Toyota set to bail out?

cds_uk · 15 Oct 2007, 19:37 (Ref:2041028)

Here we are, http://www.italiaracing.net/notizia.asp?id=16743&cat=1 , not sure about this but even they can't have a bottomless pit of money, if they do leave i hope they carry on with engines, maybe put a bit of extra cash into Williams.

duke_toaster · 15 Oct 2007, 19:39 (Ref:2041030)

If they don't race next year (and Frank Williams gets his way), we will have a 16 car F1 next year. Which will be stupid.

Teretonga · 15 Oct 2007, 19:52 (Ref:2041044)

They probably will race next year but 2008 may be the finale...
They would be far better to put their resources into engines and do a couple of teams as suppliers. It would cost less than 20% of what they are spending now and they would learn as much and could still use the sport as a training ground for engineers.

davyboy · 15 Oct 2007, 19:54 (Ref:2041046)

I think they're speculating on Toyota leaving at the end of 2008, nevertheless 2009 could have a pretty lean grid.

I'm very surprised Toyota are still in F1 to be honest, I'm not sure how their RoI is derived.

cds_uk · 15 Oct 2007, 20:55 (Ref:2041113)

Yeah, i read it as deliver next year or bow out at the end of it, they need to get a star in to replace Ralf because they wont do anything with Trulli and Glock.

S.Moss · 15 Oct 2007, 21:18 (Ref:2041123)

Quote:

Originally Posted by duke_toaster

If they don't race next year (and Frank Williams gets his way), we will have a 16 car F1 next year. Which will be stupid.

I don't get what you mean by Frank getting his way?

i would of thought he'd of wanted more teams on the grid not less?

Hazard · 15 Oct 2007, 21:43 (Ref:2041146)

Quote:

Originally Posted by S.Moss

I don't get what you mean by Frank getting his way?

i would of thought he'd of wanted more teams on the grid not less?

I think Mr. Toaster's implying to the loss of all of the customer car teams, since if Williams legal action is fully successful, Prodrive & Super Aguri would be unlikely to be on the grid next season - and I've assumed he means Toro Rosso too, but I'm sure the resources for a quick glue and snap together would manifest themselves in their case.

jab · 15 Oct 2007, 22:06 (Ref:2041164)

Quote:

Originally Posted by duke_toaster

If they don't race next year (and Frank Williams gets his way), we will have a 16 car F1 next year. Which will be stupid.

You'd get 3 car teams before that

But I would wonder about a potential domino effect if they go. Perhaps Renault would as well as they're notorious waverers, and 1 going might tip them over. Then with 2 manufacturers gone you could get a WRC effect

johntt · 15 Oct 2007, 22:16 (Ref:2041172)

Someone on another forum was saying that they know someone who works for Toyota.

Word is they are desperate to get out of F1 at the earliest opportunity and go back to Le Mans with a petrol-electric hybrid LMP. They would also invest their time and money into Williams in a similar way that Mercedes have in McLaren.

Nicholosophy · 15 Oct 2007, 22:24 (Ref:2041179)

Well I think they would be better off investing their funding into Williams than doing what they are doing now. Better return on investment surely.

mac · 16 Oct 2007, 00:22 (Ref:2041218)

Frank was very smart in going direct to Toyota Japan regarding engines instead of through the team's bosses in Cologne.

It presented an opportunity for Toyota Japan to benchmark the team against Williams and evaluate for the future.

I daresay the 2007 results have not been favourable for Toyota F1 - and it would need a pretty drastic turnaround in 2008 to remain on the grid the following season.

ThePenguin · 16 Oct 2007, 01:44 (Ref:2041239)

Toyota did really well in 2005, and I thought that they would be doing even better in 2006 and be a championship contender this year. But since 2005 things have only gotten worse, and if they have another terrible season in 2008 they will probably leave very quickly.

Peter Ford · 16 Oct 2007, 03:22 (Ref:2041257)

I think it a good idea because i cant see them getting any better,if they do go they should supply engines to teams or focus on 1 team say williams.

Racenut7 · 16 Oct 2007, 03:50 (Ref:2041262)

A1GP Boss could take over those two seats.

VIVA GT · 16 Oct 2007, 07:23 (Ref:2041326)

Quote:

Originally Posted by NickoGP

Well I think they would be better off investing their funding into Williams than doing what they are doing now. Better return on investment surely.

How about this scenario: Toyota pull out of the championship and supply engines, money and other support to Williams. Williams then in turn supply customer cars to be run by Prodrive?
(You can laugh now, but remember where you saw this first...)

Marbot · 16 Oct 2007, 08:35 (Ref:2041388)

Quote:

Originally Posted by VIVA GT

How about this scenario: Toyota pull out of the championship and supply engines, money and other support to Williams. Williams then in turn supply customer cars to be run by Prodrive?
(You can laugh now, but remember where you saw this first...)

Williams would rather pack it in than supply another team with their chassis.

Toyota giving up and supplying engines to Williams and whoever takes their place is a possibility however.

**Aysedasi** · 16 Oct 2007, 08:50 (Ref:2041400)

Should never have left sportscars.........

Ralf's Girl · 16 Oct 2007, 09:42 (Ref:2041473)

I think Toyota will have to get some results soon or admit defeat and pull out. I question whether we'd see them develop a relationship with Williams like the one between McLaren and Mercedes though - I've always got the impression that Williams don't want a manufacturer having too much input into the way they do things, and that was one of the reasons for their relationship with BMW going sour. There's no reason why Toyota couldn't continue as an engine supplier, but I think with Williams they would have to be just an engine supplier and nothing more.

**GTRMagic** · 16 Oct 2007, 09:45 (Ref:2041475)

If Toyota secures Mr Alonso, it might just be a whole other ballgame

Ralf's Girl · 16 Oct 2007, 09:50 (Ref:2041481)

Funny how every thread comes back to him, isn't it?

Nicholosophy · 16 Oct 2007, 10:36 (Ref:2041541)

Quote:

Originally Posted by VIVA GT

How about this scenario: Toyota pull out of the championship and supply engines, money and other support to Williams. Williams then in turn supply customer cars to be run by Prodrive?
(You can laugh now, but remember where you saw this first...)

That certainly wouldn't be such a bad thing. Could see Williams back up the heap with the extra money and the feedback coming in from Prodrive. Ironic, but not bad.

davyboy · 16 Oct 2007, 10:52 (Ref:2041567)

Quote:

Originally Posted by GTRMagic

If Toyota secures Mr Alonso, it might just be a whole other ballgame

Don't think he'd make much difference to be honest... and he knows that too.

Yannick · 16 Oct 2007, 15:45 (Ref:2041875)

How about Toyota buying customer cars at a gracious rate from Williams for their Cologne squad? Up to now, they've been very gracious when it came to buying parts, so why not buy cars at the same rate?

In turn, ProDrive would be allowed to buy whomever's cars.

My guess is that Spyker wouldn't like the idea.

f1manoz · 16 Oct 2007, 16:04 (Ref:2041902)

This news doesn't surprise me. Toyota came in wanting and expecting wins and Championships, and after this long without even a win, it's getting embarrassing and no wonder they want to pull the plug.

Toyota would be better off supplying engines and perhaps buying into a team like Williams.

jab · 16 Oct 2007, 16:10 (Ref:2041908)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aysedasi

Should never have left sportscars.........

Or rallying

I hope if they do go it doesn't persuade other teams to go as well. Renault and Honda in particular. But then it'd serve F1 right for relying on manufacturers too much

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