IMSA: USCR 2018

[MaskedRacer]

I like Matt's case for more all GT action

http://nasportscar.com/arm-chair-rac...wants-more-gt/

Looking forward to VIR big time now. Besides if the DPI cars are so big, lets see what kind of attention they get in a race when the GT's are not there. There has yet to be a prototype only race yet in the series.

[Rcz]

I wouldn't mind if there was a "big race" for the GT class.

Not just GTLM, but GTD needs some love too. Like their own race you know. Even though PWC already fulfilled that roll.

[Matt]

I hoping eventually we get enough P cars to have split weekends at smaller tracks, twin two hour races, one for P, one for the GT cars.

[Akrapovic]

Originally Posted by Matt

I hoping eventually we get enough P cars to have split weekends at smaller tracks, twin two hour races, one for P, one for the GT cars.

That's what I'd hope for. I'd like to see Prototypes at Lime Rock Park, but not in the GT race.

[Matt]

Originally Posted by Akrapovic

That's what I'd hope for. I'd like to see Prototypes at Lime Rock Park, but not in the GT race.

Agreed 300%

[Speed-King]

Originally Posted by Matt

I hoping eventually we get enough P cars to have split weekends at smaller tracks, twin two hour races, one for P, one for the GT cars.

Just bring the P3s into the main show for the P-only races.

[Matt]

Nah.

They're not part of the main show, no need to add them for no reason.

[chernaudi]

Considering their car switch (not formally announced yet but certain to happen tomorrow) and their probable sponsorship woes, could VFR/SOD be in IMSA next year? And if so, in what form?

[Akrapovic]

Originally Posted by Speed-King

Just bring the P3s into the main show for the P-only races.

What is the Prototype Challenge format? Do they do fuel stops and driver changes? If not, it becomes very expensive for a couple of races.

You'd need to get them used to running on a circuit with the big prototypes too.

[Maelochs]

Originally Posted by Akrapovic

What is the Prototype Challenge format? Do they do fuel stops and driver changes? If not, it becomes very expensive for a couple of races.

You'd need to get them used to running on a circuit with the big prototypes too.

Sprint races, no stops ... they do run with the old Prototype Lites cars this year, so they have some idea about differently paced traffic.

Your point about refueling and pt crews (and the associated and very large costs) is the most telling, though.

[Speed-King]

Well, Jacques Nicolet seems to think that Prototype Challenge should switch to an endurance format to attract more teams:

« Il faut des championnats d’endurance. La LM P3 est taillée pour cela. Les équipes doivent faire rouler les autos le plus possible. On le voit dans le championnat IMSA où les gentlemen restent sur leur faim sur le temps de roulage. C’est ce qui peut être un frein au développement de la catégorie sur le continent américain. On a plus de la moitié des autos qui roulent aux US uniquement en ‘track days’. Les choses se mettent en place et l’IMSA est Ã* l’écoute. J’espère qu’on verra une course de 3 Ã* 4 heures même s’il ne faut pas s’attendre Ã* voir des LM P3 aux 24 Heures de Daytona Ã* court terme. »

Quick and dirty translation:

We need endurance series [rather than sprint series]. That's what the LMP3s are built for. The teams must get the cars on track as long as possible. One can see that in the IMSA [P3] series where the gentlemen stay among themselves for the full duration of the race. This is perhaps a break on the development of the category on the American continent. More than half of [our] cars that run in the US run only at track days. But things are coming together and IMSA is listening. I hope that we'll see races of 3 or 4 hours, though I know that we shouldn't hold our breath to see the LMP3s at the 24h of Daytona anytime soon.

Full interview

[Maelochs]

Pirelli World Challenge went through this same thing ... and they make a Lot more money than IMSA P3 does. They ahve a few specific races for teams that choose to participate--60-minute races without refueling and tire changes.

The cost isn't just fuel rigs, fire extinguishers, air hoses, wheel guns, extra tires (at a few thousand per set)... it is the cost of recruiting, hiring, training, transporting, and lodging the extra crew for each race.

The biggest cost of racing (there was an excellent breakdown on the cost of racing on a site run by (I believe) Murphy the Bear) is hauling stuff and lodging crew. Even four more guys (refueler, fire bottle, two tire changers) is another two hotel rooms, food (or pay them enough to buy their own,) and probably another vehicle which has to drive from race to race (and the fuel for every mile, and the insurance and the maintenance .... .)

Then there is time to train, time to practice .... A lot of P3 "teams" are older guys who race for fun, who own cars or buy seat time, or young drivers trying to make their names and futures. Vastly increase the cost of racing for a minimal increase in seat time (The PWC SprintX races can swap drivers so you get two pay drivers ... but each only gets half a race) and suddenly the class doesn't look so appealing.

ELMS does it---and it works well. But then, Europe supports a lot more road racing than the U.S. possibly because a Lot of U.S. racing money goes into various oval-racing formats. Teams which in Europe see P3 as a great way to race, see ARCA (for instance) as a better alternative in the U.S.

Jacques Nicolet thinks more P3s should be racing more miles everywhere ... it is almost as if he had some financial interest in that happening .....

[skycafe]

Originally Posted by Maelochs

The biggest cost of racing (there was an excellent breakdown on the cost of racing on a site run by (I believe) Murphy the Bear) is hauling stuff and lodging crew.

You are correct, it was Murphy the Bear.

[MaskedRacer]

Originally Posted by Matt

I hoping eventually we get enough P cars to have split weekends at smaller tracks, twin two hour races, one for P, one for the GT cars.

John Dagys and Ryan M voiced their support for more GT only races in their podcast.

[gert]

Originally Posted by Speed-King

Well, Jacques Nicolet seems to think that Prototype Challenge should switch to an endurance format to attract more teams

Well, Jacques Nicolet seems to think that Prototype Challenge should switch to an endurance format to enable him to sell more cars
Probably one of only a very few things he and Hughes De Chaunac would agree on.

[Akrapovic]

I'm not sure switching to an endurance format would sell more cars though. It'd create extra costs, so not sure who that'd attract?

[chernaudi]

GT3 was originally a sprint format, but now GT3 cars run endurance races seemingly anywhere you look.

It depends on what the market wants and will support.

Of course, that's why you see so many national or regional series in racing vs a few true international series. The expense isn't just hiring extra people and paying them, it's more moving people around and providing/pay for room and board. A lot easier and more affordable to do that in a national or regional series than an international series.

International series also have longer races or longer race weekends. The ACO's rules for the WEC currently don't allow anything less than a 6 hour race except in cases of force majure (bad weather, some disaster or difficulty that requires a race to be shortened, etc). If you're gonna spend a crapload of money to move people around in an international series, either the races will be longer or you have a longer race weekend to make it worth the trouble.

[Matt]

45min is long enough to be watching the PC series, imo.

[MaskedRacer]

Maybe some of that huge Toyota budget can be moved away from the dying LMP1 and fund a Lexus GTLM program! Just put some Michelin, tires, run all pro drivers (lose Robert Alon), remove some of the GTD mandated BoP, and that Lexus will not have much left to be right up there in GTLM speed range.

With BMW being GTE compliant now, there is room for a team/manufacturer for IMSA to give a special GTLM class waiver for. Either Lexus or Acura should jump on this. I would love the later to happen too, so Shank can keep a factory effort running. His driver squad for the #93 is already solid and would be competitive in GTD. The #86 might need an upgrade though.

[TF110]

Originally Posted by MaskedRacer

Maybe some of that huge Toyota budget can be moved away from the dying LMP1 and fund a Lexus GTLM program! Just put some Michelin, tires, run all pro drivers (lose Robert Alon), remove some of the GTD mandated BoP, and that Lexus will not have much left to be right up there in GTLM speed range.

With BMW being GTE compliant now, there is room for a team/manufacturer for IMSA to give a special GTLM class waiver for. Either Lexus or Acura should jump on this. I would love the later to happen too, so Shank can keep a factory effort running. His driver squad for the #93 is already solid and would be competitive in GTD. The #86 might need an upgrade though.

The RC F is probably too heavy. I think it doesn't go much below 1280kg. If they were to do GTE, it should be with the LC, maybe the LC F if they make it. The lmp1 budget is pretty low in comparison to what they use in Nascar! Besides, I think TRD U.S. would probably handle that (if it's IMSA).

[chernaudi]

JDC will run two cars next season, and may also do LM:

http://sportscar365.com/imsa/iwsc/jd...fort-for-2018/

[Kimi7]

Originally Posted by chernaudi

JDC will run two cars next season, and may also do LM:

http://sportscar365.com/imsa/iwsc/jd...fort-for-2018/

Pretty good day for IMSA given this and the Mid-Ohio announcement. Would expect there to be at least 14 full-time protos next year.

[broadrun96]

Originally Posted by chernaudi

JDC are looking torun two cars next season, and may also do LM:

http://sportscar365.com/imsa/iwsc/jd...fort-for-2018/

As usual, depending on the cash they get so a hard possible at best.

[Maelochs]

Marshall Pruett tweeted that IMSA would be returning to Mid-Ohio next season.

Shank in an NSX in GTLM, Rocketsport in a Lexus in GTLM, two flying bananas, and Mid-Ohio?

People might think i am being overly optimistic but remember ... Scott Atherton hasn't talked about any of this stuff, so it still could happen.

[broadrun96]

Originally Posted by Maelochs

Marshall Pruett tweeted that IMSA would be returning to Mid-Ohio next season.

Shank in an NSX in GTLM, Rocketsport in a Lexus in GTLM, two flying bananas, and Mid-Ohio?

People might think i am being overly optimistic but remember ... Scott Atherton hasn't talked about any of this stuff, so it still could happen.

Have either even moved toward a GTLM car? I figure HPD and JAS will have their hands full supporting the GT3 programs, building a GTLM car on top of that seems like a big ask. And the Lexus seems to be a poor car for GTLM, everything I've heard indicates it's overweight for GT3. Course I thought they'd build their GT3 off the LC not the RCF but it's their money. Maybe a GTLM LC then?