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14 Apr 2002, 13:47 (Ref:259935)
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#1 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Jul 1999
Posts: 2,946
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Was this the most important race in Montoya's career so far??
All these wars of words, all the hype and the escalation in both temperature and pressure in the grid.
As a JPM fan, I was sitting there eager for him to show us what he's made of, take the fight to TGF and show him HE was the true challenger, not Ralf. OK, the Ferrari's were way ahead today. But the fact that Montoya was so comfortably outdriven all weekend by Ralf is worrying. No prang excuses this time. |
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14 Apr 2002, 13:49 (Ref:259940)
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#2 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Apr 2002
Posts: 951
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Yes,it is.Do you think that someone paid Williams to favorize Ralf?
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14 Apr 2002, 13:50 (Ref:259943)
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#3 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Jul 1999
Posts: 6,038
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Oh my, are we now going to hear that Montoya is no good?
It wasn't his weekend. It happens to them all... He'll have better days. |
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__________________
"I used to hate writing, but now I enjoy it. I realized that the purpose of writing is to inflate weak ideas, obscure poor reasoning, and inhibit clarity. With a little practice, writing can be an intimidating and impenetrable fog!" - Calvin and Hobbes
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14 Apr 2002, 13:51 (Ref:259948)
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#4 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 4,936
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Oh please.... Montoya _never_ had a shot this weekend. The Williams is no competition for the F2002 on this track. JPM took a gamble in his setup, hoping for a wet race, and lost. It was his only hope to challenge for the lead, and I agree with making that gamble.
No matter how hard he drove, he was _not_ going to win this week. Plus another shunt at the start, as he nearly had with Barichello, would have really given him a bad reputation. Last edited by Lee Janotta; 14 Apr 2002 at 13:54. |
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__________________
"Put a ****ing wheel on there! Let me go out again!" -Gilles Villeneuve, Zandvoort, 1979
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14 Apr 2002, 13:54 (Ref:259958)
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#5 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Jul 1999
Posts: 2,946
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Montoya opted for half-wet setup?? News to me.
Lee, I personally thought Williams would have been much closer, Imola being a power-based circuit. BUT THAT'S NOT THE POINT. If you read my post, I said I'm not talking about comparisons with Ferraris or whatever. I'm talking about comparisons with his team mate who, correct me if I'm wrong, was driving the same car as Montoya. Put it like this. If you're TGf and you get asked "who do you see as your main rival this year?" what is your response going to be? |
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14 Apr 2002, 13:56 (Ref:259964)
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#6 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Jul 2001
Posts: 7,294
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Simply put, Ralf had the better weekend. Is that so hard for everyone to understand?
One race doesn't make the entire summer you know. |
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__________________
Sunderland Til I Die!
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14 Apr 2002, 14:04 (Ref:259982)
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#7 | ||
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Racer
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 156
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Half wet setup OOOOHHHHH I see that the excuse this TIME
I though is was being OUTPACED again by Ralf |
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14 Apr 2002, 14:04 (Ref:259983)
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#8 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Jul 1999
Posts: 2,946
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Yes, but when was the last time JPM had a better race than Ralf?? I have to think....
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14 Apr 2002, 14:05 (Ref:259985)
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#9 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Mar 2001
Posts: 931
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It was the same thing after the first few races of last year, "Montoya's no good, he's uncompetitve, etc,".We've heard it all before.
 There is still a long way to go in the season and he WILL bounce back and be more competive. But he won't be ahead of Ralf  .
Last edited by Raoul Duke; 14 Apr 2002 at 14:07. |
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14 Apr 2002, 14:08 (Ref:259992)
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#10 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Feb 2001
Posts: 615
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It's true that one race does not make an entire season but Juan merely confirmed today that he's the second Williams driver. He can be either quick and reckless or safe and slow. No racecraft at all...
It will be interesting when he negotiates his salary with Patrick and Frank for next year, assuming they want to kep Juan. I'd say that today Jenson Button took a giant step towards the second Williams seat next year. 
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14 Apr 2002, 14:09 (Ref:259993)
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#11 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Mar 2001
Posts: 1,340
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I dunno Tristan seems like Lee was talking about comparsions between the two...Juan went for the gamble that it would rain and had a much different setup because this was the only hope to challenge for a win...Ralf as usual takes no gambles and just goes for the easy points (IMO)
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__________________
Doesn't it seem sad that drivers like Fisichella, Coultard, Barrichello, and Ralf all have secure seats in F1, despite having had race winning cars for many more seasons than Jacques, yet failing to chalk up as many wins as he (let alone a WDC) that it is Jacques who doesn't have a drive in F1??? Sad indeed.
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14 Apr 2002, 14:14 (Ref:260001)
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#12 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Jul 1999
Posts: 2,946
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It's a theory I give you that. I hope for the sake of the WDC it's true.
But I dunno. I've just forgotten the last time I could say "what a good race by my Monster", that's all. |
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14 Apr 2002, 14:19 (Ref:260007)
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#13 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Apr 2001
Posts: 5,577
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Sky interviewed Patrick Head straight after the race. He said JPM was complaining about understeer on his out lap to the grid. They put it down to the tyres being cold and did nothing about it. As it turned out he did have a cronic understeer problem that was loosing him half a second a lap. Those are the facts straight from the horses mouth.
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__________________
Brought to you by Glagnar's Human Rinds: "A-bunch-a-munch-crunch-a-human"
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14 Apr 2002, 14:34 (Ref:260025)
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#14 | |||
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Ten-Tenths Hall of Fame
Veteran
Join Date: Jul 1999
Posts: 5,305
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Quote:
1) Ralf and JPM are usually fairly closely matched, Ralf perhaps a tad faster. 2) Rain was threatening all weekend. 3) Set up is completely different on a chassis from wet to dry and the wrong set-up can render a car undrivable. In Britain last year, That German Fellow opted for a wet set-up on his red car and couldn't get near Hakkinen, this having been the driver/car combination that wallopped everyone at most of the races this year. It seems to me that givebn the uncertainty of today's whether, that a team would play it safe and race one car on each setting. Montoya and his engineer made the wrong choice, but asuuming that it was a straight comparison between Ralf and JPM and the Colubian lost seems terribley naive to me. |
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__________________
Go Tribe!!!!
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14 Apr 2002, 14:48 (Ref:260061)
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#15 | |
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Veteran
Join Date: Dec 2000
Posts: 1,473
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Some of you really read too much into 1 race weekend.
Ralf got the best result Williams could've hoped for with 3rd. JPM drove an average race by his (and Ralf supporters, so it seems) standards to 4th. Williams couldn't have done any better overall. No team had the pace to split them so there was no incentive for JPM to push hard and risk making a mistake with a set up he wasn't happy with In Malaysia and Brazil Williams were a lot more competitive, he had more pace than Ralf and was fighting for victory. I think those races were a lot more exciting to watch. Sadly I think Spain might be the same story with Ferrari dominating, Ralf having the edge over JPM for 3rd and 4th, but then Austria might be completely different. |
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14 Apr 2002, 14:54 (Ref:260077)
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#16 | ||
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Subscriber
Veteran
Join Date: Jul 2001
Posts: 3,259
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Understeering in the warming lap?? In bikes they do a fairly quick warming lap to grid, but in F1 they are well out of the limits. If JPM's car underteers in that conditions I guess it would have big troubles.
BTW, I'm nor saying it is true or not, but we don't have to necessarily believe PH's words about his cars/drivers perfomances in an interview. |
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14 Apr 2002, 14:58 (Ref:260088)
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#17 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Apr 2001
Posts: 5,577
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Not the warm up lap, the initiation lap to the grid (when they do run at full pace or close to it). It would make sense as it is clear that JPM is not slower than the 3 drivers that beat him yet he was today. It would take somthing other than the driver to cause that.
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__________________
Brought to you by Glagnar's Human Rinds: "A-bunch-a-munch-crunch-a-human"
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14 Apr 2002, 15:03 (Ref:260099)
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#18 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Oct 2000
Posts: 1,434
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Montoya's just slow compared to Ralf. Period.
All the whining and excuses dont distract from the fact that Ralf has beaten him in all 3 of the races he has finished. Simple as that. You can whine as much as you want about understeer and oversteer but the fact remains - there is rarely a driver on any circuit who doesent have to deal with it during a grand prix. At the end of the day though - Imola just re-enforced the fact that Ralf Schumacher is the main contender for the title this year - and at worst will finish 2nd in the championship if Ferraris awesome F-2002 continues to dominate F1. |
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14 Apr 2002, 15:12 (Ref:260113)
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#19 | |||
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Ten-Tenths Hall of Fame
Veteran
Join Date: Jul 1999
Posts: 5,305
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Quote:
Last edited by EERO; 14 Apr 2002 at 15:13. |
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__________________
Go Tribe!!!!
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14 Apr 2002, 15:15 (Ref:260116)
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#20 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Oct 2000
Posts: 1,434
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As do Ralf's 4 wins compared to Montoya's 1 in the same car during the same priod.
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14 Apr 2002, 15:21 (Ref:260124)
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#21 | |
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Veteran
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 5,602
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im very dissapionted that JPM didnt get to challenge anyone. VERY DISSAPOINTED ! , i hope it was just down to set up due to them being unsure about the weather . Patrick Head said that Juan had bad understeer all through the race .
Michael had it far too easy today . |
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__________________
MOTOR RACING ...The general idea is that the driver behind uses all his Skills, Tricks and Courage to try and overtake the guy ( or Girl ) in front !
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14 Apr 2002, 15:27 (Ref:260135)
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#22 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 4,936
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Mania, that's just ignoring reality. Montoya could have won at Brazil, Indy, _and_ Hockenhiem last year, but was taken out by an errant Arrows, and then his car cooked itself the rest of the time (helped along by pitstop incompetence!)
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__________________
"Put a ****ing wheel on there! Let me go out again!" -Gilles Villeneuve, Zandvoort, 1979
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14 Apr 2002, 15:31 (Ref:260140)
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#23 | |||
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Ten-Tenths Hall of Fame
Veteran
Join Date: Jul 1999
Posts: 5,305
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Quote:
No need to rude and stick your tongue out at me because you cannot express yourself with precision. Last edited by EERO; 14 Apr 2002 at 15:32. |
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__________________
Go Tribe!!!!
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14 Apr 2002, 15:32 (Ref:260143)
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#24 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Oct 2000
Posts: 1,434
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There's a big diference between "could" and "did" Lee. For that matter, Ralf could have won more races as well had he not been taken out by Barrichelo at Malaysia or Brazil or this year in Australia...etc.
Its pure speculation to say what would have happened. In my book, IF has no place in Formula One. Results are what counts not potential results since are purely speculation and in some cases wishful thinking. |
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14 Apr 2002, 15:38 (Ref:260149)
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#25 | |
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Veteran
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 2,157
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Montoya has gone down in my mind. He just makes faces and whines while, incredibly, Ralf is the mature one!
He is defintely not the next Senna or Schumacher. They were/are always fast. This is the guy who cut up Andretti on purpose on an oval at huge speed and caused a big crash... Bring back Hakkinen! |
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__________________
Racing is in my...err... I was born to...um... Winning is...things and stuff...etc.. For sure!
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