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Old 1 Aug 2017, 04:12 (Ref:3756585)   #1
FPV8U
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FPV8U should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Supercar RECs, StartUps & Performance

With so many drivers sniffing around, could we finally see those REC's come off ice and be pressed into service?

The field has looked more appealing with those couple extra rows on the grid filled thanks to the wildcards.
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Old 1 Aug 2017, 04:13 (Ref:3756586)   #2
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Originally Posted by FPV8U View Post
With so many drivers sniffing around, could we finally see those REC's come off ice and be pressed into service?

The field has looked more appealing with those couple extra rows on the grid filled thanks to the wildcards.
Are they still available, or have they been absorbed thus increasing everyone's shareholding
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Old 1 Aug 2017, 05:59 (Ref:3756591)   #3
one five five
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one five five should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridone five five should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
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With so many drivers sniffing around, could we finally see those REC's come off ice and be pressed into service?
Who is going to fund the purchase of these RECs, letalone fund the actual running of the cars afterwards?
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Old 1 Aug 2017, 06:51 (Ref:3756599)   #4
Umai Naa
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Umai Naa should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridUmai Naa should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
Yep. Anyone who thinks breaking into the maingame as a team, is financially viable at this point in time, is kidding themselves.

When was the last time a new start-up came into the sport, and where are they now?
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Old 1 Aug 2017, 10:59 (Ref:3756658)   #5
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Yep. Anyone who thinks breaking into the maingame as a team, is financially viable at this point in time, is kidding themselves.

When was the last time a new start-up came into the sport, and where are they now?
Erebus. ahead of walkinshaw and the factory nissans. driver in the top ten
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Old 1 Aug 2017, 11:02 (Ref:3756659)   #6
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Mixer should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridMixer should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridMixer should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridMixer should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
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Erebus. ahead of walkinshaw and the factory nissans. driver in the top ten
If you call spending at least $40 million viable?

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Old 1 Aug 2017, 11:02 (Ref:3756660)   #7
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chavez should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridchavez should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridchavez should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
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Erebus. ahead of walkinshaw and the factory nissans. driver in the top ten
Not sure a change in ownership and name equals a "start-up."
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Old 1 Aug 2017, 11:06 (Ref:3756661)   #8
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Not sure a change in ownership and name equals a "start-up."
thats how the series works though, you have to buy a licence.

also new cars and motors in that deal
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Old 1 Aug 2017, 11:26 (Ref:3756667)   #9
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According to your comments previously about Volvo that makes Erebus mid fielders
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Old 1 Aug 2017, 11:30 (Ref:3756670)   #10
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According to your comments previously about Volvo that makes Erebus mid fielders
relevance?
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Old 1 Aug 2017, 11:47 (Ref:3756675)   #11
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I think before new recs/cars are brought in, a minimum standard has to be set. TheLDM cars are a joke, prehistoric second hand buckets of bolts. There are by far better equipped teams in super2. Matt Stone has superior machinery, engineering and funding than LDM by far. Maybe time for supercars to give someone else a shot. I understand LDM own the REC, but are they really doing it justice?
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Old 1 Aug 2017, 12:08 (Ref:3756683)   #12
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Mixer should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridMixer should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridMixer should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridMixer should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
Relegation is the answer!
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Old 1 Aug 2017, 12:23 (Ref:3756695)   #13
Umai Naa
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Umai Naa should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridUmai Naa should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
Last proper start-up was LDM.

All the others since, were either buy-ins/outs, mergers, RECs serviced by other teams, or doing that prior to going solo (Tekno, CSR).

Relegation/promotion system wouldn't really work. You'd have team after team dropping out each year, with no one else having the wherewithal to step up. Which is why there are a few RECs still sitting in Mr Warburton's bottom drawer.
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Old 1 Aug 2017, 12:55 (Ref:3756707)   #14
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Relegation is the answer!
Perhaps a full annual review as to why the team who finishes last in the team's championship a couple of years in a row should be allowed to hang onto their RECs

Kelvinmonster style....
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Old 1 Aug 2017, 13:01 (Ref:3756710)   #15
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I wonder if the conditions of the RECs have been re-lawyered since the last time Mr L. Dumbrell dragged it through the courts?
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Old 1 Aug 2017, 14:18 (Ref:3756721)   #16
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V8 Fireworks should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridV8 Fireworks should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridV8 Fireworks should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
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I think before new recs/cars are brought in, a minimum standard has to be set. TheLDM cars are a joke, prehistoric second hand buckets of bolts.
What nonsense. The LDM vehicle with a seasoned driver placed only 0.1 sec from the 3rd slowest car in qualifying (Mr Moffat in the fancied brand new and shiny Wilson Security GRM Commodore) and only 1.1 seconds from pole position. A tiny gap to the rest.

Clearly the engine and car preparation is more than acceptable, and well within 105%. It does not suggest a vehicle from "Planet Mork", running some 100hp down on the competition with clapped out shock absorbers... nothing of the sort. It suggests a well prepared vehicle with comparable power to the competition, competent vehicle setup and properly valved shock absorbers prepared with care.
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Old 2 Aug 2017, 08:56 (Ref:3756867)   #17
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Erebus. ahead of walkinshaw and the factory nissans. driver in the top ten
Yes too many people knock them and say, SBR-Erebus is old, KR-Nissan Motorsport is old, HRT and Walkinshaw are the only ones really the same, the other two were essentially brand new teams as of 2013
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Old 2 Aug 2017, 09:03 (Ref:3756868)   #18
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If you call spending at least $40 million viable?

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That's the issue, too many do gooders saying $40 million is a waste if its racing. Yes $40 million is viable, here's why I think so

1. They are enjoying it as a sport, no different to anyone paying $100 entry fees for Cricket, Football, Soccer.

2. Team sponsors get their name out there in which they wouldn't if it weren't for V8s some wouldn't be around now.

3. Motorsport, regardless of what anyone says, is why we have the car safety we have now, without it we would still be in a car equal to T models, people say but we would have advanced, No we wouldn't have to where we are now. In a sport things are developed well and quickly.

A waste of money in my opinion is (without trying to be too political) giving those on a boat more then the diggers get for protecting our country. Another waste is CEO's and mayors of town councils on almost $500,000 pay a year. Old politicians no longer working earning more then the current prime minister. Not attacking you personally but it annoys me when I see the view of racing is a waste of money
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Old 2 Aug 2017, 09:09 (Ref:3756869)   #19
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Last proper start-up was LDM.

All the others since, were either buy-ins/outs, mergers, RECs serviced by other teams, or doing that prior to going solo (Tekno, CSR).

Relegation/promotion system wouldn't really work. You'd have team after team dropping out each year, with no one else having the wherewithal to step up. Which is why there are a few RECs still sitting in Mr Warburton's bottom drawer.
I disagree, I'd say Erebus, Nissan Motorsport, CSR, GRM were all essentially 'new' to a degree to the point that they had to completely change their cars, from that point of view nothing was the same between a Volvo/ Nissan to a Commodore in terms of componentry same for Ford and Mercedes, so for Volvo and Nissan to come in and do as well as they have given they were 20 odd years off the pace I'd say they made a good choice and the teams were 'new' to a degree, just because they had the same personnel doesn't mean its old. Where did LDM get their crew, other teams so on the logic of LDM were the first new team is wrong as they had crew from other teams.
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Old 2 Aug 2017, 09:18 (Ref:3756873)   #20
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What nonsense. The LDM vehicle with a seasoned driver placed only 0.1 sec from the 3rd slowest car in qualifying (Mr Moffat in the fancied brand new and shiny Wilson Security GRM Commodore) and only 1.1 seconds from pole position. A tiny gap to the rest.

Clearly the engine and car preparation is more than acceptable, and well within 105%. It does not suggest a vehicle from "Planet Mork", running some 100hp down on the competition with clapped out shock absorbers... nothing of the sort. It suggests a well prepared vehicle with comparable power to the competition, competent vehicle setup and properly valved shock absorbers prepared with care.
Well based on some comments I have seen here before, how old a chassis is doesn't matter, it does to a degree, but comments here are knocking LDM for having a go. Reality is the haters haven't got a thing against LDM, they aren't dangerous on track, which is the golden rule and they are adding money to V8s, it isn't as bad as we may all say it is if they can skin a car and then get it out after a crash. To a degree, chassis mileage can work against the car as it will get 'stiffer' but the main part of it is
1. Driver talent
2. A good engineer
3. R&D on the car
4. Sponsorship (which for LDM has picked up a massive amount for LDM #62 this year)

I have seen the comments too here having a go at others earlier in the year and LDM turmoil saying where was Triple 8 in 2003, well they just need to remember that. If the team isn't dangerous then it has a right to be there. The only team that didn't warrant being on the grid that I can think of was TKR and that was due to a dangerous car as their drivers said. No one from LDM has said its dangerous, just slow and they don't want to be slow. But I do agree with your comment in regards to their good day pace
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Old 2 Aug 2017, 09:52 (Ref:3756877)   #21
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Umai Naa should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridUmai Naa should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
Utter nonsense.

LDM had absolutely nothing, besides a several million dollar payout from CAMS. He bought a REC from Tasman, a car from Walkinshaw, rented a factory and set it all up from scratch from the get-go. No mergers, or buy-outs.

Erebus, despite what Betty keeps saying year-in, year-out was never technically a new team. Simply a buy-out. That the entire existing workforce and sponsor base left over the course of the following two years, is entirely irrelevent.

GRM has been around for 50+ years. You'd be drawing the world's longest bow to even suggest that they were a new team once they started churning out Volvos using virtually the same personnel that churned out the previous batch of Commodores.

CSR had that REC parked elsewhere and serviced by three different teams before taking it, the core sponsor group, and his driver to do his own thing. Hardly a new team.

Kellys/Nismo were a buy-out of Perkins Motorsport, and subsequent merger of what was left of the two former HSVDT RECs they owned. Not a clean slate concept either.

There's your history lesson, sunshine.
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Old 2 Aug 2017, 10:09 (Ref:3756880)   #22
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Utter nonsense.

LDM had absolutely nothing, besides a several million dollar payout from CAMS. He bought a REC from Tasman, a car from Walkinshaw, rented a factory and set it all up from scratch from the get-go. No mergers, or buy-outs.

Erebus, despite what Betty keeps saying year-in, year-out was never technically a new team. Simply a buy-out. That the entire existing workforce and sponsor base left over the course of the following two years, is entirely irrelevent.

GRM has been around for 50+ years. You'd be drawing the world's longest bow to even suggest that they were a new team once they started churning out Volvos using virtually the same personnel that churned out the previous batch of Commodores.

CSR had that REC parked elsewhere and serviced by three different teams before taking it, the core sponsor group, and his driver to do his own thing. Hardly a new team.

Kellys/Nismo were a buy-out of Perkins Motorsport, and subsequent merger of what was left of the two former HSVDT RECs they owned. Not a clean slate concept either.

There's your history lesson, sunshine.
For someone who has just done a massive history lesson, it was a waste of time as you don't get what I am saying. How did LDM hire people, certainly not spuds off the street. GRM may have 50 years of experience but 50 years doesn't guarantee getting a dirty old Volvo to the front, Read what I have said in my opinion and I can have at a guess that a number of people in the industry would say something similar. How I phrased 'new' wasn't in LDM 'new' but it was new to the point that it was an unknown challenge, in which anyone watching would say a 'new' challenge
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Old 2 Aug 2017, 10:22 (Ref:3756884)   #23
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Clutching at straws.
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Old 2 Aug 2017, 10:39 (Ref:3756888)   #24
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one five five should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridone five five should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
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3. Motorsport, regardless of what anyone says, is why we have the car safety we have now, without it we would still be in a car equal to T models, people say but we would have advanced, No we wouldn't have to where we are now. In a sport things are developed well and quickly.
And yet most Supercar supporters speak with pride when they say that Supercars and modern motor racing has little in common with road cars because they are boring to watch


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I disagree, I'd say Erebus, Nissan Motorsport, CSR, GRM were all essentially 'new' to a degree to the point that they had to completely change their cars, from that point of view nothing was the same between a Volvo/ Nissan to a Commodore in terms of componentry same for Ford and Mercedes, so for Volvo and Nissan to come in and do as well as they have given they were 20 odd years off the pace I'd say they made a good choice and the teams were 'new' to a degree, just because they had the same personnel doesn't mean its old. Where did LDM get their crew, other teams so on the logic of LDM were the first new team is wrong as they had crew from other teams.
On that logic nearly every team on the grid was new in 1985 and 1993....

The same team changing cars does not make them a new team
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Old 2 Aug 2017, 10:58 (Ref:3756894)   #25
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"And yet most Supercar supporters speak with pride when they say that Supercars and modern motor racing has little in common with road cars because they are boring to watch."

Motorsport in all forms has every bit to do with modern safety. Anyone who says motorsport didn't help is a naïve braindead because it has helped in many ways
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