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Old 7 Jun 2017, 10:26 (Ref:3739193)   #1
PS2244
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GT3 v's Supercar v's SuperTouring v's TCR - The Ultimate Thread

Hypothetically if Supercars were to acquire AGT could that open the route to SuperGT specfications?
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Old 15 Jun 2017, 09:05 (Ref:3741545)   #2
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Yeah put gt3 in the bin, supercars spend big $$$ chasing a few horsepower, that's the way forward, that's motorsport. Can't see why new/old manufacturer interest is waning, meh, probably unrelated
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Old 15 Jun 2017, 10:42 (Ref:3741555)   #3
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Yeah put gt3 in the bin, supercars spend big $$$ chasing a few horsepower, that's the way forward, that's motorsport. Can't see why new/old manufacturer interest is waning, meh, probably unrelated
Isnt that one of the key reasons why manufactuers are getting into gt4. The gt3 cars were getting too expensive as they chase HP, aero and weight. that they have now had to get into lower cost cars as they were starting to get out of the price of the common person
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Old 15 Jun 2017, 12:44 (Ref:3741587)   #4
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Gentleman drivers, was that not clear to you.
A certain Mr Van Gisbergen may disagree with you. He looks quite handy in a GT3. Wonder how he'd get on in a 'Professional' category?
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Old 15 Jun 2017, 12:51 (Ref:3741593)   #5
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But still you're saying that those engines are not used in a professional motorsport which is rubbish.

Even if the category is wholly of gentlemen racers (and it isn't as there are plenty of pros) it's still professional motorsport by definition. And by saying otherwise you're slandering the hard work of those who participate whether they be drivers, snappers, truck drivers or yes indeed hairdressers.
No doubt the work done by the teams and drivers is very professional.

Unfortunately some of the sporting regulations including minimum pit stop times and driver seedings go against this notation of professionalism.

It is very much in the spirit of splendid amateurism prevalent in the British army tank regiments of the Second World War. Apologies if this analogy is too obscure, but I can't think of another comparison.

I follow AGT and have followed sports car racing in Australia for many years. And for most of those years the gentleman driver didn't need minimum pit stop times or driver seedings to be competitive.
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Old 15 Jun 2017, 13:16 (Ref:3741603)   #6
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No offence meant Peckstar but for lack of a better word I fail to see how theirs any validity to your labelling of GT3, as an exemplar look at the Am-Am class from this years Bathurst 12 hour it was fully professional through and through you had the likes of Jamie Whincup partnering with Toni Vilander . Of course yes there's gentleman racers their they are integral part of GT3 but to label it as not real Motorsport is not a fair summation in my view, I hope I have not offended you

Last edited by PS2244; 15 Jun 2017 at 13:30.
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Old 15 Jun 2017, 14:52 (Ref:3741641)   #7
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Isnt that one of the key reasons why manufactuers are getting into gt4. The gt3 cars were getting too expensive as they chase HP, aero and weight. that they have now had to get into lower cost cars as they were starting to get out of the price of the common person
Manufacturers still tip insane amounts of money into GT3 because that's what the people watch. It's retains a good level of privateer and factory interest because in-season development is severely limited and so is the outlay. They have little reason to chase too much HP, Aero or lose weight because every advantage is eventually thwarted by BoP.

I can only suspect that the minimum performance level set by the FIA and tested each September for homologation is a constantly moving goal post that is forcing GT3 speeds up every few years - hence the GT-R, Jaguar and Bentley beginning to drop off.

It is reaching a point of unsustainable cost escalation, however - but I am sceptical every dollar and dime received on a GT3 car only just covers the cost to build it...

Most are only adding GT4 to their inventory (and TCR in some instances) to capture greater market share.

GT4 Europe is still predominantly contested by tuner built models and legacy one-make cars - with the Cayman MR and McLaren 570s slowly starting to take over.

GT4 still costs a bomb - $250k plus for a raft of newer models - well out of reach of most normal people (as is TCR - $100k + is not something most people have laying about for toys).
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Old 15 Jun 2017, 19:16 (Ref:3741796)   #8
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I don't think you understand much about anything
I think you just like to argue because you have no friends
pretty offensive immature response.

A lot of work and expense can be thrown at an engine even with a 'capped' power output.

Engine builders and tuners can spend plenty chasing the delivery of that power, ie where and how it makes it, tractability etc while still arriving at the same peak output as the next bloke.

Engine power delivery can be very specifically and carefully designed for each track.

Others may choose to operate a basic config designed for high mileage for instance.

I could continue to elaborate but hopefully you are starting to grasp the concept that others are discussing and have a more considerate response 👍

Sent from my SM-G955F using Tapatalk
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Old 15 Jun 2017, 22:43 (Ref:3742004)   #9
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Originally Posted by simon5574 View Post

A lot of work and expense can be thrown at an engine even with a 'capped' power output.

Engine builders and tuners can spend plenty chasing the delivery of that power, ie where and how it makes it, tractability etc while still arriving at the same peak output as the next bloke.

Engine power delivery can be very specifically and carefully designed for each track.

Others may choose to operate a basic config designed for high mileage for instance.

I could continue to elaborate but hopefully you are starting to grasp the concept that others are discussing and have a more considerate response 👍

Sent from my SM-G955F using Tapatalk
Well described. thank you
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Old 16 Jun 2017, 00:05 (Ref:3742039)   #10
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Originally Posted by simon5574 View Post
A lot of work and expense can be thrown at an engine even with a 'capped' power output.

Engine builders and tuners can spend plenty chasing the delivery of that power, ie where and how it makes it, tractability etc while still arriving at the same peak output as the next bloke.

Engine power delivery can be very specifically and carefully designed for each track.

Others may choose to operate a basic config designed for high mileage for instance.

I could continue to elaborate but hopefully you are starting to grasp the concept that others are discussing and have a more considerate response 👍

Sent from my SM-G955F using Tapatalk
Not to mention fuel economy, CoG, rotating mass and a raft of other items - you've nailed it with that post Simon.

Those suggesting that a capped power output means no development simply have no idea what they're talking about.
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Old 16 Jun 2017, 07:51 (Ref:3742098)   #11
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About time we had a hang-$#!+-on-everything thread.
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Old 16 Jun 2017, 07:54 (Ref:3742099)   #12
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About time we had a hang-$#!+-on-everything thread.
Rather than contaminate every single thread, here is the final resting place..
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Old 16 Jun 2017, 07:55 (Ref:3742100)   #13
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It needed to happen.
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Old 16 Jun 2017, 07:55 (Ref:3742101)   #14
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I just don't understand this one or another mentality I'm sorry why can't we just love both categories lol
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Old 16 Jun 2017, 07:58 (Ref:3742102)   #15
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I just don't understand this one or another mentality I'm sorry why can't we just love both categories lol
Unfortunately, it's the whole Us vs Them mentality. Holden V Ford, this footy team V that one.

It's close-minded, tiresome and immature.
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