BWRDC 40 Woman race at Silverstone Nov 2nd

[TimRTC]

An interesting race taking part on the Walter Hayes weekend at Silverstone, an attempt by the BWRDC to get up to 40 women racing the National Circuit in an all-comers closed-wheel event to promote the number and quality of lady racers.

Sounds good, but there doesn't seem to be an entry list anywhere and I haven't seen any confirmed attendances from any of the drivers I follow on twitter.

Does anyone know of anyone taking part in this race?

[fergus_r]

http://www.hscc.org.uk/images/Walter...Entry_List.pdf

[TimRTC]

Thanks.

[pauln]

Quite a few names there that I recognise, including Nina who's a regular part of the startline team at Silverstone.

[thetool]

Having it only open to women is completely missing the point - a bit like Formula Woman a few years ago.

[BertMk2]

Originally Posted by thetool

Having it only open to women is completely missing the point - a bit like Formula Woman a few years ago.

Agreed. Positive discrimination is not a solution to a perceived problem. If nothing else it's patronising.

[NICK ALLISON]

Originally Posted by pauln

Quite a few names there that I recognise, including Nina who's a regular part of the startline team at Silverstone.

Both Nina Fountain and Barbera Shillaker are from the marshalling community. Also they do not have seem to have a problem with a women only race .

[Derwent Motorsp]

There are some capable girls in there. The event seems to have suffered a lack of promotion by the BWRDC. It may be positive discrimination but motorsport is one of only two sports where men and women compete equally. There are far to few girls racing these days and a ladies only race will race the profile a bit - if it had been publcised more. The BWRDC president is Jodie Kidd. if they had got het to come and race or even wave a flag then there would have been stacks of publicity!

[jagbabe]

Hi Guys

Some of your observations are not, unfortunately correct. The BWRDC has promoted this event on facebook and website and in other media. In addition Downforce radio will cover the event live and we are hoping to have BBC interest but will only know on the day. In addition Jodie Kid is not the president.
The race is not something we would normally promote as we totally value the fact that we all race equally against blokes and as you point out quite a few of us have had some success in that venture.
However the fact is that only around 5% of competition licence holders are female and we find that to be an unfortunate statistic that needs to change.
By promoting such a race that will create a new British Record but not in a manufactured manner as was done with Formula Women but by inviting our many experienced and successful members to promote women in Motorsport in a positive and fun handicap race where everyone will have a chance to win.
One of our most prominent supporters and members, Suzie Wolff is on the cusp of a F1 drive but what about BTCC, British GT or just weekend club racers? It's time that women everywhere realised that our sport is one of only two major sports where men and women compete together and that makes it very special. Its also far safer than messing about on horses and we think offers great opportunities for women to develop careers (not just behind the wheel).
I will get off my soap box and will be in my Jaguar on Sunday, hoping the gearbox lasts and for a good result. If we can raise the aspirations of just a few ladies to take up our sport that will be a good result for me.
If you get time do visit garage 12 b (I think) and say hello you will all be very welcome.
Gail Hill (chairman BWRDC)

[Lancsbreaker]

You tell them Gail!

As one who was glad to take the opportunity to share your car some years ago (and was comprehensively slower than you!) I'm sure you'll be out there competing strongly as you always do - as will Lisa, another whose races I've followed when out with CSCC

[Al Weyman]

Most girls don't like getting their hands dirty and most racers start their careers doing just that so I think there will always be an imbalance. Dont get me wrong I genuinely love to see a lady doing well in racing and in championships I have been involved in have always actively tried to encourage them in fact I changed the name of our annual do from Ladies Night to Awards Dinner Dance much to the disgust of one of the drivers wifes but at that time we had three lady drivers in ModProds (including the excellent Ilsa Cox) and I felt it insulting to call it Ladies Night but the facts are it will always be male dominated unless the girls are lucky enough to have a fella to prepare for them and get the cars to the track or the clout to pay someone to do it. I have been involved supporting lady drivers since I worked for Roger Nathan in the early 70's and was put in charge of preparing his works Imp for Lianna Englemann, I got a lot of attention from Honey Magazine as I recollect

[Celia Stevens]

I splashed my way round the Silverstone national circuit yesterday along with 28 other women. The conditions were horrendous, there being more standing water on the track than there was visible track. However being the driver of the oldest car there, which I was racing on Dunlop Historics, I can vouch for the excellent driving ability and car control for all the unfortunate girls who had to get by me as I slid and slithered round the bends!
We set a record and all 'enjoyed' ourselves, as much as anyone could in those conditions: and if anybody wants to have a poke at the fact it was an all female race then I am sorry for them, they are sad individuals. The cars that participated were as far apart as my Warwick and Fionas' Lamborghini Gaillardo, no-one made contact with anyone else and there were no track infringements. It was a fun, non championship event with cars running together that never would normally and hopefully we can do it again next year and the sun will shine!
Well done indeed to all that took part and a huge thank-you to all the marshalls, both male and female and all the other officials of the meeting, and of course the HCSS for having us!

[Celia Stevens]

By the way Alan, none of us mind getting our hands dirty, there are some super girls in motorsport engineering and they are a growing number!

[BertMk2]

Originally Posted by Celia Stevens

We set a record and all 'enjoyed' ourselves, as much as anyone could in those conditions: and if anybody wants to have a poke at the fact it was an all female race then I am sorry for them, they are sad individuals.

I don't think anyone is poking fun at it - it's just that it seems to be an unnecessary and slightly patronising event. As has been mentioned - motorsport is one sport where men and women can compete on an equal basis, so to go an organise a race where that isn't the case seems insane. Why go out of the way to organise a women only event? That just gives the naysayers more ammunition surely? "ooh look, the girls can't cut it against the blokes so have their own race so one of them wins, how nice for them" (not my view - just making a point).

As for the number of women in motorsport - there aren't many, is it a problem? Not really. If they want to compete they can, if they don't then fair enough. Promote motorsport to everyone - don't restrict your target to one specific group. Not enough vegans in motorsport - how about a vegans only race? Not enough people called Wayne? Let's have a Wayne only race? Daft.

[Celia Stevens]

Bert I really am sorry you feel that way about it. We don't feel patronised and along with all the women marshals that were there felt that we were showing women who would have no idea at all that they could get involved that they could. Unfortunately it still is the norm for people to raise their eyebrows when they see a woman doing something 'unusual.' I am an HGV 1 driver and have driven all over Europe and this country. When I first started driving trucks I used to get stopped by the police because they couldn't believe that I was female. I know all about having to cope with that kind of thing and trying to keep a balance between doing a job that I loved and trying to remain myself. I used to rope and sheet my loads on my own and just do it as any trucker would, and most other truckers just accepted me as another driver. However quite a few women I met were amazed and wanted to know how to get their licence. Now there are quite a lot of women HGVers and no-one takes any notice. Hopefully after our race on Saturday we will have had the same effect.
Motorsport is promoted to everyone I agree, but as I think I have made the point above, women and girls still aren't aware of the opportunities, often as it is assumed in our society that women don't want to do that sort of thing.
Apart from anything else it was great to race against other women who we would've had no chance of doing so ordinarily, as we all race in different genres of motorsport, and it was fun. Why shouldn't we do it again? Are we going to kick up if a load of blokes all want to have a fun mixed race, no of course not. As for your last comments about Vegans and Wayne, why not if you can find enough of either with race licences go do it! It is all about enjoying oneself, whoever you are.

[BertMk2]

Originally Posted by Celia Stevens

Bert I really am sorry you feel that way about it. We don't feel patronised and along with all the women marshals that were there felt that we were showing women who would have no idea at all that they could get involved that they could. Unfortunately it still is the norm for people to raise their eyebrows when they see a woman doing something 'unusual.'

I don't understand why only women would have no idea they could get involved? There are many people out there who don't know where to start with getting into motorsport - I don't see that as a women only problem.

Originally Posted by Celia Stevens

I am an HGV 1 driver and have driven all over Europe and this country. When I first started driving trucks I used to get stopped by the police because they couldn't believe that I was female.... Now there are quite a lot of women HGVers and no-one takes any notice.

I rally as a co-driver - there are plenty of women at most rallies (both driving and co-driving), nobody bats an eyelid at it. Is there a difference in perceptions between rally and circuit? Is one more accessible than the other?

Originally Posted by Celia Stevens

Motorsport is promoted to everyone I agree, but as I think I have made the point above, women and girls still aren't aware of the opportunities, often as it is assumed in our society that women don't want to do that sort of thing.

Why aren't as many women aware of the opportunities? They have access to all the same information as men - so surely that infers that they are less interested as a group?

Originally Posted by Celia Stevens

Are we going to kick up if a load of blokes all want to have a fun mixed race, no of course not.

I think if there was a race that was 'men only' there would be a massive fuss. In fact I doubt it would even make it on to a timetable.

Originally Posted by Celia Stevens

It is all about enjoying oneself, whoever you are.

Exactly - that's why I don't think segregation is a good idea or constructive. At the end of the day for the vast majority of people motorsport is about getting out there and having fun - regardless of gender (race, religion, dietary preference or Wayneness).

[Derwent Motorsp]

I do think a lot more could have been done to publicise this event in order to get more girls competing. Was there anything in the weekly comics? There are a lot more girls out there who did not enter which is sad, there must be another 5 or 6 who race with the MGCC for a start. It would also help if there had been some of the younger girls entered.
It's all about getting more ladies competing throughout the season.
Sadly, as someone who gets to many types of motorsport there is a decline in the number lady competitors in recent years. We actually haven't had a British Ladies Rally Championship for many years due to the complete lack of ladies!

[suebmick]

I was racing in the Darvi 5/97 750 Formula car that I built (yes you read it right) in 1996/7. I have been racing since then with 750MC in the 750F Championship & love every minute. For the first 10 years or so, until I married my lovely husband, 10 times champion & 750F car constructor, Mick Harris, I did ALL the maintenance/repair work myself. I pride myself in being one of (actually) many ladies who DON'T mind getting their hands dirty. But that's not what it's all about.....I wanted to race. The 750Formula looked clean/fun/close racing, with a good band of friendly, helpful racers. So I built a car & joined the longest-running championship in the world.

So many men think women in racing cars are a topic of humour. Until you beat them. Then things get a little quiet on the joking front. I know.

There were 29 of us out there on sunday in appalling conditions, albeit nothing like as quick as we all could've been in the dry, racing against other drivers & their cars that we never get the chance to race against. The BWRDC runs championships on a points basis because so few women are ever in a race together. I knew a few faces, but was able to put many more names to faces & they did the same. We were there to make a British record, which we did, and to race against people we never normally see, & against cars we never normally race against.

Despite being tiny compared even to a Locost, & staring at everybody's exhaust pipes (if I could see them through the water), I thoroughly enjoyed myself racing against 28 other racing drivers who are of a mind that racing is a non-contact sport (rare these days), & look forward to doing it again next year.

There was a huge amount of interest from anyone, men & women, who came to the ladies pit garage to meet the drivers & to see some of the photos of ladies who have raced over the years. The lady marshall tally was extraordinary on the day, & hopefully some trainees will take up the vocation....NONE of us can race without them & we are all grateful to anyone who spends their free time travelling around the country to stand in the pouring rain & try to get us to see flags at important moments.

Personally I do not bang on about being a lady in a male sport. When I'm out there I am just another racer. That's how it should be. But there are times when we can have some fun & do something different for a change, & perhaps provide some entertainment for the crowds at the same time.

I am proud to be part of the British Women Racing Drivers' Club & to compete nationally with the 750F. And I am also proud to be part of last weeks record-breaking team. Those who don't agree with what we've done don't have to watch, do they?

[Al Weyman]

OK I hear what you and Celia are saying and that you dont mind rolling your sleeves up, breaking the odd nail and getting stuck in BUT you are the exception to the rule and in the minority I would hazard a guess and the reasons I stated before still hold firm because like it or not there simply are not many lady drivers out there what ever way you look at it mores the pity. As a father of two daughters I can guarantee neither of them would be remotely interested in car preparation. I'm sure if I said I would prepare a car for them and get it to the track and of course pay the entry fees etc they would have a go!

I also don't agree that many men treat lady drivers as a joke, quite the opposite in my experience and all the guys at clubs I have raced with have always been both helpful and encourging to any girls that come in and want to race and I'm sure Celia would agree everyone took her seriously and treated her respectively at the Classic Touring Car Racing Club. As for beating the men thats great and also begs the question, why do you need a ladies only race.? Oh BTW a lady driver won the CTCRC organised Vtec challenge this year!

BTW I have no strong feelings either way whether the ladies have a race on there own if thats really what you want to do.

[suebmick]

Originally Posted by Al Weyman

why do you need a ladies only race.?

To set a new British record

[midgetman]

Bloody hell, what stupid and pig headed comments by members of my gender! I'm appalled. If 28 people - be they male, female, black, white, disabled, fat, thin or anything else that binds them together as a group - want to race together what the hell is it to do with you as long as they comply with the rules and pay their way? And if it raises awareness of a cause they support then all well and good. What's the difference between this and the Victor Meldrew which is only for old guys?

At our local kart club recently we had a race for parents, most of whom were well off the pace and everyone had a really good time, raising awareness that the sport isn't just for kids. No-one felt patronised because it was a race set aside for parents who on the whole wouldn't be quick enough for the main event of the day. Oh and the race was won by a chapess called Sally who would definitely break your ba....er, delicate bits...for the comments here. She's a regular TKM Extreme racer and won after a titanic battle with one of the dads.

I have quite a few friends who are disappointed that their sons are not interested in motor sport, it's not a girl thing. And women like Monisha Kaltenborn of Sauber, Claire Williams and Leena Garde of Audi would be horrified to read your comments. There are many young women in senior motor sport engineering positions and many more on engineering courses to follow them through.

Aaaand breathe!

[Al Weyman]

Calm down dear it's only a motor race. As I said I don't care less but was trying to comment why so few girls are participating also you say you don't care who races with who but I bet it would kick off if a male only race was organised and that's the point others were trying to make. As for the Victor Meldrew now no longer I never saw any bar to anyone entering.

[midgetman]

The motor race was fine. It's the comments on here that made my blood boil.

[BertMk2]

Originally Posted by midgetman

Bloody hell, what stupid and pig headed comments by members of my gender! I'm appalled. If 28 people - be they male, female, black, white, disabled, fat, thin or anything else that binds them together as a group - want to race together what the hell is it to do with you as long as they comply with the rules and pay their way?

Hmm, championing inclusiveness and equality is now "stupid and pig headed". Interesting viewpoint I'm just surprised that they felt it was a good idea to actively segregate themselves - as has been mentioned motorsport is one place where men and women can compete equally - so to go and seperate themselves out seems like a huge retrograde step. From a spectator point of view I don't really care who's driving as long as the cars are interesting and the racing good.

Originally Posted by midgetman

And women like Monisha Kaltenborn of Sauber, Claire Williams and Leena Garde of Audi would be horrified to read your comments.

Why? Nobody is saying women shouldn't be in motorsport - Al is just saying that less women are interested. I don't think that's contentious is it? Those women that are interested are able to compete on a level playing field (without needing women only events) and can clearly (as your examples show) make it to the top without any special dispensation.

Originally Posted by midgetman

There are many young women in senior motor sport engineering positions and many more on engineering courses to follow them through.

Good. But again - they're doing it off their own back because they're interested - the same reason blokes do it. Nobody here is saying that women shouldn't be involved in motorsport - the more the merrier as far as I'm concerned.

[Celia Stevens]

Thank-you midgetman, for your utterly sensible and down to earth reply! I am gobsmacked at some of the comments I have read. We don't want to 'segregate' ourselves that is obvious and as Sue rightly said once we are out there on the track half the time no-one knows whether we are male, female or otherwise and no-one cares, just go for it! This was an occasion to create a record and have some fun. BIG DEAL!
Perhaps there wasn't enough publicity beforehand, that can be rectified next year (if public opinion allows us to race?!) For that I am sorry. On the other hand if there had been would there have been a petition to stop us?
Thank-you Al for at least acknowledging that some of us spanner. Has anyone done a poll of male racers to see how many of them actually spanner? Does anyone care? Alright I know that most do but so do we. Also yes Al I used to have a fantastic time racing with the CTCRC and was treated as just another driver.
I can't believe I am writing all this in defence of an harmless activity that most people I know applauded. Shan't say any more. See you all out there sometime.