Home  
Site Partners: SpotterGuides Veloce Books  
Related Sites: Your Link Here  

Go Back   TenTenths Motorsport Forum > Single Seater Racing > Formula One

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 17 Oct 2011, 00:15 (Ref:2972317)   #126
bjohnsonsmith
Race Official
20KPINAL
 
bjohnsonsmith's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
United States
London, England
Posts: 23,144
bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!
Quote:
Originally Posted by wnut View Post
Following the death of Dan Wheldon at the 2011 Las Vegas IndyCar race, the closed cockpit question has to be asked once again.
Would it have been possible to prevent this horrible result?

How many others escaped through sheer dumb luck?

Footage of 2011 Las Vegas (fatal) accident.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d1qmMPnLL1U
Possibly. Does anyone know the exact nature of Dan Wheldon's accident? It's not easy to make out who is who, because the helicam is fairly high up above the track.
bjohnsonsmith is offline  
__________________
"If you're not winning you're not trying."
Colin Chapman.
Quote
Old 17 Oct 2011, 00:16 (Ref:2972318)   #127
tux
Veteran
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
United Kingdom
United Kingdom
Posts: 4,857
tux should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridtux should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridtux should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
I do not think anything could have been done to save Dan, the impact was violent enough for the Roll hoop to fail. As for the other drivers, i think it is sheer luck no one else suffered any lasting injury's especially when you consider the sort of accident Power had.

Autosport reported that Dans car hit another cars rear left wheel which catapulted him through the air, the car twisting in mid-air smashing into the wall/catch fence at an almost unabated speed.
tux is offline  
Quote
Old 17 Oct 2011, 00:33 (Ref:2972328)   #128
Nicholosophy
Veteran
 
Nicholosophy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Australia
Brisbane, Queensland, Australia
Posts: 1,120
Nicholosophy should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridNicholosophy should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridNicholosophy should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
I would be in favour of fighter jet style cockpits. They would need to have some sort of feature to allow quick removal should a driver need to escape quickly.
Nicholosophy is offline  
Quote
Old 17 Oct 2011, 00:59 (Ref:2972342)   #129
Purist
Veteran
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
United States
Wichita, Kansas, USA
Posts: 5,892
Purist is going for a new world record!Purist is going for a new world record!Purist is going for a new world record!Purist is going for a new world record!Purist is going for a new world record!Purist is going for a new world record!
I have to agree that, considering the roll hoop was destroyed, I don't think there's any measure available to us that could have prevented this outcome.

I'm not convinced that a NASCAR Sprint Cup car could go full-on, roof-first, into a debris fence, and adequately protect the driver at a track like Atlanta, Michigan, or Daytona. And I hope we never have to find out.
Purist is offline  
__________________
The only certainty is that nothing is certain.
Quote
Old 17 Oct 2011, 01:05 (Ref:2972344)   #130
bjohnsonsmith
Race Official
20KPINAL
 
bjohnsonsmith's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
United States
London, England
Posts: 23,144
bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Purist View Post
I have to agree that, considering the roll hoop was destroyed, I don't think there's any measure available to us that could have prevented this outcome.

I'm not convinced that a NASCAR Sprint Cup car could go full-on, roof-first, into a debris fence, and adequately protect the driver at a track like Atlanta, Michigan, or Daytona. And I hope we never have to find out.
For the roll hoop to fail, it must have come into contact with something incredibly unyielding. It was mentioned there was a gouge in the track surface.
bjohnsonsmith is offline  
__________________
"If you're not winning you're not trying."
Colin Chapman.
Quote
Old 17 Oct 2011, 01:10 (Ref:2972347)   #131
Purist
Veteran
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
United States
Wichita, Kansas, USA
Posts: 5,892
Purist is going for a new world record!Purist is going for a new world record!Purist is going for a new world record!Purist is going for a new world record!Purist is going for a new world record!Purist is going for a new world record!
My guess is that it hit one of the support posts for the debris fence.
Purist is offline  
__________________
The only certainty is that nothing is certain.
Quote
Old 17 Oct 2011, 01:16 (Ref:2972349)   #132
bjohnsonsmith
Race Official
20KPINAL
 
bjohnsonsmith's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
United States
London, England
Posts: 23,144
bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Purist View Post
My guess is that it hit one of the support posts for the debris fence.
You're probably right. From the altitude of the helicam, it was hard to make out what was happening.
bjohnsonsmith is offline  
__________________
"If you're not winning you're not trying."
Colin Chapman.
Quote
Old 17 Oct 2011, 01:27 (Ref:2972353)   #133
wnut
Veteran
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 8,088
wnut has a real shot at the championship!wnut has a real shot at the championship!wnut has a real shot at the championship!wnut has a real shot at the championship!wnut has a real shot at the championship!
Some accidents are simply not survivable for any number of reasons, and this may have been one.
The roll bar failing however is not necessarily an indication that the accident was not survivable. If the roll bar takes the full impact directly on its leading edge it absorbs all the force at the point most likely to tear it out of the car, if a leading structure is in place such as supermodifieds, this may prevent debris hitting the driver directly and also deflect a lot of the energy off the roll bar and keep it intact.
The fighter style canopy proposed by NickoGP above may be enough to deflect enough energy.
wnut is offline  
Quote
Old 17 Oct 2011, 01:50 (Ref:2972367)   #134
vancecooley
Rookie
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
United States
United States
Posts: 66
vancecooley should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
There was actually an ARCA crash in the 90's where a car hit roof first into the catch fence at Charlotte and was decapitated. I like the closed cockpit like in the redbull car idea, however, i'm not sure anything would have prevented today's tragedy.
vancecooley is offline  
Quote
Old 17 Oct 2011, 01:57 (Ref:2972371)   #135
Teretonga
Veteran
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 4,346
Teretonga is going for a new world record!Teretonga is going for a new world record!Teretonga is going for a new world record!Teretonga is going for a new world record!Teretonga is going for a new world record!Teretonga is going for a new world record!Teretonga is going for a new world record!Teretonga is going for a new world record!
Ive looked at the video of Dans accident, at normal speed and in slow motion.

Video from the roll hoop camera of Will Power is also available and will went airborne at much the same time as Dan. In Will's case the camera is finally obliterated but not before fire and also other debri flies past. In Will's video a front wheel also folds up and passes close to his head.

Its not pretty in slow motion but at normal speed it is frightening. Everything happens so quickly there is no way you can steer around it.
Dan got caught going to the low side but two cars in front collide and he launcheds off the rear, over the top into the wall.
Even if the hoop hadn't collapsed, or a canopy had been in place it creates other scenarios.
1) The hoop is crushed and the driver ,if unhurt can't escape.
2) Fire breaks out and the driver cant escape without serious burns even assuming fire crews are quickly on the scene and effective.
3) Canopies also create the problem of visibility and reflection because cars have surrounding environmental factors and not all Bernies races are in deserts (yet).

In 1967 Jack Brabham tried an aircraft style enveloping windscreen at Monza but it was discarded. One of the reasons was because of the variations in light and visual perception caused by reflections created by the trees that lined parts of the track. It didn't reduce lap times enough to make the experiment worth pursuing and the visual problems created far more issues than it was worth. 44 years later we probably have advancements in materials etc to overcome some of those factors but other issues remain.
Cockpit access in the event of an accident is another issue especially if the driver is incapacitated. sports cars have more room to move then formula cars.
Any number of other possibilities can also be dreamt up.
There are no easy solutions but I would be wary of assumptions we can eliminate injury scenarios from motorsport any more than we can eliminate the prospect of a bloody nose from a rugby match.

Last edited by Teretonga; 17 Oct 2011 at 02:03.
Teretonga is offline  
Quote
Old 17 Oct 2011, 03:26 (Ref:2972401)   #136
speedreader
Racer
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Australia
Posts: 232
speedreader should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Could the integrity of a fighter cockpit canopy be maintained using the general shape to provide a full windscreen frontage & high sides for protection but still with an elongated opening at the top to allow drivers to step in & out still ?

From memory I think I have seen versions of this is offshore powerboat racing...
speedreader is offline  
__________________
Life is sport, play hard
Quote
Old 17 Oct 2011, 07:35 (Ref:2972464)   #137
Nicholosophy
Veteran
 
Nicholosophy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Australia
Brisbane, Queensland, Australia
Posts: 1,120
Nicholosophy should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridNicholosophy should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridNicholosophy should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by speedreader View Post
Could the integrity of a fighter cockpit canopy be maintained using the general shape to provide a full windscreen frontage & high sides for protection but still with an elongated opening at the top to allow drivers to step in & out still ?

From memory I think I have seen versions of this is offshore powerboat racing...
Perhaps. I'm not sure how much more effective it would be though.

They could include fire safety systems in the cockpits (automatic extinguishers and the like) that could go off in the case of fire detected in or around the cockpit. It's never going to be 100% effective though.

If risks can be minimised then it should be considered.
Nicholosophy is offline  
Quote
Old 17 Oct 2011, 11:21 (Ref:2972582)   #138
Marbot
Retired
20KPINAL
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
United Kingdom
Posts: 22,897
Marbot is going for a new lap record!Marbot is going for a new lap record!Marbot is going for a new lap record!Marbot is going for a new lap record!Marbot is going for a new lap record!Marbot is going for a new lap record!
Whatever happens, I certainly hope that no one gets all 'knee-jerky' about this.
Marbot is offline  
Quote
Old 17 Oct 2011, 17:05 (Ref:2972751)   #139
bjohnsonsmith
Race Official
20KPINAL
 
bjohnsonsmith's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
United States
London, England
Posts: 23,144
bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marbot View Post
Whatever happens, I certainly hope that no one gets all 'knee-jerky' about this.
Me too; that's not what's needed at the moment but proper analysis.
bjohnsonsmith is offline  
__________________
"If you're not winning you're not trying."
Colin Chapman.
Quote
Old 17 Oct 2011, 22:05 (Ref:2972958)   #140
Teretonga
Veteran
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 4,346
Teretonga is going for a new world record!Teretonga is going for a new world record!Teretonga is going for a new world record!Teretonga is going for a new world record!Teretonga is going for a new world record!Teretonga is going for a new world record!Teretonga is going for a new world record!Teretonga is going for a new world record!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marbot View Post
Whatever happens, I certainly hope that no one gets all 'knee-jerky' about this.
Unfortunately I think that that is exactly what is happening in the form of comments from all sorts of sources.

While there are lessons to be learnt from what happened its not about any one factor. There are lessons and things to be learnt in several spheres.

While Dan's impact was not survivable (and I have heard a few unconfirmed reports of what injuries he had) 14 others did survive with a few minor injuries, one requiring overnight hospitalisation but nothing serious and later released.

Given the impacts and fire, debri, speed and the number of cars involved that is extraordinary.
It doesn't diminish the sadness of losing Dan, but we need to be properly relective about how little serious injury occurred to the other 14 drivers involved in the crash.

For a drivers perspective:
Danica Patricks comment the day before...

"The track is nice and smooth and we'll be three-wide out there, which will be exciting," she said. "The race is going to be crazy - and the crashes will be spectacular. Nothing would let me turn the page better than winning here."



Read more: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/201...#ixzz1b4y7JQF8
Teretonga is offline  
Quote
Old 17 Oct 2011, 22:28 (Ref:2972973)   #141
Hubble
Veteran
 
Hubble's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
England
Bishops Stortford, Herts
Posts: 751
Hubble should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridHubble should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by Teretonga View Post
14 others did survive with a few minor injuries, one requiring overnight hospitalisation but nothing serious and later released.

Given the impacts and fire, debri, speed and the number of cars involved that is extraordinary
Yes, extraordinary....but the deal breaker for me is that there were 15 cars involved to start with...says a lot about the racers, the racing, and the environment in which they compete...and I think that's what they need to look at...huge multi-car pile ups aren't exactly rare in Indycar...

Having 34 open wheeled cars racing line astern/side by side at 220mph on a short section of track, with no run off areas leading to concrete walls and catch fencing is asking for trouble....somebody do a risk analysis on that and see where it takes you...
Hubble is offline  
__________________
Give me the wisdom to know what is right, the courage to change what is wrong, and the bank balance to support me when I can't tell the difference
Quote
Old 17 Oct 2011, 22:34 (Ref:2972980)   #142
Hubble
Veteran
 
Hubble's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
England
Bishops Stortford, Herts
Posts: 751
Hubble should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridHubble should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by Teretonga View Post
For a drivers perspective:
Danica Patricks comment the day before...

"The race is going to be crazy - and the crashes will be spectacular"
Seems almost to glorify/belittle the incidents...bet she's regretting saying that now....

Considering she could well have been caught up in a 'spectacular' crash it seems a pretty stupid thing to say...very blase...
Hubble is offline  
__________________
Give me the wisdom to know what is right, the courage to change what is wrong, and the bank balance to support me when I can't tell the difference
Quote
Old 17 Oct 2011, 23:01 (Ref:2973002)   #143
bjohnsonsmith
Race Official
20KPINAL
 
bjohnsonsmith's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
United States
London, England
Posts: 23,144
bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hubble View Post
Yes, extraordinary....but the deal breaker for me is that there were 15 cars involved to start with...says a lot about the racers, the racing, and the environment in which they compete...and I think that's what they need to look at...huge multi-car pile ups aren't exactly rare in Indycar...

Having 34 open wheeled cars racing line astern/side by side at 220mph on a short section of track, with no run off areas leading to concrete walls and catch fencing is asking for trouble....somebody do a risk analysis on that and see where it takes you...
The biggest pile up I rember during the CART era was the US 500 at Michigan, the field was smaller, the race was about to green but the track was a lot wider, with run off onto the grass infield. LVMS is too small in terms of track width for a large field and no run off, the inevitable will happen and it did.
bjohnsonsmith is offline  
__________________
"If you're not winning you're not trying."
Colin Chapman.
Quote
Old 17 Oct 2011, 23:06 (Ref:2973005)   #144
Teretonga
Veteran
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 4,346
Teretonga is going for a new world record!Teretonga is going for a new world record!Teretonga is going for a new world record!Teretonga is going for a new world record!Teretonga is going for a new world record!Teretonga is going for a new world record!Teretonga is going for a new world record!Teretonga is going for a new world record!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hubble View Post
Yes, extraordinary....but the deal breaker for me is that there were 15 cars involved to start with...says a lot about the racers, the racing, and the environment in which they compete...and I think that's what they need to look at...huge multi-car pile ups aren't exactly rare in Indycar...

Having 34 open wheeled cars racing line astern/side by side at 220mph on a short section of track, with no run off areas leading to concrete walls and catch fencing is asking for trouble....somebody do a risk analysis on that and see where it takes you...
If you had run off you could have greater problems.
There are any number of awkward scenarios to dream up but looking back histroically at Indycar/IRL/CART there are markers to give an indication of some of the problems.

1. 34 cars on a 1.5 mile oval. Indy has 33 on a 2.5 mile oval. If the ratio was the same then should have it been limited to 20 cars? But then 28 cars can run safely at Milwaukee... So I don't think its all about numbers.

2. The formula has high downforce, mandated wing angles, that create a high degree of downforce and drag. this means you are virtually flat at a high speed course so anybody who can steer reasonably well can jump in and go quickly... which is why you get the big bunches of cars... that creates some dirty air and a big tow...so everyone goes fast but is it as artifically close as using DRS and KERS....

3. When you get a touch at 225mph you are going faster than the rotation speed of a jumbo jet and with a flat bottom you just take off.... I have a picture of Will Power looking like he is in a flypast 3 metres off the ground. In the CART days they had tunnels and small wings, low drag configurations that tended to keep the cars on the ground far better in a touch. Not impossible to fly but fewer and lower flights.

4. When airborne you fly over the wall into the catch fencing. Catch fencing is there to protect spectators not drivers. In several Indycar/CART oval accidents (Tony Renna, Kenny Brack, Ryan Briscoe and now Dan, (along with road track example Jeff Krosnoff) hitting the catch fencing is a contributor to the car breakup. In all these incidents car brealup was horrendous, all except Dans. His car was largely intact so its not about the integrity of the car.

5. The fencing stretches before it deflects and gives way, but the cabling doesn't to the same degree so pieces of suspension get between the cabling and the wire and get ripped away. The supporting poles obviously don't deflect much so its like hitting a tree if you hit one. In Krosnoffs accident there was a lamppost behind the concrete barrier but in front of the fence as he careered along the fencing and he hit that.

Dans car was basically intact and the cell undamaged when he came to rest. The airbox scoop /top of the roll hoop had disappeared and the wheels and rear wing but otherwise intact. Will Power had a much higher speed impact with the wall but rear 3/4 on, which is probably why he had a sore back.

There are lessons to be learned but ripping off at Indycar, the IRL, or oval racing is not the answer. People are emotionally raw and upset at the loss of life but I got a picture of hundreds of people's bodies yesterday, burnt alive in sectarian violence in an African nation.... Dans death is a tragedy but he is not the only person who died yesterday.
We all need some perspective.
Teretonga is offline  
Quote
Old 17 Oct 2011, 23:17 (Ref:2973013)   #145
bjohnsonsmith
Race Official
20KPINAL
 
bjohnsonsmith's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
United States
London, England
Posts: 23,144
bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Teretonga View Post
34 cars on a 1.5 mile oval. Indy has 33 on a 2.5 mile oval. If the ratio was the same then should have it been limited to 20 cars? But then 28 cars can run safely at Milwaukee... So I don't think its all about numbers.
Milwaukee has quite a different configuration and doesn't have the high banking like LVMS and requires a different driving style, with the driver having to slow for the corners. At LVMS they are flat out all the time.
bjohnsonsmith is offline  
__________________
"If you're not winning you're not trying."
Colin Chapman.
Quote
Old 17 Oct 2011, 23:25 (Ref:2973020)   #146
JeremySmith
Veteran
 
JeremySmith's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2000
United Kingdom
Austin Texas
Posts: 11,402
JeremySmith is going for a new world record!JeremySmith is going for a new world record!JeremySmith is going for a new world record!JeremySmith is going for a new world record!JeremySmith is going for a new world record!JeremySmith is going for a new world record!
Way too much speed for a short oval with zero escape area to head for when it all goes wrong IMHO....
JeremySmith is offline  
Quote
Old 17 Oct 2011, 23:35 (Ref:2973025)   #147
Hubble
Veteran
 
Hubble's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
England
Bishops Stortford, Herts
Posts: 751
Hubble should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridHubble should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by Teretonga View Post
There are lessons to be learned but ripping off at Indycar, the IRL, or oval racing is not the answer
I don't see anywhere in my post where I am ripping off at Indycar, and I've too much respect for those no longer with us to start a debate here now....
Hubble is offline  
__________________
Give me the wisdom to know what is right, the courage to change what is wrong, and the bank balance to support me when I can't tell the difference
Quote
Old 17 Oct 2011, 23:35 (Ref:2973026)   #148
Hubble
Veteran
 
Hubble's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
England
Bishops Stortford, Herts
Posts: 751
Hubble should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridHubble should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by JeremySmith View Post
Way too much speed for a short oval with zero escape area to head for when it all goes wrong IMHO....
Yep.
Hubble is offline  
__________________
Give me the wisdom to know what is right, the courage to change what is wrong, and the bank balance to support me when I can't tell the difference
Quote
Old 17 Oct 2011, 23:57 (Ref:2973030)   #149
Teretonga
Veteran
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 4,346
Teretonga is going for a new world record!Teretonga is going for a new world record!Teretonga is going for a new world record!Teretonga is going for a new world record!Teretonga is going for a new world record!Teretonga is going for a new world record!Teretonga is going for a new world record!Teretonga is going for a new world record!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hubble View Post
I don't see anywhere in my post where I am ripping off at Indycar, and I've too much respect for those no longer with us to start a debate here now....
It wasn't directed at you personally. It was a general comment about a whole pile of negative stuff that has been coming from a number of sources.
My apologies if you took it personally.
Teretonga is offline  
Quote
Old 18 Oct 2011, 00:07 (Ref:2973033)   #150
Teretonga
Veteran
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 4,346
Teretonga is going for a new world record!Teretonga is going for a new world record!Teretonga is going for a new world record!Teretonga is going for a new world record!Teretonga is going for a new world record!Teretonga is going for a new world record!Teretonga is going for a new world record!Teretonga is going for a new world record!
Quote:
Originally Posted by bjohnsonsmith View Post
Milwaukee has quite a different configuration and doesn't have the high banking like LVMS and requires a different driving style, with the driver having to slow for the corners. At LVMS they are flat out all the time.
I underlined all. 34 is probably too many of that particular configuration with those cars as they are presently configured, but was within track limits....
Some of it is common sense, some about wisdom and discretion. For the drivers it hasn't been about numbers or speed. Its about patience, care, maturity and experience. They seem to accept the risk but want some people to grow up a bit and take their time to play the race out so the sorts of mistakes that lead to such situations don't happen.

Judging from Dario's and Chip's comments that will probably happen later this year or before next season starts. Things will get sorted out as part of the outcome of this tragedy. Its just a very sorry way to learn and have to deal with things.
Teretonga is offline  
Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Closed cockpits gttouring Sportscar & GT Racing 5 27 Mar 2003 22:59
FIA to introduce a 'spy' into F1 cockpits Super Tourer Formula One 25 12 Feb 2003 14:29
A step closer to reality... Gt_R Formula One 4 20 Dec 2000 07:47
Open v. Closed Cockpits...Why? Heeltoe6 Sportscar & GT Racing 4 8 Jun 2000 07:04


All times are GMT. The time now is 11:10.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Original Website Copyright © 1998-2003 Craig Antil. All Rights Reserved.
Ten-Tenths Motorsport Forums Copyright © 2004-2021 Royalridge Computing. All Rights Reserved.
Ten-Tenths Motorsport Forums Copyright © 2021-2022 Grant MacDonald. All Rights Reserved.