[Team] Team Lotus to confirm name and Renault bits but Grp Lotus start Norfolk Civil War?

[Ralf's Girl]

Originally Posted by medius

Proton seem to have woken up to the potential of using the Lotus name in motorsport with a Le Mans program: http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/87050

Strange that they've only decided that motorsport is a good idea now that someone has brought the Lotus name back into F1...

[mountainstar]

Originally Posted by Ralf's Girl

Strange that they've only decided that motorsport is a good idea now that someone has brought the Lotus name back into F1...

Agreed. They had rejected many proposals over the years for F1 and Le Mans type involvement.

[Matador]

Originally Posted by Ralf's Girl

Strange that they've only decided that motorsport is a good idea now that someone has brought the Lotus name back into F1...

Don't even try it.

http://www.autoblog.com/2009/10/20/t...mans-gt-and-i/

http://www.autoblog.com/2009/10/31/l...o-berro-as-ne/

[Ralf's Girl]

I'm not sure I understand your point.

[I Rosputnik]

If life was simple, and I was Proton, I would buy out Lotus F1, to save myself going through the courts and everything.

[Ralf's Girl]

I'd be surprised if Tony Fernandes was interested in selling.

[jab]

Originally Posted by Fox89

This is going to get awfully confusing! With Team Lotus running in F1, Lotus Racing running in GP2 and other series but not with any affiliation to Team Lotus, which will probably be running a very similar livery.

Not quite. Lotus Racing will not exist after this year. You'll have Team Lotus (Fernandes - Team Air Asia in GP2) and Lotus Motorsport (part of Group Lotus - backing ART Grand Prix, which will stay known as ART Grand Prix but with title sponsorship from Group Lotus)

I'm not at all surprised by the Le Mans attack, but the scale is interesting - they'll have 3 versions of the Evora in endurance racing and another GT2 on top of that as well as the LMP2. That's a lot of cars

[davyboy]

There's a bit of head bashing going on here. Tony Fernandes is seen as a bit of an upstart in Malaysia and Proton are out to make trouble for him. There's more to this than meets the eye.

[jab]

Originally Posted by davyboy

There's a bit of head bashing going on here. Tony Fernandes is seen as a bit of an upstart in Malaysia and Proton are out to make trouble for him. There's more to this than meets the eye.

In automotive circles, maybe. But generally in Malaysia, he is a very powerful man, more powerful than Bahar. He has a very good relationship with the ex-PM Dr Mahathir, who pulls all the strings in Malaysia these days

[Wims]

Lotus is actually named 1Malaysia f1 team. I think that says enough about who has the most power in Malaysia. I believe the 1Malaysia concept was "invented" by the Malaysian prime minister

[davyboy]

Originally Posted by jab

In automotive circles, maybe. But generally in Malaysia, he is a very powerful man, more powerful than Bahar. He has a very good relationship with the ex-PM Dr Mahathir, who pulls all the strings in Malaysia these days

Thanks for the clarification... yes in automotive circles there I meant. You're absolutely right that he's an extremely powerful person in Malaysia itself.

[P38 in workshop]

The lawyers will prosper,even if nobody else does.Where is the money for this plethora of Lotus racing cars coming from?

[NaBUru38]

"Norfolk Civil War" sounds impressive. What number does this have? (In Roman numbers, of course.)

[TrapezeArtist]

The company structures of Lotus was always complicated. When I worked there 30 years ago (my God! ) I never understood the finer detail but what was clear was that the road car company was a public limited company and Team was the personal property of Colin Chapman.

The plc nearly went to Toyota, then did go to GM before ending up with Proton. After ACBC's death, it would appear that Team Lotus (the name and perhaps the company, but not the actual physical team) passed into the hands of David Hunt, and now apparently he has sold to Tony Fernandes.

It therefore follows that both entities are in possession of a part of the legacy of the Lotus name. Perhaps Group Lotus has a stronger position because they have been trading as Lotus on a continuous basis. On the other hand, if Clive and Hazel give Tony Fernandes their blessing, that's good enough for me.

Therefore we find ourselves with two Lotuses in motor racing. They can each gain from the existence of the other if they are minded to do so. Or they can squabble like a couple of kids in the playground.

[andy_b]

Originally Posted by davyboy

There's a bit of head bashing going on here. Tony Fernandes is seen as a bit of an upstart in Malaysia and Proton are out to make trouble for him. There's more to this than meets the eye.

that depends on who you ask...... Fernandez has transformed Air Asia from a joke to a powerful airline in no time. Meanwhile, Proton has just sat on Lotus for years and their own cars still cant compare to Japan or Korea.

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by mountainstar

There was no money that changed hands in that deal, only technical support with 3 Lotus engineers and some B2B dealing to try to get Lotus to buy Cosworth stuff.

I thouht that might be the case. I was wondering if this might affect sponsorship/branding?

[davyboy]

Originally Posted by andy_b

that depends on who you ask...... Fernandez has transformed Air Asia from a joke to a powerful airline in no time. Meanwhile, Proton has just sat on Lotus for years and their own cars still cant compare to Japan or Korea.

Yes totally... I clarified what I said a couple of posts later.

[Asa]

I think Group Lotus/Proton was thinking of taking full ownership/control of the team to build Lotus Cars' brand image, as well as integrating the F1 team into the entire Lotus motorsport package. Then Tony Fernandes saw thru that and bought Team Lotus so that Proton must buy him out now.

[duke_toaster]

Or Fernandes buy out Group Lotus ...

[KA]

Originally Posted by P38 in workshop

The lawyers will prosper,even if nobody else does.Where is the money for this plethora of Lotus racing cars coming from?

I suspect it's more about selling cars to customers than running factory teams- they're talking about the Evora for GT3/GT4, that's firmly 'gentleman driver' territory, and the Le Mans project is currently being discussed over on the GT & Sportscar part of 'tenths- with the consensus so far being that if they're going LMP2, then it must be another customer programme, because the ACO doesn't want factories in LMP2...

If that's the case, then what they're spending should be offset to some degree by income from selling cars and parts to customers

If they're talking about GP2 & GP3 with ART, then could that be just a technical support and branding deal, with the actual budget coming from external sponsors?

[Matador]

Originally Posted by Ralf's Girl

I'm not sure I understand your point.

They have been focusing on returning to Motorsport way before this farce came to be.

[ASCII Man]

What "farce"?

[Ralf's Girl]

Originally Posted by MatadorRacing_F1

They have been focusing on returning to Motorsport way before this farce came to be.

I'm not seeing the "farce" here. And the links you posted were dated AFTER Lotus Racing had been announced as an entrant in F1 this season, so I still don't see your point either.

[bella]

Originally Posted by MatadorRacing_F1

They have been focusing on returning to Motorsport way before this farce came to be.

you're not from litespeed are you? because there's noone else who could possibly be bitter or displeased at how fernandes and his team have approached f1...

[E.B]

I find it quite ironic that it has got to all this level of nonsense and lawyer benefitting talk..... given that Lotus Cars owner Proton is at least something in the region of half owned by the Malaysian Government, and indeed the Proton name is based on ' Perusahaan Otomobil Nasiona' which translated literally means National Auto Enterprise....

And in the other corner we have the Team Lotus (F1 team), officially known as 1Malaysia F1 Team, backed and owned by a consortium of Malay businesses, the whole effort endorsed and officially supported by the Malaysian Government.