Club F3 - Page 11

JohnMiller · 30 May 2006, 21:54 (Ref:1623347)

Calm down. Don't look for insults where none was intended!

I was referring in particular to the F4 Zetec lap records, as I happen to have them. In the main, they are slower than top-line FF1600 laps which of course have 40bhp less and treaded tyres etc.

I also didn't suggest that Club F3 would have great strength in depth. I was comparing more to FF1600 where Redracer77 has come from and it was him I was asking the question to...

I've raced with the Mono club over a few years and enjoyed the races, but you're not going to persuade me there is great strength in depth. The frontrunners are quick but I found it difficult to develop my driving as there was little to guage myslef against in 1800 and the midfield/slower 2 litre cars were a nightmare to race with. If I came back with a Mono2000 car maybe I'd find it a more satisfying experience. I don't want to race a shed though and I priced up building a pukka top-line Mono legal car as the same as an F3 spec car, although the F3 running costs are undoubtedly more.

Personally, I'd be in favour of allowing Mono-spec F3s etc. onto the Club F3 grid, but then I'm just a newly paid-up Club F3 member who hasn't bothered to get his car ready to race yet...

ss_collins · 30 May 2006, 22:22 (Ref:1623367)

whilst you choose you hethen water cooled things red I do agree with your points - for us its a hobby - it shouldn't be a hassle.

Its put me right off slicks and wings again - just as a club F3 racer had convinced me otherwise. So me I'm gonna do what a lot of club F3 potential racers are doing - race prototypes (and vees)

Redracer77 · 30 May 2006, 22:32 (Ref:1623374)

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnMiller

Calm down. Don't look for insults where none was intended!

I was referring in particular to the F4 Zetec lap records, as I happen to have them. In the main, they are slower than top-line FF1600 laps which of course have 40bhp less and treaded tyres etc.

I also didn't suggest that Club F3 would have great strength in depth. I was comparing more to FF1600 where Redracer77 has come from and it was him I was asking the question to...

I've raced with the Mono club over a few years and enjoyed the races, but you're not going to persuade me there is great strength in depth. The frontrunners are quick but I found it difficult to develop my driving as there was little to guage myslef against in 1800 and the midfield/slower 2 litre cars were a nightmare to race with. If I came back with a Mono2000 car maybe I'd find it a more satisfying experience. I don't want to race a shed though and I priced up building a pukka top-line Mono legal car as the same as an F3 spec car, although the F3 running costs are undoubtedly more.

Personally, I'd be in favour of allowing Mono-spec F3s etc. onto the Club F3 grid, but then I'm just a newly paid-up Club F3 member who hasn't bothered to get his car ready to race yet...

I think a standard zetec has 130bhp... so the same as Ed Moores FF1600 or 20bhp more than most FF1600's. But remember a zetec is a fair bit heavier than a kent car

JohnMiller · 31 May 2006, 08:33 (Ref:1623608)

IIRC, the Zetec car uses the 130PS version of the engine, which in the race car produces around 145-155bhp?

Redracer77 · 31 May 2006, 08:37 (Ref:1623610)

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnMiller

IIRC, the Zetec car uses the 130PS version of the engine, which in the race car produces around 145-155bhp?

No a zetec has about 130bhp adding the carbs and re mapping allows us in class A to get to between 155bhp and 165bhp

JohnMiller · 31 May 2006, 08:45 (Ref:1623617)

Hmm, I had a few rebuilt and never saw anything below 145. I know someone who did some back-to-backing on the dyno in F4, a couple of years ago now. Carbs/mapping added 5bhp I think, although back then the 750MC made the difference bigger as every post-98 Zetec on Pectel etc. had to run with a smaller restrictor than standard.

Redracer77 · 31 May 2006, 11:45 (Ref:1623724)

we run bigger chokes now John moved from 30mm to 34mm this year

Paul V · 31 May 2006, 11:52 (Ref:1623730)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Larry J-Croft

Driftwood, This may have been the case in the past but as far as I am aware not one of the mono cars had a problem on Monday (or any of the other races). My car tested at 106 just as it does everywhere else. I was carefully watching the test guys in the assembly area for previous practice sessions and it was just like any other race meet. This is now urban myth and I really hope it is not the reason people don't race at Combe.

Thanks for that.

There were as usual only a few cars that had problems with noise.
The F3 spec Argo required a quick repack in the assembly area, a pity he binned it in the race tho'.
A Monoposto Reynard required a replacement silencer as the original one was too small/ineffective to pass.
One was black flagged off the track because of drive-by levels - turned out his silencer had split and lost all of its packing. Repaired and had no further issues.

No other major issues that I can recall.

A good day - only spoiled by the rain.

georges1 · 3 Jun 2006, 17:02 (Ref:1626152)

was alexandre khateeb a good driver in this series?

driftwood · 4 Jun 2006, 09:43 (Ref:1626666)

he drove the car well won some races poles fastest laps in the few races he competed
define " good" driver!!

he has move donto scholarship class F3 now

THR · 4 Jun 2006, 21:23 (Ref:1627098)

yup!!! a good driver... defo better than ameture stuff i thought!!! A driver close to the limit.

ss_collins · 5 Jun 2006, 21:59 (Ref:1627990)

interesting to see him make the step up

Triple J Motorsport · 6 Jun 2006, 08:55 (Ref:1628281)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Redracer77

I think a standard zetec has 130bhp... so the same as Ed Moores FF1600 or 20bhp more than most FF1600's. But remember a zetec is a fair bit heavier than a kent car

Meeeooowww

Suze · 6 Jun 2006, 16:16 (Ref:1628609)

He's not exactly shining in F3 though is he?

JohnMiller · 6 Jun 2006, 16:19 (Ref:1628612)

How much mileage has he had so far? Give him a bit of a chance. He's not been last generally...

driftwood · 6 Jun 2006, 17:19 (Ref:1628655)

couple of tests and 2 meetings
he is a little inexperienced as he has done a few club f3 races last year and some fford events the year before

Just remember its easy to drive a race car in club races but harder at the top end to pick up the pace thats required
what he needs is track time and driver coaching ( which i heard he is getting now) and then he can start to see where he needs to be if he wants to run at this level of motorsport
we have many good club racers that could quite make the grade in the Pro series but are still racing after many years

JohnMiller · 8 Jun 2006, 12:45 (Ref:1629932)

Confirmed better entry for Donington. To my knowledge:

Class A

Keith Baldwin
Alan Ellis
Gary Marsh
Ken Finneran
Jon Gray
Paul Quinn
Terry Ludgrove
Shane Kelly
Gavin Wills
Steve Allen

Class B

Paul Sibley
Chris Willie
Dave Karaskas

Class Master

Nick Robinson
Paul Knapton
Mike White

Redracer77 · 8 Jun 2006, 13:07 (Ref:1629947)

Is that the same Paul Quinn who raced against my uncle in Toyota F3 in the 90's???

John is Gavin driivng your car?

JohnMiller · 8 Jun 2006, 13:19 (Ref:1629957)

Hi RR

1> Don't know, quite possibly i'd have thought.

2> Yes.

driftwood · 8 Jun 2006, 13:46 (Ref:1629974)

so John with yr car running thats 17 cars plus i know 1 guy is testing his car next week to do the race making 18 cars
the best so far
i know the next race will loose 2 guys clashing commitments but may gain 2 more cars to run and Brands round will see another masters car out subject to engine rebuild
if all went well could see 23 cars at a race if all turned up to the same meeting

mrsweety · 8 Jun 2006, 14:59 (Ref:1630014)

Quote:

Originally Posted by driftwood

so John with yr car running thats 17 cars plus i know 1 guy is testing his car next week to do the race making 18 cars
the best so far
i know the next race will loose 2 guys clashing commitments but may gain 2 more cars to run and Brands round will see another masters car out subject to engine rebuild
if all went well could see 23 cars at a race if all turned up to the same meeting

Hi driftwood, just checking the PM system is working as I sent you a message

Cheers

Andy

ss_collins · 8 Jun 2006, 21:57 (Ref:1630260)

having cars out there does not guarantee a series. Sports 1000, like club F3 was a great concept and at one point there were 20 cars out there - but they never all turned up at the same time - the series was canned - but it created Bikesports a far better solution...

driftwood · 9 Jun 2006, 09:46 (Ref:1630490)

F3 will not fail it will lurch thru this year and grow for next year
ive seen arp grids down to 10 cars over the years and it bounces back up as the cars are REAL race cars for not a lot of money and many people aspire to running and racing these cars

some of the 1 make saloon car series cost heaps to build and run and after 2 yrs sereis changes model or maker pulls the plug and it becomes a club saloon car series within another series

ss_collins · 9 Jun 2006, 09:53 (Ref:1630498)

Quote:

some of the 1 make saloon car series cost heaps to build and run and after 2 yrs sereis changes model or maker pulls the plug and it becomes a club saloon car series within another series

but those are not club series. I think club F3 has a bit of an identity crisis, is it a formula for wannabe F1 stars of is it a racing for the fun of it club series?

Bob Pearson · 9 Jun 2006, 10:28 (Ref:1630521)

Does it really have to be one or the other? BARC Renault is getting strong again and is clearly both of those things.

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