under USCR getting that much attention, plus there's already a boat load of GT series around the world to follow; there's no need for another one.

The N24 and Spa 24 are long-established, special events. Barber and Detroit are unlikely to be anything more than sprints, especially Detroit.

Robby Gordon has NASCAR notoriety and sponsors. It's also a discipline that some of the stock car, and some of the outdoor and extreme sports, fans might watch. USCR might be able to get the NASCAR sponsorship to some degree, but they won't have that one, recognizable face from the series to go with and for fans to latch on to.
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Old 15 Mar 2013, 17:51 (Ref:3218987)   #22
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I wonder if they will race on Sundays? Grand-Am shows usually race on Saturday so they don't conflict with the cabs on Sunday.
Perhaps an odd Sunday here and there depending on when the taxis are parked for the weekend....but I think it will be 80% or better on Saturdays...
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Old 26 Mar 2013, 22:55 (Ref:3225315)   #23
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As for which circuits to drop, I'm not sure. But Mosport has to stay on the schedule, as Canada loves motorsport! It's an awesome track with a long history, and just miles away from North America's fifth-largest urban area (Toronto). Attendance is guaranteed.
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Old 26 Mar 2013, 23:52 (Ref:3225329)   #24
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I really have to question whoever put in that one vote for Mosport to be dropped.

Lose Mosport and you lose an entire geographical block of your fanbase. Toronto is a joke of a track and an event as well so that isn't even close to being a suitable replacement. Montreal? Whole different market, and the track is TERRIBLE for spectators. No camping either.
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Old 27 Mar 2013, 00:37 (Ref:3225335)   #25
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As for which circuits to drop, I'm not sure. But Mosport has to stay on the schedule, as Canada loves motorsport! It's an awesome track with a long history, and just miles away from North America's fifth-largest urban area (Toronto). Attendance is guaranteed.
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I really have to question whoever put in that one vote for Mosport to be dropped.

Lose Mosport and you lose an entire geographical block of your fanbase. Toronto is a joke of a track and an event as well so that isn't even close to being a suitable replacement. Montreal? Whole different market, and the track is TERRIBLE for spectators. No camping either.
I agree mosport has to stay, I just hope it isn't scheduled at the same weekend as other major series in Canada like it has been recently.
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