[LM24] Pescarolo Sport future plans...?!?!

[Dead-Eye]

Originally Posted by gwyllion

http://www.lemainelibre.fr/actualite...-05-2012-34526 contains similar information.

That's what DSC was quoting

[skycafe]

Originally Posted by alexkiller8

(Dome financed the spa race and will finance the le mans race)

Thanks, I had thought I remembered hearing and understanding that.

But, is there a Business Manager in the team, other then Henri? Someone working on contracts and payments and developing new avenues of finance?

[gwyllion]

According to http://endurance-info.com/version2/f...217470#p217470 the shakedown of the Pescarolo 03 will take place tomorrow at the Châteauroux airport.

[gwyllion]

Henri continues to have a strong opinion regarding diesel technology.

First with Pescarolo Sport, and now Pescarolo Team, you have a team which demonstrates itself in big challenges ...

"It's another adventure. A bit like a football player who after his playing career becomes coach, I created a tream. It lasts since 2000, which is already longer than Matra. But for us, a small team, finding budgets is an ordeal. Even Peugeot, a beautiful team, abandoned for economic reasons.
However, at the 24 hours with our "small" team, we were three times on the podium in 2005, 2006 and 2007. But a rule change introduced the diesel engine in the competition, and this is one of the most sensational scandals that I know in racing. Only large manufacturers can manufacture diesel engines, which condemns the private teams.
It's a bit like if in football, Lyon, Bordeaux and Marseille obtained that the goals of their opponents are wider! A diesel engine develops between 140 and 180 hp more than our gasoline engines. The consequences are lethal, whereas before we were absolutely fighting against the Audis."

source: http://www.lanouvellerepublique.fr/T...enri-Pescarolo

[TF110]

150hp more than gasoline engines? I think that's a bit high. But I get what he's saying. The diesel engine is probably very hard for a privateer and he wants that in consideration. I wonder what will be done about this, if anything.

[CTD]

Originally Posted by TF110

150hp more than gasoline engines? I think that's a bit high. But I get what he's saying. The diesel engine is probably very hard for a privateer and he wants that in consideration. I wonder what will be done about this, if anything.

150 might not be wrong with the Judd compared to the Audi.
But, Henri's has always been good to make his points clear

[MulsanneMike]

Originally Posted by CTD

150 might not be wrong with the Judd compared to the Audi.
But, Henri's has always been good to make his points clear

Looks like I might have to do another HP extrapolation from speed trap numbers...

[gwyllion]

The V12 HDI engine supposedly made more than 800 hp at one stage. Whereas the privateer petrol engines only produced 640 hp.

[alexkiller8]

in 2006 pescarolo reported that the audi v12 tdi was running with at least 700hp, while their judd with 640hp; even if in his open letter the problem in his opinion was more about the better acceleration that diesel car have becuse of much more torque, than the power output; infact he suggested lighter min. weight for petrol cars.
Only the dbr9 engine in 2009 was powerfull more than 670hp, but the power decreased in 2010 because coupè cars had shorted restrictors.
As gwyllion said, more than a rumor reported that at le mans 2010 the V12 of 908 HDi was set to develope something like 800hp and more than 1300Nm as torque peak.
In my opinion audi engine with 2012 restrictions doesn't develope so much more power than a petrol engine... i guess that the honda and toyota engine with a higher revlimit for qualifying can develope the same power or something more (not the same torque obiouvsly).

Could mulsannemike tell us according to his calculation what was the power output of le mans 2011 engines used by lmp1 cars?

[TF110]

I think Toyota are playing it coy as well. Saying they are down on power. Maybe they are speaking of their Rebellion powerplant. Maybe the diesels are stronger in terms of HP, but what really kills the petrol engines is the torque output. You have to wonder if someone like Pescarolo had a diesel engine in his car, would they win LeMans? 4 seconds a lap at Spa is definitely speaking volumes, but is it really because it's Audi and not because of the engine? Not to say Lola chassis' are no good, but it's been a long time since the last manufacturer challenged LeMans without diesel. I just hope there isn't any politics going on by Toyota when they enter. If they are capable of equaling Audi's time, they should do it. If they don't do it, are they really speaking towards the equivalency or are they sandbagging for better ruling towards non-diesels? It's a weird game I hope isn't played.

[alexkiller8]

as i said one week ago, if audi and peugeot in 2007-2011 era used NA/turbo petrol engine instead than diesel, it wouldn't changed a thing... they kept however on dominating because had the best cars, the best updates, the best drivers and the best teams.

[MulsanneMike]

Originally Posted by alexkiller8

in 2006 pescarolo reported that the audi v12 tdi was running with at least 700hp, while their judd with 640hp; even if in his open letter the problem in his opinion was more about the better acceleration that diesel car have becuse of much more torque, than the power output; infact he suggested lighter min. weight for petrol cars.
Only the dbr9 engine in 2009 was powerfull more than 670hp, but the power decreased in 2010 because coupè cars had shorted restrictors.
As gwyllion said, more than a rumor reported that at le mans 2010 the V12 of 908 HDi was set to develope something like 800hp and more than 1300Nm as torque peak.
In my opinion audi engine with 2012 restrictions doesn't develope so much more power than a petrol engine... i guess that the honda and toyota engine with a higher revlimit for qualifying can develope the same power or something more (not the same torque obiouvsly).

Could mulsannemike tell us according to his calculation what was the power output of le mans 2011 engines used by lmp1 cars?

If memory serves me, a shade over 600 hp, 610+ hp. I'm highly skeptical over claims of 150+.

[gwyllion]

Originally Posted by MulsanneMike

If memory serves me, a shade over 600 hp, 610+ hp. I'm highly skeptical over claims of 150+.

I assume that the 150 hp difference that Henri is referring to, dates from 5.5 liter diesel era. For instance in 2008 Peugeot did 3:18.5 in qualifying and 3:19.4 in the race and hit a top speed of 350 km/h.

[Pandamasque]

Does torque not count at all? I think it's safe to assume that the diesels even now have like 150-200% of petrol engine's torque. Their advantage in acceleration over P1-petrol still looks bigger than P1-petrol over P2.

[alexkiller8]

but actual NA petrol engine have almost a double higher revlimit, that in theory should let them to have more power than diesel cars.
The only way for a petrol cars to have a little comparable torque is to use turbo engines, not the best choice for endurance races if we talk about reliability (the amr 2.0 engine in their best expectations had to develope something like 600Nm).

[joeb]

Originally Posted by Pandamasque

Does torque not count at all? I think it's safe to assume that the diesels even now have like 150-200% of petrol engine's torque. Their advantage in acceleration over P1-petrol still looks bigger than P1-petrol over P2.

Audi recently said in a press release about their gearbox has to handle the 850Nm of torque from their current tdi.

[alexkiller8]

beyond old diesel/petrol question, is there some new or pic of the shakedown of the 03?

[gustavobamba]

There weren´t any shakedown today

I´m starting to feel that bad news are coming...

[gwyllion]

The rumor that the shakedown would be today, was never confirmed. Too early to start worrying I would say.

[courageous]

Maybe Pescarolo would have more of a chance if Henri spent more time concentrating on the financial side of his team rather than complaining to anyone who will listen that it isn't fair for a 5+ year old car run by a privateer team to be off the pace.

Even according to Henri's account, this is twice he has started spending money before the cheque cleared - it is hard to argue against "fool me once shame on you, fool me twice fool on me"

[CTD]

Originally Posted by courageous

Even according to Henri's account, this is twice he has started spending money before the cheque cleared - that is the behaviour of a simple idiot (fool me once... etc)

That's how business works.
Actually the whole western world spins on money we don't have.
You don't save up to buy a House, you buy a house, and then pays for it.

[courageous]

would you take a 120% mortgage only 1 year after your last house was reposessed?

[skycafe]

Originally Posted by courageous

Maybe Pescarolo would have more of a chance if Henri spent more time concentrating on the financial side of his team rather than complaining to anyone who will listen that it isn't fair for a 5+ year old car run by a privateer team to be off the pace.

Even according to Henri's account, this is twice he has started spending money before the cheque cleared - it is hard to argue against "fool me once shame on you, fool me twice fool on me"

That goes back to the question I have-this is a very successful private team with a very well know name. Is this 'brand' too much for someone else to invest in?

I was looking forward to seeing the completed car in photos today. I guess we will wait.

[alexkiller8]

is sad to say but if pescarolo can't afford anymore an expensive class like the lmp1, well, should think to run in lmp2 or go in the GT category (even if i don't know how much cheaper is to run in gt-pro than run a private lmp1). I repeat is sad to say, and me too would disagree about what i'm writing, but at least this choice can let them survive in the mainstream of endurance racing (WEC) waiting for a better economic situation.

[gwyllion]

According to http://www.endurance-info.com/versio...217721#p217721 Pescarolo was at the Châteauroux airport today with the Dome, but not with the 03.