The Schengen Issue

**Peter Mallett** · 26 Jan 2016, 09:58 (Ref:3608068)

As we are aware the migrant crisis has resulted in some, not unexpected, issues. The violence, the camps, the bleeding heart liberals, etc.

However from point of view of us racers, the proposal to shut the European borders could create major problems. It's been some years but I recall the border between France and Belgium was always a major hold up on trips to Spa. Likewise Ferry journeys are likely to be longer due to the passport and border controls.

Food for thought when planning those "away weekends".

delta · 26 Jan 2016, 11:54 (Ref:3608083)

Yes I have told all my drivers that an extra day is going to be needed both ways traveling too and from tracks in the E U. See how things go. The amount of time we are spending abroad it would make sense to have a second workshop in France of Belgium.

**Tim Falce** · 26 Jan 2016, 14:17 (Ref:3608123)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter Mallett

However from point of view of us racers, the proposal to shut the European borders could create major problems. It's been some years but I recall the border between France and Belgium was always a major hold up on trips to Spa. Likewise Ferry journeys are likely to be longer due to the passport and border controls.

Food for thought when planning those "away weekends".

I thought the borders between France and Belgium were already closed, will we be going back to needing carnets etc? Not that it will affect me as I wont be towing abroad in the near future.

**Peter Mallett** · 26 Jan 2016, 14:19 (Ref:3608125)

Well that's a good point. I don't know the answer though.

wolfhound · 26 Jan 2016, 14:27 (Ref:3608130)

I would think that in future if the borders become slow zones it might make sense to take ferries direct to the country you want to go, in order to minimize border crossings

**Peter Mallett** · 26 Jan 2016, 14:45 (Ref:3608133)

Trouble is the only route to Zeebruge is via Hull. Raises a couple of minor issues, the first being, who the hell wants to go to Hull? The second being that Hull is around four hours towing time from my home.

gary396 · 26 Jan 2016, 15:36 (Ref:3608145)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter Mallett

Trouble is the only route to Zeebruge is via Hull. Raises a couple of minor issues, the first being, who the hell wants to go to Hull? The second being that Hull is around four hours towing time from my home.

I went that route to watch the Spa Classic last year as Hull is only a couple of hours easy drive from me. The ferries advertise that you can arrive well rested after a good night's sleep (about 12-hour crossing) - they forgot to mention the nightclub blaring out music until about two in the morning which I could hear from a couple of decks away!

I got a good deal but when I checked later for the Spa 6-Hours it would cost me about £400!!! So I reverted to flying from Teesside (about 20mins from me and £100 return on KLM) and hired a car at Schiphol Airport, lot cheaper and just the same driving time over there.

By the way Peter: Hull - UK City of Culture 2017.

**Peter Mallett** · 26 Jan 2016, 15:40 (Ref:3608149)

Quote:

Originally Posted by gary396

I

By the way Peter: Hull - UK City of Culture 2017.

Just goes to show doesn't it?

Mike Harte · 26 Jan 2016, 15:53 (Ref:3608157)

Quote:

Originally Posted by gary396

By the way Peter: Hull - UK City of Culture 2017.

Mushrooms also grow in a culture; so what does that say about Hull?

**Tim Falce** · 26 Jan 2016, 15:54 (Ref:3608158)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter Mallett

Trouble is the only route to Zeebruge is via Hull. Raises a couple of minor issues, the first being, who the hell wants to go to Hull? The second being that Hull is around four hours towing time from my home.

What! you can't go Dover to Ostend or Zeebrugge any more?
Next you'll tell me you can't go Folkstone-Boulogne now.

gary396 · 26 Jan 2016, 15:55 (Ref:3608159)

I must clarify at this point that I am in no way connected with or supporting Hull in any way, shape or form. It just happens to be theoretically handy as a northern port.

**Peter Mallett** · 26 Jan 2016, 16:00 (Ref:3608161)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tim Falce

What! you can't go Dover to Ostend or Zeebrugge any more?
Next you'll tell me you can't go Folkstone-Boulogne now.

Yup.

zefarelly · 26 Jan 2016, 16:06 (Ref:3608166)

Mushrooms grow from culture, usually on manure.

What was it about Hull ?

I'd rather queue at passport control than drive 250 miles in the wrong direction. I've been tempted to move to Belgium for a few years . . .

bauble · 26 Jan 2016, 16:29 (Ref:3608173)

Quote:

Originally Posted by zefarelly

Mushrooms grow from culture, usually on manure.

What was it about Hull ?

I'd rather queue at passport control than drive 250 miles in the wrong direction. I've been tempted to move to Belgium for a few years . . .

That would at least raise the tone there.

Lancsbreaker · 26 Jan 2016, 19:46 (Ref:3608236)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter Mallett

Trouble is the only route to Zeebruge is via Hull. Raises a couple of minor issues, the first being, who the hell wants to go to Hull? The second being that Hull is around four hours towing time from my home.

Best thing about Hull is that it only takes 10 minutes or so to drive through it to the port

And it's an easy 90 minute or so trip for those of us at this end of the country

Compare that to minimum 5 hour journey (+ "x" hours for snarled up M25/Dartford crossing) to get to Dover, and I find the attractions of Hull growing on me. Yeah the crossing is more expensive, but there is a significant fuel saving and you do generally get chance for some proper shuteye overnight.......and less chance of having to run the gauntlet of asylum seekers

Heightswitch · 26 Jan 2016, 20:41 (Ref:3608259)

Quote:

Originally Posted by gary396

I went that route to watch the Spa Classic last year as Hull is only a couple of hours easy drive from me. The ferries advertise that you can arrive well rested after a good night's sleep (about 12-hour crossing) - they forgot to mention the nightclub blaring out music until about two in the morning which I could hear from a couple of decks away!

I got a good deal but when I checked later for the Spa 6-Hours it would cost me about £400!!! So I reverted to flying from Teesside (about 20mins from me and £100 return on KLM) and hired a car at Schiphol Airport, lot cheaper and just the same driving time over there.

By the way Peter: Hull - UK City of Culture 2017.

And don't forget the dancing until the early hours with the wagon drivers

In all seriousness. If a group of you are going the Hull route makes for a good night out, nice breakfast and then a reasonably short drive the next day.

its good for us Northerners…The world doesn't revolve around watford you know

gary396 · 26 Jan 2016, 20:59 (Ref:3608264)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Heightswitch

its good for us Northerners…The world doesn't revolve around watford you know

I think that living in North Yorkshire qualifies me as a Northener.

morninggents · 26 Jan 2016, 22:08 (Ref:3608291)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter Mallett

Raises a couple of minor issues, the first being, who the hell wants to go to Hull?

What? How dare you!! Oh, Hull ....Yeah .....

Tel 911S · 27 Jan 2016, 18:06 (Ref:3608513)

Other alternatives might be a freight boat , from Felixstowe - Rotterdam etc .

I have used that one in the past with van/ trailer .Can,t remember prices but I don,t think it was too bad , & they will sometimes fit you in to make up space .

One word of warning . Loading at Rotterdam on the return means reversing up the ramp & into the ship . And they keep it moving so you need to be able to reverse uphill & then into your lane on the cargo deck without many shunts unless you want to look silly .

**Peter Mallett** · 27 Jan 2016, 18:14 (Ref:3608515)

You still have to cross the Dutch/Belgian border though.

**Tim Falce** · 27 Jan 2016, 18:24 (Ref:3608517)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tel 911S

One word of warning . Loading at Rotterdam on the return means reversing up the ramp & into the ship . And they keep it moving so you need to be able to reverse uphill & then into your lane on the cargo deck without many shunts unless you want to look silly .

We used to have to reverse artics onto most ferries in the 70s as the majority only loaded from one end. I'd love to see some of the current crop of today's truck drivers do it now.

zefarelly · 27 Jan 2016, 18:37 (Ref:3608520)

A minor aside . . .why don't they build a proper airport up north . . . .

Bauble . . . Belgiums under rated . . . . but I didn't sday that, I don't want riff raff going there as well!

wolfhound · 27 Jan 2016, 19:23 (Ref:3608528)

For those of you who can travel from Hull there is a ferry from there to Zeebrugge. As an alternative from London there is Harwich to Hook of Holland at less than half the price from Hull. Sadly there is no longer a ferry from Ramsgate to Ostende.

Tel 911S · 27 Jan 2016, 19:29 (Ref:3608531)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter Mallett

You still have to cross the Dutch/Belgian border though.

A quick look finds a Dover Ostend Ro/Ro freight boat .
Have never used it but did in the past use a car ferry on that route .
So might need checking to see if you can get on as non freight .
One problem can be the limited number of passenger spaces available on freight boats .

Mike Bell · 27 Jan 2016, 20:39 (Ref:3608540)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tim Falce

We used to have to reverse artics onto most ferries in the 70s as the majority only loaded from one end. I'd love to see some of the current crop of today's truck drivers do it now.

Brittany Ferries services from S Coast use non roro boats. Involves some artics initially reversing into corners, then majority have to do a U-turn at the end. Ask Delta about trying to do that with his rigid and trailer last October- he knew it wouldn't be possible but the crew insisted......

Me and few other race trucks were made to drive up a drop down ramp onto next level. The ramp is about the width of an artic plus couple of inches. When it came to getting off, we had to wait until all other vehicles had gone, then reverse one by one the length of the boat so could drive down the ramp again. Lost about an hour to the first vehicles off...

Thinking about all the alternatives, I reckon this season will use Dover Calais for Belgium, unless industrial action or migrant unrest cause delays. I'll risk border controls, as they aren't happening yet, and can build into the journey calculations if they do. For France, Italy and Spain will use Portsmouth boats. No way to avoid France / Italy border, whichever port head for!