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Old 12 Mar 2010, 10:28 (Ref:2650198)   #26
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It doesnt matter if it's FIA approved or not, it's the only circuit we have to run on & I include anyone who uses circuit in this. The problem as far as I can see is about exposure letting the public know about events and about Mondello, I agree that John, Ian and every one over there is working hard to promote the track but the budget given the gate returns must be very small. It is up to MI to help promote the sport I wonder what the licence fees are used for and what split is apportioned to marketing ?
Classes, cars, presentation can all be discussed later but if we dont get bums on seats in Mondello were would we go it if closed ?????????????

I took my car to the park last year to help promote rallycross (and to give it a lash, way too much ) perhaps some more promotion on the ground at other events with static displays and hand outs would help, I know ALMC have a great car show in May which I am sure they would include a RX section and maby some demo runs at other events like the modified car show in Mondello, but we go back to the winter events I think a couple in sping / summer would not be a bad thing and lets see if we can address the track cleaning issue
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Old 12 Mar 2010, 10:56 (Ref:2650214)   #27
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the wrc round was not lost ,it is on a rotation and will be back,
I don't think you're right there

http://www.sports-city.org/news_deta...idCategory=115


http://www.motorstv.com/car/rally/wr...ss-out-in-2011

And with increased Middle Eastern interest, it's unlikely to be back.

Also when I first heard about it in Autospsort a month ago, the organisers and competitors cited not happy with the location as another reason. It's too remote and expensive for them.
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Old 12 Mar 2010, 10:57 (Ref:2650216)   #28
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Not if we want to compete outside the Republic. We kinda need MI in order to have the FIA logo on the licence which is needed to race in the North, UK or anywhere else really.
Well then don't race outside of the Republic. Focus on getting the foundations correct first or you'll have nowhere to race.
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Old 12 Mar 2010, 13:27 (Ref:2650293)   #29
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Well then don't race outside of the Republic. Focus on getting the foundations correct first or you'll have nowhere to race.
I'm not that well versed on all things Rallycross, but in that scenario, Dermot Carnegie would never have won the British Championship (did Ollie O Donovan win it as well?) George Treacy , Derek Tohill etc etc could not compete at British or European level.
Not to mention the countless circuit racers that have cut their teeth in Mondello and moved on to success around the world.

Would it not be a shame that we deprive ourselves of these ambassadors for Irish Motorsport?

You are IMHO 100% correct that the foundations need to be under pinned, but walking from MI would be a backward step.
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Old 12 Mar 2010, 14:14 (Ref:2650324)   #30
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I'm not that well versed on all things Rallycross, but in that scenario, Dermot Carnegie would never have won the British Championship (did Ollie O Donovan win it as well?) George Treacy , Derek Tohill etc etc could not compete at British or European level.
Not to mention the countless circuit racers that have cut their teeth in Mondello and moved on to success around the world.

Would it not be a shame that we deprive ourselves of these ambassadors for Irish Motorsport?

You are IMHO 100% correct that the foundations need to be under pinned, but walking from MI would be a backward step.
...but MI doesn't work for Irish motorsport as it currently is. What the hell do those guys do considering motorsport is going down the pan here? So something must be done or there is no future - there won't be Carnegie's, Tohill's etc. to come through as the opportunity won't be there.

There needs to be a complete overhaul and that regime replaced. Can this be done with proper racing men who are not living 50 years in the past? What is the process for challenging the status quo - or are people afraid to?
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Old 12 Mar 2010, 15:06 (Ref:2650363)   #31
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How many people help, Support, or Join, Carlow Car Club or County Kildare Motor Club ?
These are they 2 clubs that run all the Rallycross events and organize the Championship rounds. Just an idea but its a clubman sport here but not many support the clubs running the sport.
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Old 12 Mar 2010, 15:24 (Ref:2650377)   #32
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Tom, with respect, there's a reason people don't join those clubs. Originally, the catchment for those clubs would have been marshals coming off of the bank. Now we don't have the marshals either - and some of that is thanks to the high handed and downright rude behaviour of some of the organising clubs (not necessarily the ones mentioned by the way) over the last few years. This is in no way a reflection on the small group of hardworking and fair people, like yourself, Graham, Robert (just a couple of names off the top of my head) and all of those guys, so please do not take it as such.

We're caught in a vicious circle there - but the attitude of the organising clubs, although it's improved, still needs to change some more if they hope to attract any new members.

That being said, I don't think anyone is decrying the efforts of the org clubs in this thread - it's more about the official authority for motorsport in Ireland and querying exactly what they're doing to stop circuit racing from dying.
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Old 12 Mar 2010, 19:17 (Ref:2650550)   #33
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I think the fact that 2 clubs run the championship may be holding the championship back from developing. It would make more sense that one body/person/company be responsible for everything to do with rallycross in ireland. At the moment, nobody promotes the events, mondello take the entries, each club runs the day and we go home until the next event.
A strong case must be there to employ somebody to run everything from start to finish, in conjunction with M.I. If a well publicised championship improves spectator turnout, mondello will have no option but to find free dates to run some spring/summer events.
LHMC are pushing the UK championship and Peter Stott pushes the open championship and both get the numbers out. PS has called me before every round in nutts corner to see if i can go. Thats not heard of down here. I get emails every week from the uk telling me whats happening with drivers, sponsors, circuits etc.

A more professional approach is needed to take things to the next level, thats not dissing the people that do the hard work running events/championships at the moment, just a suggestion on how things could improve.

Mondello seem to have a good marketing team for their corporate stuff, they have all the relevant contacts to run an event, maybe they could look at the option of running a championship. Who else will benefit from increased revenues at the gate.
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Old 12 Mar 2010, 21:26 (Ref:2650637)   #34
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That being said, I don't think anyone is decrying the efforts of the org clubs in this thread - it's more about the official authority for motorsport in Ireland and querying exactly what they're doing to stop circuit racing from dying.
That's the point right there. This is what needs to be tackled first. The individual organisations thereafter.
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Old 12 Mar 2010, 23:58 (Ref:2650730)   #35
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Ok here,s the thing if you want to have a go at MI or setting up an new governing body ( & good luck with that one !) start a new thread, I was interested in what suggestions came up to promote improve rallycross over here !
like
Promotion, how about a gate ticket comp with the winner getting a few laps in the lunch break in one of our cars
Media coverage as I suggested
getting the uk lads back etc etc

Other wise Im out
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Old 13 Mar 2010, 00:00 (Ref:2650731)   #36
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Mondello seem to have a good marketing team for their corporate stuff, they have all the relevant contacts to run an event, maybe they could look at the option of running a championship. Who else will benefit from increased revenues at the gate.
Good idea I wounder would John go for it
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Old 13 Mar 2010, 17:25 (Ref:2651124)   #37
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the thing about mondello is you can't see the ciruit ,all you see from the grand stand is the dunlop corner and chequered flag you can,t get round to see the circuit
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Old 13 Mar 2010, 22:03 (Ref:2651318)   #38
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Ok here,s the thing if you want to have a go at MI or setting up an new governing body ( & good luck with that one !) start a new thread, I was interested in what suggestions came up to promote improve rallycross over here !
like
Promotion, how about a gate ticket comp with the winner getting a few laps in the lunch break in one of our cars
Media coverage as I suggested
getting the uk lads back etc etc

Other wise Im out
So Ramah, simple promotion while maintaining the status quo is the answer eh? The only reason RX and all other Irish motorsport is knackered is because of lack of promotion?

Come on on man, see the big picture. Promotion is not the holy grail that's going to solve everything. The foundations must be right and they ain't regardless of promotion. Who should do the promoting? I would have thought that promotion without the full backing of the governing body is pointless.

Exactly what do you want to promote and what do you want to achieve from promoting it? You don't have a sport that can be promoted right now to any degree of success - you must have something to promote!! Like any successful sport, it is only succsessful when it is profitable - who makes it profitable? Fans unltimately. There is nothing about Irish Rallycross as it stands (or the majority of the Irish circuit scene) which is going to be appealing to fans. Using Rallycross as an example because this is the main pont of the thread, get the Euro RX back and then you'll have thousands of fans in the door and a useful vehicle for your 'promotion' and a means of getting more people into the sport.

If you or anyone else think that Euro RX or BRDC are just 'one even't and we can survive without that,' well then you're deluding yourselves because quite simply, you can't - and aren't as you continue your slow and painful decline.
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Old 16 Mar 2010, 09:04 (Ref:2653307)   #39
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So Ramah, simple promotion while maintaining the status quo is the answer eh? The only reason RX and all other Irish motorsport is knackered is because of lack of promotion?
If you or anyone else think that Euro RX or BRDC are just 'one even't and we can survive without that,' well then you're deluding yourselves because quite simply, you can't - and aren't as you continue your slow and painful decline.
Firstly I diddn't say "simple promotion" you did ! I mearly sugested that promotion is one way to heighten to promote the sport and I did say that loosing the BRDA was a bad blow to our championship but the BRDA is "just 1 round" all be it the biggest round of the year, what I was interested in opinion on was how we could get more than 50 spectators into the stand for the rest of the rounds !
As for the ERC, I agree that getting a round of the ERC over to our shores again would be great however Mondello would have to spend a considerable amount of money upgrading the track to get it over again which I dont think would be a runner.
Look I think rallycross is a great sport and has had some great racing this year even with a low supercar entry I was just interested in some simple suggestions to get the sport heading in the right direction but I dont think from this thread that there are any forthcoming so Im out......................
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Old 16 Mar 2010, 13:03 (Ref:2653464)   #40
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Look I think rallycross is a great sport and has had some great racing this year even with a low supercar entry I was just interested in some simple suggestions to get the sport heading in the right direction but I dont think from this thread that there are any forthcoming so Im out......................
A typical but unsurprising response - run away because everyone isn't agreeing with you. Symptomatic of how Irish motorsport is run, don't listen to wider views and challenge them with logical argument.

Look at the mess the once great Circuit of Ireland rally is in because of infighting. We've lost the Irish round of the WRC because of poor organisation - the location was not at all popular with the drivers and teams, it was deemed too remote and expensive but was where the various rally factions insist it be because their egos wouldn't allow common sense to prevail. Sure it's in a lowly populated area so what did they expect?!? It should have been located closer to Dublin where the bulk of everything is to have any chance.

Yes, I did say simple promotion to highlight the fact that you think promotion is the answer. You need a good product to promote - Irish RX doesn't have a good product to promote in it's current guise. You are just not going to get bums in seats in the middle of winter to watch some tatty old 205's running around.

If you think promotion is the way forward, then do it instead of talking about it and hoping others will do it instead.

I am motorsport mad, I'm hardcore - but haven't been to an Irish RX event in years. I'll only go if the British round is on and it in itself can be quite boring. There are only so many stockhatch and junior RX heats I can take and the schedule invariably runs way behind with large gaps between heats and finals. That used to be the great appeal of RX - snappy races - bam, bam, bam, one after another. You didn't have a chance to be bored as a spectator.

Irish RX can't survive by itself - like I said elsewhere above, you need spectators to generate revenue to be able to build the sport. Getting the British RX and ERC over is vital and possible with a bit of work. This builds momentum and gives you a basis from which to build. The problem is, you think the sport is grand as it is - it ain't.

So rather than throwing your toys out opf the pram, be realistic, be open and enagage. A good start point would be to take a damn good look at the state of the sport and accept that fundamental change is needed if your sport is to grow and survive.

I despair for Irish motorsport, I really do.
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Old 16 Mar 2010, 14:19 (Ref:2653509)   #41
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. I am motorsport mad, I'm hardcore - but haven't been to an Irish RX event in years. I'll only go if the British round is on and it in itself can be quite boring. There are only so many stockhatch and junior RX heats I can take.
Think you may have contradicted yourself there. I love motorsport and a full grid of stock hatch or minis can provide just as good racing as the supercars. Especially as the supercars tend not to be as evenly matched. See minicross A final at Lydden recently as proof.

I think you are having a go at the wrong person too; lack of promotion is not the responsibility of Ramah. Maybe you should practice what you preach and do something about your grievances, instead of just ranting on a forum.

I have no affiliations or knowledge of Irish RX, so am definitely speaking out of turn, but your last message ruffled feathers. This thread wasnt a "ready, steady, rant", but an "Irish RX isn't where we want it to be, how can we improve it?" thread. Forget "wider views", none of your posts address the topic at hand; improving RX - in fact they do the opposite.
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Old 16 Mar 2010, 14:24 (Ref:2653514)   #42
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That used to be the great appeal of RX - snappy races - bam, bam, bam, one after another. You didn't have a chance to be bored as a spectator.
Actually in fairness, that hasn't been the case for quite a while now - with one or two exceptions, RX events are run very well - the old delays while someone's brother's cousin's mate finished his smoke and his coffee before finally deciding to head over to assembly are long gone.

As for the rest of the thread, there's really nothing here I didn't expect to see - from either side. I guess it's time to find a new hobby because I give it 2 years before there's nothing left to marshal.
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Old 17 Mar 2010, 10:19 (Ref:2654065)   #43
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The only reason RX and all other Irish motorsport is knackered is because of lack of promotion?

Best of luck to all with this. We made huge efforts to do same TV etc etc and that was during the good times when the grids were packed with exciting Division 1 cars
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Old 17 Mar 2010, 13:02 (Ref:2654168)   #44
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Best of luck to all with this. We made huge efforts to do same TV etc etc and that was during the good times when the grids were packed with exciting Division 1 cars
Agreed, i was waiting for someone to point it out; If the BTCC cant attract punters to mondello in the droves that it does everywhere else (despite the BTCC having a huge promotion budget that dwarfs any promotion any of us tried to do!) we sure as hell cant.

To the question " What can we do to improve the sport? " i take a view of:

1.) Its as big as its ever going to be on a island as big as ireland
2.) Rallycross just doesnt have the drama of manufacturers, pit girls or the well known drivers outside of the circle; Because of this Joe public wont give a crap about rallycross.

And i can hear the "oh but michael the UK and European national championships are well known", and that would be a perfectly valid argument if all things were equal; Irelands an island of comming close to 4 Million people, most of which are Soccer, Rugby and Hurling mad so it leaves you with a small audience of people who are acctually interested in motorsport.

If you have a constructive idea, plan it out and do some research then bring it up on the night, the problems of increasing awareness etc. about rallycross arent going to be solved on 10 Tenths or without an unresearched argument on the night.

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Old 17 Mar 2010, 17:06 (Ref:2654327)   #45
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Have to agree with most of the points by shhh and cryos. I competed in Stock Hatch for a few years at the peak of things and loved every minute of it ( well apart from a few issues) but anyway I went to spectate at the last round and I have to admit i was pretty bored by what i saw, I'm in no way knocking Rallycross because given the opportunity i would go back to SH in an instant but if people think its a good watch then they are fooling themselves, this is just my opinion but Rallycross should accept what it is and run with it. People love competing in it and so long as you attract enough people to do that then enjoy it but given the majority of the cars on display are not exciting to watch and the time of the year its on then RX will never attract big crowds. I was massively disappointed by what the supercar class has become, it really is a 4wd modified class now and some of the 2wd cars like M Coynes nova for example are better to watch. I don't know if we'll ever get back to what the supercars were like with JMC & DC & GT etc but if not then you definitly can't expect people to fill the grandstand. Again I don't mean to offend anyone because I fully appreciate the effort people are still putting in to be on the grid.

One thing i would wonder with this thread is "do things actually need to change"
When I raced I didn't care if there where 10 or 100 people watching. Now obviously if Mondello say they need X amount of spectators then it does need to change but if because of the time of year its on and theres no competition for the dates and there happy just getting entries when the rest of the motorsport world is quiet then does it matter that spectators are thin on the ground. The Competitors still enjoy their day.

Just my opinion mind.
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Old 17 Mar 2010, 18:12 (Ref:2654375)   #46
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I understand what you're saying irx, but to get sponsorship, you need to supply spectators. Without sponsorship, no money, without money, no cars because people can't afford to compete
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Old 17 Mar 2010, 21:26 (Ref:2654520)   #47
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I understand what you're saying irx, but to get sponsorship, you need to supply spectators. Without sponsorship, no money, without money, no cars because people can't afford to compete
Very true, but in reality most logos on any RX car are companies that are linked to the driver in a personal way, do you not think?
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Old 18 Mar 2010, 09:26 (Ref:2654737)   #48
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More than likely, but that doesn't mean that they'll continue to do so if there is no potential financial benefit.
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Old 21 Mar 2010, 10:23 (Ref:2657108)   #49
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Open Championship In Mondello Nov 21st 2010!

Just recieved an Email from Peter @ the Rallycross Open Championship with some revised dates which includes A round in Mondello in Nov 21st 2010!! Fair play to Peter for his persistance in bringing the RD over to our shores! lookin forward to it already!
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Old 1 Apr 2010, 18:37 (Ref:2665026)   #50
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so any word on the forum i couldn't make it due to work commitments . . . . .so what went down any big changes in the bag for next year ?
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