Historic Sports Sedan Register

[Robert Ryan]

I have been getting enquiries from Allen Brown who runs the Oldracingcar site in the UK, when I mentioned that many of the F5000's that "vanished" had been morphed into Sports Sedans...well their parts have anyway.

[johnh875]

Camaroz, in the MRA article it said the Imp was rolled (back straight at Sandown) and destroyed.

[Group'C']

Rob Davies did infact have a Corolla in Castrol colours,present status unknow.
Rob then had the Escort which was ex Garry Rogers car which he purchased of Tony Watts from Hobart, Garry told me recntly that he was informed the car had gone to the tip, and all the running gear went into a road car.

Robbie mills shovel nose Corona :- Robbie sold it to Dave McGuinnes who still ran the Holden 6 in it. It then went to Wayne Gaffeny, he had Lew Bush rebuild the car(didn't have much running gear in it) and fit a Rotary. ran a few race meetings until it was written of at the Hairpin at Symmons Plains,the car was then scraped and is now land fill.

Did Larry Kogge's R100 end up as his RX3, if so ended up in Tassie and was owned by John Mitchell, got crashed and then rebodied, unsure of current status

[Steve Holmes]

Originally posted by truckie
The facts are the X Richards Falcon is not the original car that was built as it has been *******ised.

I kind of agree with Camaroz. The bodyshell/chassis of any racecar has to be considered The Car, regardless of what has been taken out/changed etc in the intervening years. How many sports sedans remain unmolested since they fist appeared? For that matter, how many even have their original engines?

Paul Faheys 'Cologne' Capri had its quad-cam V6 replaced by a Chevy V8 by Inky Tulloch when he aquired the car. The V6 ended up in a Mazda RX7 rallycar, raced by Graham Barker. But you have to say the car Inky was racing was the Fahey Cologne Capri, regardless of what was propelling the thing.

The Graham Booth car has to be considered Jims car. There's just varying degrees of exactness. However, if the Falcon bodyshell no longer remained, but all the original parts from the car were gathered up and fitted into an exact replica of the original bodyshell, could that be considered the real car?

eg, When Red Dawson had his horrific accident at Manfeild in his Chevy Monza, and apparently barrel rolled the car into a million bits, what was salvagable was built into the Monza John Briggs raced. So is that the Dawson car? When Jeff Barnes brought it out to NZ in the early 90s, it was labelled as the ex Daswon car.

[Steve Holmes]

Thought I should bring this thread back from the depths of oblivion.

This one probably won't have any meaning to Aussie readers, but Kiwi readers will know what I'm banging on about. I was speaking to a guy the other day who recently visited Jack Nazer. Nazer raced a very fast Chevy engined Vauxhall Victor in Sports Sedans in the 70s, appropriately named 'Miss Victorious', winning the NZ Saloon Car champs twice with it. The car was tricked out with F5000 componentry, including the brakes, and suspension, I believe. Plus the engine was suppsedly from a Can-Am car, complete with fuel injection. I'm not sute which Can-Am car it cam from, as most Can-Am teams had switched to big block power by 1968.

Anyway, rumour has it that when Nazer sold the car, the engine was later sold on, and the F5000 gear went into the restoration of an F5000. I read it was Begg FM2? Meanwhile, the bodyshell was now living out its days as a chicken house.

But according to Nazer, the car is complete, inc all suspension etc. All that's missing is an engine. But the guy who owns it won't let anyone see it, and won't talk to anyone about the car. The only person he'll deal with is Nazer. So now you know.

[Just Do It!]

That wasn't the only such NZ car that had F5000 bits in it either. Australian Muscle Car covered one earlier this year. I will have to dig it out....

[mixxer]

Saw Thommo's old Merc racing at EC on speedweek yesterday on SBS.
Is the Barnes Pontiac a sports sedan or a Trans Am ?

[Formula 5000]

I thought the same as you "mixxer". Even though the EC round was sometime ago it least it proves Thommo's Mercedes is still alive and well. The guy who has it has not spoilt it but it does not look as aerodynamic as some of the equipment in front of him. Now if we could just trace some of those V8 Capri's.

[pete55]

Barnes's car is a Sports Sedan.

[johnh875]

JDI was that the XJS Jag? Memory is a bit sketchy.

[Camaroz]

Originally posted by Group'C'

Rob Davies did infact have a Corolla in Castrol colours,present status unknow.
Rob then had the Escort which was ex Garry Rogers car which he purchased of Tony Watts from Hobart, Garry told me recntly that he was informed the car had gone to the tip, and all the running gear went into a road car.

Did Larry Kogge's R100 end up as his RX3, if so ended up in Tassie and was owned by John Mitchell, got crashed and then rebodied, unsure of current status

I have recently spoken to Tony Watts. The Rob Davies Escort was Garry Rogers original Escort (ex-Bill Fanning) and was sold to a punter in Melbourne in the mid eighties (the name Rattray rings a bell but haven't heard or seen it since about 1988 in a workshop in Collingwood.

LK's R100 was actually owned by Fred Munday and was the ex-Neville Cherry car from Tas. Larry's RX3 was the ex Grice Mazda House/Craven Mild car! Be worth finding that one!!

[Formula 5000]

As my age begins to show in my memory do I recall correctly that Bill Fanning raced this Escort with with one of Merv Waggotts twin cam 1850cc egines installed?

[Camaroz]

F5000,

You do recall correctly. Fanning did run a Waggott in the Escort. When I saw the car in (1975) in Melbourne (Altona) before Garry bought it, the Waggott engine was not assembled and needed new parts. I don't think Garry ever ran the Waggott engine? Someone will know

[Steve Holmes]

That wasn't the only such NZ car that had F5000 bits in it either. Australian Muscle Car covered one earlier this year. I will have to dig it out....

JDI, you're possibly thinking of the Graeme Addis Charger? That car used Lola F5000 suspension, brakes, and engine. Later the engine was swapped for a six litre Chevy. In the cars last phase, the Lola transaxle was used so the engine could be put behind the driver. That car also used ground effects. To the best of my knowledge, that was the only Kiwi Sports Sedan ever to do so. Did any of the Aussie cars experiment with ground effects?

In the late 70s, old F5000s were dirt cheap. There was nowhere to race them in NZ, and they were just about being given away. Australia continued on with F5000 much longer than NZ did, so the latest cars went there, but the earlier ones were often used as doner cars to make Sports Sedans.

Wayne Huxford ran a Morand built F5000 Chevy in his Capri for many years. A beautiful sounding car. I thought the Morand was from a Begg FM5, but someone who knows better may wish to correct me.

The first PDL Mustang ran McLaren M10 F5000 wheels in its later life, when it was blue.

Ian Algie, when he built his wild V8 Alfetta, used the Chaparral built Chevy from Ken Smiths Lola T332. Kiwi race goers will always remember this car. The engine sat where the driver and front passenger would have been, and Ian sat behind the engine where the back seat used to be. Spooky! The Alfa had a wheelbase of 94", and ran little 13" diameter Minilites and a rear wing that looked like it was from an aeroplane. Most of the componentry was built by Ian, and it was really a work of art. The Chaparral Chevy was replaced by an alloy Milodon V8 in 1984. That's when the car really began to honk! But Algie must have been a brave guy!

[Formula 5000]

Cameroz,

My memory and notes say that Garry Rogers had 2 Escorts and neither of them raced with a Waggott engine. He always used the Twin Cam Ford of the "BDA", "BDC" variety. We could of course ask him as he is very approachable. At his open days I have asked him about the history of his classic EH Holden.

[275 GTB-4]

Two believed to be still in VIC. The rotary hume bros//and doug byrnes old car //last owner was John Bell (a Policeman)

But what happened to the old Lakis Manticas Group C Mini which Paul Gulson sold late 60s??? Alloy panels as a sports sedan.....

[fastman]

Hi guys.help,help.Trying to find the whereabouts of one the mk2 escort sport sedans which originally raced at wanneroo in eighties.The car was originally in lhd form and was originally run with a bdg engine then replaced with a turbo rotary.It was originally in red orange and white striping with black bonnet.Driver listed on the side of the car was Mike Mettam and number nine on the side.Iknow that the car was sold to someone in the east.but i dont know who.I am trying to find out to purchase the car.I believe it to be one of 2 cars brought in from Germany.any help please Thanks Tony

[old wise one]

hi guys,
all the talk about the Kiwi sports sedans ,brings back some memories ,especially when you are also talking Escort sports sedans,Bob Homewood ,ran a space framed Escort type car that on most days was capable of beating all the Nz v8 engined cars mentioned above .pretty sure that it used ground effects,I think he is still aound in Pukekohe and the car is still in his workshop ,also he has a web site some where ,some
one will be able to tell you

[fastman]

Hi tony again tried finding photos of car in new zealand.Its not the one we are looking for.this particular car was one of two imported from Germany around 1977.It was originally run at Wanneroo raceway in perth W/A with a bdg cosworth with fuel injection.Its colour schemes were in works colours with red ,orange and white striping,with a black bonnet.Italso had shell sponsor stickers on it along with west coast plastics ,enzed and myaree auto electrics and hooper smash repairs.The engine blew up at Wanneroo and was replaced with a rotary turbo.When sold the car was still in its left h
and drive form.help tony.

[pete55]

I was talking to Jeff Barnes this morning and i asked him about the Capri Sports Sedan which i thought was run by Bruce Smith. He said he thinks it was or is owned by Phil Crompton.
Also asked him about the Monza he used to race. He said he knows who supposedly owns it and where it is but there is a bit of controversy surrounding the owner. If anybody wants to know about it PM me.

[jd yort]

While we are talking of missing Sports Sedans, does anyone know the whereabouts or ever saw the Fiat Abarth that Dick Ward ran in the early 80's in WA. From what I know it had a rotary in a Fiat 500 Abarth body shell.

Must have been an absolute blast to drive.

[DKGandBH]

I once was a Fiat 500 with a worked 12A Motor.
Sequential Gearbox. Slicks. Yellow.

Took the Fastest Time of the day at Oran Park...

DKGandBH

[Nivola]

jd yort Wardy has re built it and wants to run it in VSCC events and did a hillclimb last weekend in it.

She is one beautiful little beast!

[Camaroz]

Originally Posted by pete55

I was talking to Jeff Barnes this morning and i asked him about the Capri Sports Sedan which i thought was run by Bruce Smith. He said he thinks it was or is owned by Phil Crompton.
Also asked him about the Monza he used to race. He said he knows who supposedly owns it and where it is but there is a bit of controversy surrounding the owner. If anybody wants to know about it PM me.

Jeff's Monza has a stack of history and I heard that he was keen to get it back.

It was the ex-Red Dawson (NZ) car that John Roberts bought and put John Briggs in. Briggs then (apparently) bought the car and had K&A do the big re-vamp and Briggs ran the ASSC for a couple of years before selling it to Mike Griffin who only ran it a few times before Jeff got hold of it. The car was (reportedly) a DeKon Chassis though it's US origins prior to Red Dawson are not clear. Any one else got any info?

On the subject of Historic Sports Sedans, Frank Ure had his restored Torana Sports sedan at the Touring Car Festival at Oran park (April 24) and did demo laps and created heaps of interest. Chris Clearihan was to have the 'Edmonson Alfetta' there as well but it was not quite finished in time. Des Wall was also there and said he was restoring the ex-MHDT LH Torana Sports Sedan.

Good to see the thread back!!!

[pete55]

It would be good to see the HDT car back on track again. I guess it will be hard to get too many of the cars of that era together on one track at the same time.