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Old 23 Apr 2018, 14:48 (Ref:3817014)   #51
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Originally Posted by touring fan01 View Post
and your point?

as long as they produce 2,500 of them who cares if they have all been sold? every major manufacturer has many thousands of unsold cars in storage.
Not every manufacturer. That's what lead to the need for the government scrappage scheme several years ago and why some manufacturers had to seek bailouts. Some wised up to it before it happened and didn't require the hangouts. They were able to make use of the scrappage scheme to build cars rather than just shift unsold stock.
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Old 23 Apr 2018, 15:00 (Ref:3817015)   #52
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Not every manufacturer. That's what lead to the need for the government scrappage scheme several years ago and why some manufacturers had to seek bailouts. Some wised up to it before it happened and didn't require the hangouts. They were able to make use of the scrappage scheme to build cars rather than just shift unsold stock.
thats just incorrect. every large volume manufacturer still over-produces and has stocks of unsold cars either at their own yards or at the dealers premises. name me one large volume manufacturer that doesn't have any stock of any cars whatsoever and only produces every car to each customer order'?
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Old 23 Apr 2018, 15:33 (Ref:3817019)   #53
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thats just incorrect. every large volume manufacturer still over-produces and has stocks of unsold cars either at their own yards or at the dealers premises. name me one large volume manufacturer that doesn't have any stock of any cars whatsoever and only produces every car to each customer order'?
Ford haven't had thousands of cars just sitting around waiting to be sold since before the last economic crash. Dealers will have some stock of cars that they can shift quickly, but they don't have thousands of cars sitting on disused airfields. Ford saw the crash coming and retooled their factories to produce two or more different vehicles so that they were always able to maintain a steady production output. After the crash and bailouts other manufacturers followed suit. There will likely still be some manufacturers like Kia and Hyundai and some of the Japanese, that will still have a large stock of cars in the UK as they will make customer spec changes to the cars at their compounds or at the dealerships.
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Old 23 Apr 2018, 15:54 (Ref:3817024)   #54
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Ford haven't had thousands of cars just sitting around waiting to be sold since before the last economic crash. Dealers will have some stock of cars that they can shift quickly, but they don't have thousands of cars sitting on disused airfields. Ford saw the crash coming and retooled their factories to produce two or more different vehicles so that they were always able to maintain a steady production output. After the crash and bailouts other manufacturers followed suit. There will likely still be some manufacturers like Kia and Hyundai and some of the Japanese, that will still have a large stock of cars in the UK as they will make customer spec changes to the cars at their compounds or at the dealerships.
really? its a LOT more than that!
in the uk, 17% of cars are unsold. thats about 300,000 cars or £27 billion worth just sitting around

https://www.motortrader.com/motor-tr...3bn-02-10-2017

Last edited by touring fan01; 23 Apr 2018 at 16:10.
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Old 23 Apr 2018, 17:33 (Ref:3817036)   #55
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Most manufacturers have a shed load of stock. Ford have a hell of a lot less than they used too, but still a massive amount. I could definitely lay my hands on Focus/ Mondeo/ SMAX or Galaxy in any spec. Fiesta is a bit tricky as it's flying off the forecourts as quickly as they can build them.

Anyhow, this minimum quantity malarkey: are we saying Honda Swindon has to knock out 2500 Type R roadcars by Brands final? That'll be a close call!
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Old 23 Apr 2018, 17:39 (Ref:3817038)   #56
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really? its a LOT more than that!
in the uk, 17% of cars are unsold. thats about 300,000 cars or £27 billion worth just sitting around

https://www.motortrader.com/motor-tr...3bn-02-10-2017
Taking the 10 manufacturers with the most dealerships in the UK, together they amount to 2141 dealerships, if they alone shared your 300,000 cars sitting around in stock, that would amount to just 140 cars sitting in each of those dealerships. As there is quite a few more than just 10 different manufacturers selling cars in the UK each dealership may only have 100 cars in stock. Now if each Ford dealer for example, had 100 cars in stock and with 12 different cars in it's range, that is just 8 of each car they could have in stock. Divide those 11 models by every engine and and trim combination available regardless of choice of colour and whether manual or automatic, 100 cars isn't a lot. So neither is 300,000 divided between all the manufacturers selling in the UK. Especially as approximately 2.5 million cars were sold in the UK last year.
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Old 23 Apr 2018, 17:48 (Ref:3817040)   #57
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Taking the 10 manufacturers with the most dealerships in the UK, together they amount to 2141 dealerships, if they alone shared your 300,000 cars sitting around in stock, that would amount to just 140 cars sitting in each of those dealerships. As there is quite a few more than just 10 different manufacturers selling cars in the UK each dealership may only have 100 cars in stock. Now if each Ford dealer for example, had 100 cars in stock and with 9 different cars in it's range, that is just 11 of each car they could have in stock. Divide those 11 models by every engine and and trim combination available regardless of choice of colour and whether manual or automatic, 100 cars isn't a lot. So neither is 300,000 divided between all the manufacturers selling in the UK. Especially as approximately 2.5 million cars were sold in the UK last year.
so £25 BILLION worth of cars sitting around unsold isn’t a lot to you.
obviously the motor trade dont share your dismissiveness!

by the way, even if Ford had only a paltry 1% of unsold cars of their 330,000 annual sales that’s 3,300 cars alone. that’s way different to what you were originally suggesting that they had none.

Last edited by touring fan01; 23 Apr 2018 at 18:12.
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Old 23 Apr 2018, 18:13 (Ref:3817046)   #58
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Anyhow, this minimum quantity malarkey: are we saying Honda Swindon has to knock out 2500 Type R roadcars by Brands final? That'll be a close call!
I'm pretty sure all Civics count as 'family'?
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Old 23 Apr 2018, 18:23 (Ref:3817048)   #59
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I'm pretty sure all Civics count as 'family'?
Yes - that's 15,000 in the family, and 2,500 of which must be Type-R's.

However - as they had built 13,000 Type-R's at Swindon by March 31st, they have comfortably reached the homologation requirement.
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Old 23 Apr 2018, 18:24 (Ref:3817049)   #60
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Anyhow, this minimum quantity malarkey: are we saying Honda Swindon has to knock out 2500 Type R roadcars by Brands final? That'll be a close call!
They've already built more than 13,000.....
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Old 23 Apr 2018, 18:24 (Ref:3817050)   #61
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Old 23 Apr 2018, 19:07 (Ref:3817053)   #62
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by the way, even if Ford had only a paltry 1% of unsold cars of their 330,000 annual sales that’s 3,300 cars alone. that’s way different to what you were originally suggesting that they had none.
I never suggested they didn't have none, I said they don't have many.
Divide that 3300 cars equally between every Ford dealer in the UK that is just under 7 cars each. That isn't even an example of each car they sell. in fact it's practically just the cars sitting in each showroom to go in and look at.
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Old 23 Apr 2018, 19:16 (Ref:3817055)   #63
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Yes - that's 15,000 in the family, and 2,500 of which must be Type-R's.

However - as they had built 13,000 Type-R's at Swindon by March 31st, they have comfortably reached the homologation requirement.
How sure of that figure are you? Based on component supply into HUM UK Manufacturing I would be inclined to say that figure is well out... or my source is!
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Old 23 Apr 2018, 20:36 (Ref:3817063)   #64
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How sure of that figure are you? Based on component supply into HUM UK Manufacturing I would be inclined to say that figure is well out... or my source is!
Assuming Honda's predicted figures held up-

David Hodgetts, managing director at Honda UK, told the Press Association: “There’s plenty of anticipation for the new Civic Type R, which largely comes off the back of the fact that the car it replaced was very well received and was built in small numbers.

“But the American market has really driven up demand because it’s not been available over there before. We’re looking at producing about 13,000 units between now and March 31, and we’re exporting about 6,000 of those to the States.”
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Old 23 Apr 2018, 20:44 (Ref:3817064)   #65
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I never suggested they didn't have none, I said they don't have many.
Divide that 3300 cars equally between every Ford dealer in the UK that is just under 7 cars each. That isn't even an example of each car they sell. in fact it's practically just the cars sitting in each showroom to go in and look at.
don’t want to embarrass you, but you actually said “Ford haven't had thousands of cars just sitting around waiting to be sold since before the last economic crash.“

obviously they do have thousands of cars sitting around.
if you are going to be pedantic then at least be consistent
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Old 23 Apr 2018, 21:01 (Ref:3817068)   #66
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don’t want to embarrass you, but you actually said “Ford haven't had thousands of cars just sitting around waiting to be sold since before the last economic crash.“



obviously they do have thousands of cars sitting around.
if you are going to be pedantic then at least be consistent
Your interpretation of thousands is obviously different to mine. I have already pointed out that 300,000 cars between all the manufacturers selling cars within the UK isn't a particularly large number, it doesn't even equate to 2 months car sales by average.
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Old 23 Apr 2018, 21:02 (Ref:3817070)   #67
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@ crmalcolm

Done some checking and the volume is massively higher than the previous gen car... so the 2500 has come and gone. I seem to know too many people who are way out the loop! No accounting for taste mind, at that money I'd not be having a Honda....

However 5000 is the total supply that is expected in the States this calendar year based on info supplied to dealers.

Of more interest how bad is Matt Neals handypandy?
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Old 23 Apr 2018, 21:08 (Ref:3817073)   #68
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Your interpretation of thousands is obviously different to mine. I have already pointed out that 300,000 cars between all the manufacturers selling cars within the UK isn't a particularly large number, it doesn't even equate to 2 months car sales by average.
I totally agree, 300k is diddly. We're a long way from the days of airfield after airfield full of stock. MG manage to hide theirs in the remains of the Longbridge factories, and not much of those exist anymore ☹
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Old 23 Apr 2018, 23:21 (Ref:3817086)   #69
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Your interpretation of thousands is obviously different to mine.
right. so when you said they don’t have ‘thousands’ of unsold cars you didn’t actually mean they don’t have ‘thousands’ of unsold cars.
that totally makes sense
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Old 24 Apr 2018, 05:30 (Ref:3817110)   #70
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@ crmalcolm

Done some checking and the volume is massively higher than the previous gen car... so the 2500 has come and gone. I seem to know too many people who are way out the loop! No accounting for taste mind, at that money I'd not be having a Honda....

However 5000 is the total supply that is expected in the States this calendar year based on info supplied to dealers.

Of more interest how bad is Matt Neals handypandy?
I think one thing is definitely certain - Honda are far from being short on meeting the minimum build numbers for homologation...

Re. Neal - I'm not sure when the interview was carried out, but Neal was quoted on 23rd April as looking to get three points finishes and carrying no ballast into the weekend. It looks like the hand is good enough to race with.
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Old 24 Apr 2018, 07:15 (Ref:3817118)   #71
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Old 24 Apr 2018, 07:48 (Ref:3817125)   #72
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Old 24 Apr 2018, 08:23 (Ref:3817132)   #73
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right. so when you said they don’t have ‘thousands’ of unsold cars you didn’t actually mean they don’t have ‘thousands’ of unsold cars.
that totally makes sense
There are people who just want to walk into a dealership and buy a car and there are people who want a specific colour, specific extras fitted, specific engine and gearbox combination. For the latter, the customer is likely to have to place an order for the car to be built. The former will likely buy a car from the dealers group stock. So all those thousands of cars aren't over production and unsold, they are just cars that the dealerships order in as stock. It has a fairly regular turnover for people who want a car within a week or so rather than waiting 3 months maybe more for a specific build.
So let's say there are 10k "unsold" Ford cars currently sitting in the UK, I would be willing to bet that 50-60% of those aren't part of the 10k that was sitting around unsold the month before and won't be part of the 10k cars for the following month.
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Old 24 Apr 2018, 08:36 (Ref:3817133)   #74
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Old 24 Apr 2018, 12:13 (Ref:3817159)   #75
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