WTCC vs BTCC - Brands Hatch benchmarking

Hazard · 15 Oct 2007, 18:48 (Ref:2040988)

We've always wondered how the BTCC cars & drivers would do compared to their WTCC counterparts. The performances of drivers like Yvan Muller and Thompson in the WTCC has been the closest thing to a recent indicator we've had.

However, with Colin Turkington's recent cross over to the WTCC for Brands Hatch, I've taken his lap time for pole and used that as a weighting against his 3rd place in the WTCC meeting at the GP circuit, and taken the entire WTCC cars times for a comparison.

So, with Colin as the benchmark - here's a hypothetical grid for Brands Hatch Indy with the WTCC and BTCC cars based on the BTCC's second event there, and the WTCC's sole event this year.

Pos	Driver	Series	Car	Time	Gap
1	Alain Menu	WTCC	Chevrolet Lacetti	0:49.412	0:00.000
2	James Thompson	WTCC	Alfa Romeo	0:49.419	0:00.007
3	Colin Turkington	BTCC	BMW 320si E90	0:49.446	0:00.034
4	Darren Turner	BTCC	SEAT Leon	0:49.448	0:00.036
5	Tiago Monteiro	WTCC	SEAT Leon	0:49.510	0:00.098
6	Yvan Muller	WTCC	SEAT Leon TDI	0:49.538	0:00.126
7	Pierre-Yves Corthals	WTCC	SEAT Leon	0:49.556	0:00.144
8	Jorg Muller	WTCC	BMW 320si	0:49.560	0:00.148
9	Jordi Gene	WTCC	SEAT Leon TDI	0:49.590	0:00.178
10	Robert Huff	WTCC	Chevrolet Lacetti	0:49.619	0:00.207
11	Jason Plato	BTCC	SEAT Leon	0:49.628	0:00.216
12	Andy Priaulx	WTCC	BMW 320si	0:49.634	0:00.222
13	Gabriele Tarquini	WTCC	SEAT Leon	0:49.640	0:00.228
14	Felix Porteiro	WTCC	BMW 320si	0:49.646	0:00.234
15	Augusto Farfus	WTCC	BMW 320si	0:49.677	0:00.265
16	Tom Chilton	BTCC	Vauxhall Vectra	0:49.684	0:00.272
17	Fabrizio Giovanardi	BTCC	Vauxhall Vectra	0:49.706	0:00.294
18	Nicola Larini	WTCC	Chevrolet Lacetti	0:49.724	0:00.312
19	Mat Jackson	BTCC	BMW 320si E90	0:49.739	0:00.327
20	Alessandro Zanardi	WTCC	BMW 320si	0:49.782	0:00.370
21	Tom Coronel	WTCC	SEAT Leon	0:49.783	0:00.371
22	Gordon Shedden	BTCC	Honda Civic	0:49.806	0:00.394
23	Tom Onslow-Cole	BTCC	BMW 320si E90	0:49.816	0:00.404
24	Matt Neal	BTCC	Honda Civic	0:49.850	0:00.438
25	Mike Jordan	BTCC	Honda Integra	0:49.857	0:00.445
26	Roberto Colciago	WTCC	SEAT Leon	0:49.874	0:00.462
27	Massimiliano Pedala	WTCC	SEAT Leon	0:49.919	0:00.507
28	Stefano D'Aste	WTCC	BMW 320si	0:49.951	0:00.539
29	Adam Jones	BTCC	SEAT Toledo	0:50.005	0:00.593
30	Gavin Smith	BTCC	SEAT Leon	0:50.019	0:00.607
31	Michel Jourdain	WTCC	SEAT Leon	0:50.089	0:00.677
32	Olivier Tielemans	WTCC	Alfa Romeo	0:50.106	0:00.694
33	Luca Rangoni	WTCC	BMW 320si	0:50.145	0:00.733
34	Tom Ferrier	BTCC	SEAT Toledo Cupra	0:50.167	0:00.755
35	Matt Allison	BTCC	SEAT Toledo Cupra	0:50.205	0:00.793
36	Jason Hughes	BTCC	MG ZS	0:50.262	0:00.850
37	Eoin Murray	BTCC	Alfa Romeo 156	0:50.267	0:00.855
38	Sergio Hernandez	WTCC	BMW 320si	0:50.296	0:00.884
39	Maurizio Ceresoli	WTCC	SEAT Leon	0:50.334	0:00.922
40	Dave Pinkney	BTCC	Alfa Romeo 156	0:50.577	0:01.165
41	John George	BTCC	Honda Integra	0:50.774	0:01.362
42	Richard Marsh	BTCC	Alfa Romeo 156	0:50.856	0:01.444
43	Erkut Kizilirmak	BTCC	Vauxhall Astra Sport Hatch	0:50.876	0:01.464
44	Fiona Leggate	BTCC	MG ZS	0:51.180	0:01.768
45	Sergey Krylov	WTCC	SEAT Leon	0:51.373	0:01.961
46	Martyn Bell	BTCC	BMW 320i E46	0:51.395	0:01.983
47	Rick Kerry	BTCC	BMW 120D	0:52.034	0:02.622

**FIRE** · 15 Oct 2007, 19:32 (Ref:2041025)

NASCAR grid size!

duke_toaster · 15 Oct 2007, 19:36 (Ref:2041027)

It looks a bit disproportionate ... if a end-of-front-pack BTCC runner could come third, I imagine Gio or Plato would be WTCC winners. Take in to account the tyres issues and stuff...

Also Brands GP has fundamentally different characteristics over a lap than Brands Indy. GP has some longish straights and fast corners, Indy is a short and hilly beast.

Hazard · 15 Oct 2007, 19:39 (Ref:2041029)

Hehe, would be great.

Things I find interesting...

Krylov would have outqualified Bell & Kerry

Darren Turner would have been the fastest SEAT

Vauxhall would still have been in the mix, fighting with Farfus, Larini & the ROAL BMW's (bearing in mind they had a poor Brands qually)

Generally though, most WTCC cars outperform the top BTCC ones - the BTCC top teams (Halfords, TOC) ending up in the middle of the pack.

Ceresoli would beat Marsh, Pinkney, George & Leggate.

The BTCC GR Asia drivers (Smith & Jones < hah! why have I not noticed that before!!!) would beat Michel Jourdain's works SEAT.

redshoes · 15 Oct 2007, 20:05 (Ref:2041056)

Tyres would be a major factor here. Even without the different make/construction, WTCC allow tyre warmers so I would always expect them to be faster in qualifying.

Ballast is another issue. All the top WTCC SEATs were on max ballast, as was Plato in BTCC so no surprise Turner came out on top

Phoenix1 · 15 Oct 2007, 20:11 (Ref:2041068)

My thoughts are that CT turned up in the BMW and came 3rd. Menu and Coronel came across and did not do very well (okay Menu had a tyre problem but Coronel is better than 12!)

Craner Curves · 16 Oct 2007, 16:27 (Ref:2041928)

Doesn't surprise me that Turner is quickest SEAT. He's a qualifying lap specialist.

Robin_D · 16 Oct 2007, 17:58 (Ref:2042033)

How is this being worked out? As the WTCC raced on the GP loop and the BTCC on the Indy.

Hazard · 16 Oct 2007, 18:33 (Ref:2042063)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robin_D

How is this being worked out? As the WTCC raced on the GP loop and the BTCC on the Indy.

Like I said - grabbed Turkington's time at Brands Hatch Indy (pole) and his 3rd place time from the WTCC GP event, and used the difference factor against all the WTCC cars.

It's far from perfect, as it's one race, and as mentioned, weight penalties, only one circuit (where some cars may be better than others etc.), but gives a rough comparison.

Robin_D · 16 Oct 2007, 19:15 (Ref:2042103)

To me, the method that you have come up with is as precise as carving meat with a hammer. lol.

I like the creativity though.

Will it work next season when both cars are on the GP circuit?

redshoes · 16 Oct 2007, 19:27 (Ref:2042113)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robin_D

Will it work next season when both cars are on the GP circuit?

No, because you will never over the tyre/ballast differences. And as the WTCC meeting will clash with a BTCC round, you won't get anyone competing at both to get a direct comparison.

Hazard · 16 Oct 2007, 21:16 (Ref:2042216)

Well - yeah, I mean, it's kinda for fun really.

To be honest, I'm more hoping some BTCC peeps will be shamed into joining the WTCC round for next year

If they did have Darren Turner, he'd have been eligible points and would have scored more interference for Muller!

Marc27 · 9 Nov 2007, 18:24 (Ref:2063955)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hazard

To be honest, I'm more hoping some BTCC peeps will be shamed into joining the WTCC round for next year

They'll have a job, the BTCC is racing elsewhere on the same weekend that the WTCC is at Brands. I still keep hoping one of the series will move their date but no luck so far

SEATFreak · 16 Nov 2007, 11:10 (Ref:2068777)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hazard

To be honest, I'm more hoping some BTCC peeps will be shamed into joining the WTCC round for next year

In what way "shamed"?

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