Toe in, toe out

***Chris Y*** · 19 Jan 2001, 22:43 (Ref:59441)

.. And no, it's not some new sort of dance routine

As a racer on a budget, I don't want to fork out for laser thingies to check my toe-in.. Has anyone got any ideas for a device which will do the same thing (roughly) for less cash?

Bit of string perhaps?

THR · 20 Jan 2001, 12:26 (Ref:59497)

all u really need is something stiff.. like a box section of steel the width of the car.
bolt to this some arms that reach back to the wheels. and up to the C/L.
then compare the difference between them.

or u could buy a thing to do it with for 150quid i think. using a sight and no lasers

rds · 21 Jan 2001, 17:49 (Ref:59650)

Just as a matter of interest, F1 boys still use string alongside the car with ally bars mounted off the front & rear of the car. With rack stops in place & the bars sticking out evenly from the centre line of the car, no need to recheck where it is provided they were mounted correctly the first time. Just remember it has to be square. Don't get confused by the front & rear wheeltracks being different lengths. I have used laser gauges before in sportscars. They were quick & easy to setup & with finer tolerances than string, weren't always repeatable. I put this down to the fact that the gauges need to be used on the same level setup floorspace as the car sits on to avoid any discrepancies. The cost of them is too extreme too. You could always mount a laser pen off the bars on one end mounted at the wheel centrelines & a mirror marked to indicate the laser is parallel to the centre of the car at the other end. By placing a wide rule next to the rim, you would break the contact of the laser & it would appear on your rule. Its not so much what you use, in the end, its the operator who normally makes the mistake.

racer10 · 26 Jan 2001, 00:18 (Ref:60367)

You can take a piece of angle aluminium, Straighten your wheels, get a buddy to take the angle and put it on the sidewall of the tire. Take your piece of angle and do the same. Take a tape measure,run it across the car, in front of the tires. Keeping the tape straight, measure the distance. Repeat the step, except this time, do it behind the tires. Take the difference of hte two measurements, there is your toe. Clear as mud, eh?

Tony Harman · 29 Jan 2001, 11:24 (Ref:60971)

Hi Chris - racer 10 is right the quick easy way is as he describes - but I'm going to describe an enhancement on that which will allow you to measure to a tenth of a degree easily !
What I'm talking about can be seen in the Demon Tweeks catalogue, sold as a toe in guage by Intercomp for about £55, (also Gunsons used to market something similar called a "wheeltrue") you can make this yourself for the price of a tape measure (if you don't already have one...)
OK - You need 2 pieces of angle or U section, ally is easier, say with about 2 - 3 inch sides so it can easily be placed flat against the tyre wall. you then cut a slot in each end to take the tape of the tape measure, now the important bit is to have these slots precisley 22 1/2 inches apart (or 722mm) - tell you why in a minute. It is also useful to drill a couple of holes at the ends to secure bunjy cords. Then simply place the guage horizontally against the outside of the wheel, as near the vertical centre as you can, (on a Mini it will be on the lower half of the wheel), set it level and fix it in place using the bunjy stretched around the back of the wheel, repeat on the other wheel. Now take the tape measure clip it in the slot of one plate and measure across to the other plate and note the measurement in mm, now repeat at the other end of the plate,(be sure the tape does not foul on anything under the car which would stretch the tape and distort the measurement).
Simply subtract one from the other, the number you end up with in cm is the number of degrees. i.e 1cm = 1 degree, 5mm = 1/2 degree, 1mm = 1/10 degree. This is why it is important to get the slots precisley 22 1/2 inches apart to produce that calcualtion. If you don't believe me you can work it out using the Sine of the angle etc.
It's a bit difficult to explain in text but take a look at the DT catalogue for a picture of the Intercomp plates or mail (or PM) me and I'll send you a picture and diagram. Because of the distance of 22 1/2 inches this guage is independant of wheel size so will work on any rim, one thing to be careful is any tyre wall bulge near the bottom of the wheel which could lead to an inaccurate measurement, I used to pump the Mini tyres up to about 45psi to get rid of any bulge. (But remember to let them down again before you race !!!). Hope this helps. TH
Oh and you MUST make sure the steering is centralised before doing any track measurements.

***Chris Y*** · 29 Jan 2001, 20:01 (Ref:61051)

Cheers for the suggestions, one and all

I'll probably follow a few suggestions here and build my own with measuring tape and angle brackets

Delman · 10 Feb 2001, 11:33 (Ref:63878)

A brief intro, I am fairly new to this game. Ex Wembley (left in 69) middle-aged !!! living in Sydney for the past 30 years. Lately come to Historic sportscars.
Regarding the question of toe in. I made myself a simple Trammel bar with which to measure and compare toe. A length of Aluminium Angle long enough to span the track of the vehicle, with another two shorter pieces at right angles, long enough to reach up to axle height. One of them pointed, the other with gradations marked every 1/16" across the top.
Set the pointed end at the centre of the tread of one wheel (or mark the centre of the rubber) and read off the corresponding point on the other wheel. Compare front and back and you have your toe-in (or out).
Pretty simple and agricultural but it works for me!