Home  
Site Partners: SpotterGuides Veloce Books  
Related Sites: Your Link Here  

Go Back   TenTenths Motorsport Forum > Single Seater Racing > Formula One

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 23 Jun 2011, 15:29 (Ref:2904786)   #801
BobHWS
Veteran
 
BobHWS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
United States
Winston-Salem, NC
Posts: 539
BobHWS should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridBobHWS should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by vin13 View Post
You just don't give up do you?
This is the 2nd most popular thread in the 10-Tenths F1 forum over the last year (currently 798 replies and 37,856 views). As evidenced by this week's news, it's a topic that's very much an ongoing story. In case you don't understand, 10-Tenths is an Internet forum whose purpose is to facilitate open discussion and exchange of opinions about all things motor racing. I'm expressing my opinion. You're free to offer your own opinions on this topic. No matter how frequently or forcefully you do so, I won't ask you to "give up." If you want nothing but feel-good comments and opinions about the proposed Austin F1 race, there's a Facebook group for that.
BobHWS is offline  
__________________
Vive les F1 Babes de Montreal!
Old 23 Jun 2011, 15:57 (Ref:2904790)   #802
Flyin Ryan
Veteran
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
United States
Carolina del Norte
Posts: 944
Flyin Ryan should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by BobHWS View Post
No chance of getting a better deal from Bernie now. That ship has sailed.

The way that Montreal got a better deal ($15M/year vs. Austin's $25-30M/year) was to call Bernie's bluff when he tried to triple their rights fee after the 2008 race. Montreal told Bernie they could live without F1 and so they lost the race in 2009.

A year later, under pressure from the teams and the falling popularity of races in nontraditional locations, Bernie realized that F1 needed Montreal more than Montreal needed F1 and so he had to give Montreal the same deal ($15M/year) that it had offered during the negotiations in 2008. I think it's the only time in Bernie's life that he lost a negotiation.
I think the USGP leaving Indianapolis went the same way. Bernie tried to up the rights fee and George said no and walked away. F1 resolution going on now by the way, if you go to bjohnsonsmith's Twitter link the latest tweet provides an audio link.
Flyin Ryan is offline  
Old 23 Jun 2011, 16:08 (Ref:2904792)   #803
chillibowl
Veteran
 
chillibowl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Canada
winnipeg, canada
Posts: 9,716
chillibowl is the undisputed Champion of the World!chillibowl is the undisputed Champion of the World!chillibowl is the undisputed Champion of the World!chillibowl is the undisputed Champion of the World!chillibowl is the undisputed Champion of the World!chillibowl is the undisputed Champion of the World!chillibowl is the undisputed Champion of the World!chillibowl is the undisputed Champion of the World!chillibowl is the undisputed Champion of the World!chillibowl is the undisputed Champion of the World!chillibowl is the undisputed Champion of the World!
Quote:
Originally Posted by BobHWS View Post
No chance of getting a better deal from Bernie now. That ship has sailed.
do we know that? this is not BE's first rodeo so he knows in life you always have to renegotiate and once you are there you can make more than what you gave up at the bargaining table. hence some places get better deals.

he has renegotiated with Montreal and Silverstone with his tail between his legs, he has with Spa and the German races, understandably Monaco gets a free ride, he wont pay his own fees for Paul Ricard so will ultimately make a deal with the French, never hear complaints from Italy about it so they must have a great deal already, circumstances in Japan justify financial help there, and at some point he will have to expect less money from the Australians if for no other reason than maintaining sanity at ten-tenths. one could say BE loves to renegotiate.
chillibowl is online now  
__________________
Home, is where I want to be but I guess I'm already there
I come home, she lifted up her wings guess that this must be the place
Old 23 Jun 2011, 16:20 (Ref:2904796)   #804
bella
Race Official
Veteran
 
bella's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 1998
France
Posts: 16,760
bella is the undisputed Champion of the World!bella is the undisputed Champion of the World!bella is the undisputed Champion of the World!bella is the undisputed Champion of the World!bella is the undisputed Champion of the World!bella is the undisputed Champion of the World!bella is the undisputed Champion of the World!bella is the undisputed Champion of the World!bella is the undisputed Champion of the World!bella is the undisputed Champion of the World!bella is the undisputed Champion of the World!
bernie does like to renegotiate but in all the cases you mentioned, hasn't he had the opportunity to pretend, even to just himself, that he's scored a victory? he thinks he defeated silverstone because he finally got them to rebuild the pit building when in fact he brought donington to its knees, turned the british f1 scene into a bit of a farce and trashed silverstone itself in the process. never mind that, bernie got what he wanted...

as such the best way of getting him to renegotiate with the organisers of the us gp would be to put out some press releases denying some form of issue he had raised was in fact an issue, create a few rumours then return to mr e with cap in hand making like you were doing him a favour?
bella is offline  
__________________
devils advocate in-chief and professional arguer of both sides
Old 23 Jun 2011, 16:45 (Ref:2904809)   #805
bjohnsonsmith
Race Official
20KPINAL
 
bjohnsonsmith's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
United States
London, England
Posts: 23,143
bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!
Quote:
Originally Posted by bella View Post
bernie does like to renegotiate but in all the cases you mentioned, hasn't he had the opportunity to pretend, even to just himself, that he's scored a victory? he thinks he defeated silverstone because he finally got them to rebuild the pit building when in fact he brought donington to its knees, turned the british f1 scene into a bit of a farce and trashed silverstone itself in the process. never mind that, bernie got what he wanted...

as such the best way of getting him to renegotiate with the organisers of the us gp would be to put out some press releases denying some form of issue he had raised was in fact an issue, create a few rumours then return to mr e with cap in hand making like you were doing him a favour?
In the case of Silverstone I think Bernie had no option but to give them the GP after ruining Donington. It was coming up for the 50th anniversary of F1 and the British GP, which was first held at Silverstone in 1950 and the first F1 GP, so I think not having a British GP at all would have been a major PR faux pas on Bernie's part and Bernie can never be seen to be wrong. As it is Silverstone have secured the race for 17 years and they pay the reduced fee because of its historical significance.
bjohnsonsmith is offline  
__________________
"If you're not winning you're not trying."
Colin Chapman.
Old 23 Jun 2011, 17:29 (Ref:2904838)   #806
ujoint
Racer
 
ujoint's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
United States
usa, virginia
Posts: 332
ujoint should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridujoint should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid

Quote:
Originally Posted by chillibowl View Post
do we know that? this is not BE's first rodeo so he knows in life you always have to renegotiate and once you are there you can make more than what you gave up at the bargaining table. hence some places get better deals.

he has renegotiated with Montreal and Silverstone with his tail between his legs, he has with Spa and the German races, understandably Monaco gets a free ride, he wont pay his own fees for Paul Ricard so will ultimately make a deal with the French, never hear complaints from Italy about it so they must have a great deal already, circumstances in Japan justify financial help there, and at some point he will have to expect less money from the Australians if for no other reason than maintaining sanity at ten-tenths. one could say BE loves to renegotiate.
NO SLAM CHILLI. Just using your words.

Let's not forget it is now the summer of 2011. That's right, one year from an F1 race in Austin, Texas. Now someone is going to decide this funding (who will raid the general fund of the state of Texas) as a distressed buyer to save face. BE just has to sit back and watch and collect the check.

There is a light shining on these current legal procedures and it is this.
You are seeing what the financial dealings of putting an f1 show together in America are really like even before the green flag drops. When it is over we should know what politicians put it to the taxpayers of Texas.

No wonder this thing disappeared from Indianapolis, Indiana.
ujoint is offline  
__________________
Fast is not fast enough.
Old 23 Jun 2011, 18:43 (Ref:2904874)   #807
BobHWS
Veteran
 
BobHWS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
United States
Winston-Salem, NC
Posts: 539
BobHWS should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridBobHWS should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
A corrected link to the Autoweek.com editorial:

As the editorial director of America's largest racing magazine and a guy who has grown up around racing and racers, who has worked for a professional race team and who was weaned on horsepower and Castrol fumes, I have two words for the Austin City Council and its constituents before Thursday's vote to bless the proposed 2012 Austin Grand Prix:

Run away.


Read more: http://www.autoweek.com/article/2011...#ixzz1Q7jhlZkM
BobHWS is offline  
__________________
Vive les F1 Babes de Montreal!
Old 23 Jun 2011, 20:16 (Ref:2904914)   #808
ujoint
Racer
 
ujoint's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
United States
usa, virginia
Posts: 332
ujoint should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridujoint should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
The Austin, Texas city counsel meeting is live if you want to watch it. The vote is fast approaching and many world viewers are causing the servers for this dog and pony show to crash. Personally, I cannot make any kind of opinion on this matter at this time. Stream: http://www.ci.austin.tx.us/channel6/

Last edited by ujoint; 23 Jun 2011 at 20:45.
ujoint is offline  
__________________
Fast is not fast enough.
Old 23 Jun 2011, 20:36 (Ref:2904925)   #809
chillibowl
Veteran
 
chillibowl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Canada
winnipeg, canada
Posts: 9,716
chillibowl is the undisputed Champion of the World!chillibowl is the undisputed Champion of the World!chillibowl is the undisputed Champion of the World!chillibowl is the undisputed Champion of the World!chillibowl is the undisputed Champion of the World!chillibowl is the undisputed Champion of the World!chillibowl is the undisputed Champion of the World!chillibowl is the undisputed Champion of the World!chillibowl is the undisputed Champion of the World!chillibowl is the undisputed Champion of the World!chillibowl is the undisputed Champion of the World!
Quote:
Originally Posted by bella View Post
bernie does like to renegotiate but in all the cases you mentioned, hasn't he had the opportunity to pretend, even to just himself, that he's scored a victory?
yes, he certainly likes looking the part of benevolent dictator.

unfortunately the dictator puts on a wonderful show every couple of weeks and so him winning usually also results in me winning as well. i can live with that.
chillibowl is online now  
__________________
Home, is where I want to be but I guess I'm already there
I come home, she lifted up her wings guess that this must be the place
Old 23 Jun 2011, 20:37 (Ref:2904926)   #810
chillibowl
Veteran
 
chillibowl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Canada
winnipeg, canada
Posts: 9,716
chillibowl is the undisputed Champion of the World!chillibowl is the undisputed Champion of the World!chillibowl is the undisputed Champion of the World!chillibowl is the undisputed Champion of the World!chillibowl is the undisputed Champion of the World!chillibowl is the undisputed Champion of the World!chillibowl is the undisputed Champion of the World!chillibowl is the undisputed Champion of the World!chillibowl is the undisputed Champion of the World!chillibowl is the undisputed Champion of the World!chillibowl is the undisputed Champion of the World!
ujoint, sweet link
chillibowl is online now  
__________________
Home, is where I want to be but I guess I'm already there
I come home, she lifted up her wings guess that this must be the place
Old 23 Jun 2011, 20:48 (Ref:2904933)   #811
ujoint
Racer
 
ujoint's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
United States
usa, virginia
Posts: 332
ujoint should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridujoint should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by chillibowl View Post
ujoint, sweet link
I need my own attorney to figure this out. Wow.
ujoint is offline  
__________________
Fast is not fast enough.
Old 23 Jun 2011, 20:52 (Ref:2904934)   #812
chillibowl
Veteran
 
chillibowl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Canada
winnipeg, canada
Posts: 9,716
chillibowl is the undisputed Champion of the World!chillibowl is the undisputed Champion of the World!chillibowl is the undisputed Champion of the World!chillibowl is the undisputed Champion of the World!chillibowl is the undisputed Champion of the World!chillibowl is the undisputed Champion of the World!chillibowl is the undisputed Champion of the World!chillibowl is the undisputed Champion of the World!chillibowl is the undisputed Champion of the World!chillibowl is the undisputed Champion of the World!chillibowl is the undisputed Champion of the World!
totally.

one point that i heard raised which i havent heard from anyone here bring up is their failure to adequately present a proper environmental assessment. that seems like a major shortcoming.
doesn't seem like the council is too bothered about it though which is weird.
chillibowl is online now  
__________________
Home, is where I want to be but I guess I'm already there
I come home, she lifted up her wings guess that this must be the place
Old 23 Jun 2011, 20:54 (Ref:2904935)   #813
ujoint
Racer
 
ujoint's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
United States
usa, virginia
Posts: 332
ujoint should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridujoint should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by chillibowl View Post
totally.

one point that i heard raised which i havent heard from anyone here bring up is their failure to adequately present a proper environmental assessment. that seems like a major shortcoming.
doesn't seem like the council is too bothered about it though which is weird.
Probably because that place is not in Austin City limits. Things are done differently down there.The scheduled race date for 2012 is less than a year away. No show stoppers if the funding is approved. Just sayin, and I am probably wrong on all fronts.
ujoint is offline  
__________________
Fast is not fast enough.
Old 23 Jun 2011, 21:49 (Ref:2904960)   #814
BobHWS
Veteran
 
BobHWS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
United States
Winston-Salem, NC
Posts: 539
BobHWS should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridBobHWS should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
An Austin radio station reports on the pro-F1 PR blitz at today's council meeting:

The Formula One PR Blitz at City Hall
By Mose Buchele

Want to load up on the latest Formula One paraphernalia? Race over to Austin City Hall.

F1 baseball caps, water bottles and bumper stickers were distributed today in a public relations blitz ahead of City Council's vote on the race track project. So many were given out that white caps speckled the capacity audience in City Council Chambers -- a dramatic image for City Council members from their seats on the dais.

By the time the item came up on the agenda, 243 people had signed up to speak in favor of the project, 26 had signed up against and three had signed up neutral.

Some of those who signed up were, technically, on the clock.

"[Our bosses] told us that they want us all to come down and vote and support," said Abel Leon, one person in a large crowd of construction workers employed at the site of the planned F1 track that attended to show support for the project.

"We're getting paid to be here," said Davonna Long, another construction worker.

Long added that attendance from her crew was voluntary. She said she was at City Hall because she believed F1 was good for the City.

"I think it would continue more jobs for the people that need jobs. I have five kids that I take care of and I need this job," Long said.

City Council is still scheduled to vote on the F1 deal later today.
BobHWS is offline  
__________________
Vive les F1 Babes de Montreal!
Old 23 Jun 2011, 22:16 (Ref:2904972)   #815
bjohnsonsmith
Race Official
20KPINAL
 
bjohnsonsmith's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
United States
London, England
Posts: 23,143
bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!bjohnsonsmith is the undisputed Champion of the World!
Austin City Council have postponed the vote till next Wednesday.

http://www.statesman.com/blogs/conte..._chambers.html
bjohnsonsmith is offline  
__________________
"If you're not winning you're not trying."
Colin Chapman.
Old 23 Jun 2011, 22:49 (Ref:2904981)   #816
ujoint
Racer
 
ujoint's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
United States
usa, virginia
Posts: 332
ujoint should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridujoint should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by bjohnsonsmith View Post
Austin City Council have postponed the vote till next Wednesday.

http://www.statesman.com/blogs/conte..._chambers.html
It is America. Politics as usual. Did you notice all the different groups (ethnic groups that is) wanting their share of the pie (monies earned from f1 events) as a percentage rate determined as of June 23, 2011 and fixed at levels based on today's numbers regardless if those groups decrease in size or even disappear as a group for the length of the f1 contract agreement. I think that contract is currently set at 10 years. What does that have to do with f1? Ans, you want my support, It is gonna cost ya $$$. Just sayin ya all. This kind of wheeling and dealing is not something special to the USA. It just is a little more visible to the man on the street. It is what that man can do about it that counts. Which by the way, probably isn't much. People that actually will watch this race on TV won't give a crap how much it cost or who paid for it long as it ain't them. That will probably be me.

Note: Just a little non-related fact for the overseas followers here. F1 fans living on the east coast of the USA (betting that is a large number) by the way live about 1500 miles from Austin, Tx and probably will not be in attendance at this event based on that long of a driving/flying distance. Is it just me or ... There are some really smelly issues about this whole deal. For starters, exactly who is the attending audience going to be. A large size of attendees needs to be maintained for the full 10 years of the contract. Fast tracking this should really have raised the red flag especially with BE behind the wheel. Trying to keep a lid on the funding/taxation issues is another biggie.

To be continued...
ujoint is offline  
__________________
Fast is not fast enough.
Old 23 Jun 2011, 23:48 (Ref:2904999)   #817
Purist
Veteran
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
United States
Wichita, Kansas, USA
Posts: 5,892
Purist is going for a new world record!Purist is going for a new world record!Purist is going for a new world record!Purist is going for a new world record!Purist is going for a new world record!Purist is going for a new world record!
The geographic problem is that the East is MUCH more densely populated, has less open land, and has more issues with protections, both of environment and historic landmarks. This makes acquiring the land substantially more expensive, and more difficult to find in the first place. These higher-desirability areas have higher costs of living, so you have to pay your workers more, unless you're going to actively engage in some questionable practices. And, of course, having to be more careful about how much damage you do to the surroundings makes everything more expensive, not to mention the extra paperwork and red tape involved.

The track in Austin is expected to cost $250-300 million, and I would expect that it could cost TWICE that if it was in one of those particularly "better" locations.

Now, for reference, the construction costs for tracks like New Jersey and Miller Motorsports Parks were in the $100-150 million range for each one. Both Thunderbolt Raceway and Miller are FIA Grade 2 circuits; I'm not sure what rating the Lightning Circuit at New Jersey has. Both facilities though, certainly are NOT on a small scale.

However, I think this puts into perspective how out-of-kilter the demands of a Grade 1 certification are with the rest of motorsport. On the bright side, I think it shows that either changes will have to be made voluntarily by F1, or these tracks are simply going to price themselves into obsolescence and out of existence.
Purist is offline  
__________________
The only certainty is that nothing is certain.
Old 24 Jun 2011, 00:01 (Ref:2905003)   #818
thebear
Ten-Tenths Hall of Fame
Veteran
 
thebear's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
United States
85mi S. of Daytona, 125mi NE of Sebring
Posts: 1,837
thebear should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridthebear should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Latest News

http://www.grandprix.com/ns/ns23332.html

.
thebear is offline  
__________________
No trees were harmed by this message. However, several million electrons were terribly inconvenienced
Old 24 Jun 2011, 00:04 (Ref:2905004)   #819
JeremySmith
Veteran
 
JeremySmith's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2000
United Kingdom
Austin Texas
Posts: 11,402
JeremySmith is going for a new world record!JeremySmith is going for a new world record!JeremySmith is going for a new world record!JeremySmith is going for a new world record!JeremySmith is going for a new world record!JeremySmith is going for a new world record!
Quote:
Originally Posted by BobHWS View Post
I don't know the exact numbers, but the race has been officially announced as a sell-out the last three years that it was held (2011, 2010, 2008). News media generally report 100,000 3-day tickets sold each year. In my experience, almost all seats are actually filled for qualifying and practice and, if the weather is nice, most seats are filled for Friday practice. So, in general, race day attendance is 100,000+ and 3-day attendance is about 300,000.

Thank you for the numbers Bob I appreciate it..
JeremySmith is offline  
Old 24 Jun 2011, 01:00 (Ref:2905015)   #820
JeremySmith
Veteran
 
JeremySmith's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2000
United Kingdom
Austin Texas
Posts: 11,402
JeremySmith is going for a new world record!JeremySmith is going for a new world record!JeremySmith is going for a new world record!JeremySmith is going for a new world record!JeremySmith is going for a new world record!JeremySmith is going for a new world record!
From one of the smartest people in F1, this is worth reading...

http://joesaward.wordpress.com/2011/...w-predictable/

I am looking forward to meeting Joe Saward just to shake his hand and say thank's..
JeremySmith is offline  
Old 24 Jun 2011, 10:59 (Ref:2905185)   #821
Marbot
Retired
20KPINAL
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
United Kingdom
Posts: 22,897
Marbot is going for a new lap record!Marbot is going for a new lap record!Marbot is going for a new lap record!Marbot is going for a new lap record!Marbot is going for a new lap record!Marbot is going for a new lap record!
Love the ad below the article.
Marbot is offline  
Old 24 Jun 2011, 16:30 (Ref:2905343)   #822
fourWheelDrift
Veteran
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
United Kingdom
Posts: 1,354
fourWheelDrift should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridfourWheelDrift should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridfourWheelDrift should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridfourWheelDrift should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marbot View Post
Love the ad below the article.
Very likely we will not all be getting the same ad but as the one I saw made me smile I guess it was the same, and we are both in the UK I think.
fourWheelDrift is offline  
Old 24 Jun 2011, 18:41 (Ref:2905408)   #823
Ken_T
Rookie
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
United States
Texas
Posts: 66
Ken_T should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
I like to visit Austin, but this is just ridiculous.

I say stop construction, push the race back a year and bring it and the track to Houston. Fourth largest city in the US. Two large airports. Easier travel to and from within the United States and many countries. Plus I can race there when the pros aren't in town. A win win for everyone, especially me.

Then the Austin City Council can wonder why they lost revenue from property taxes and corporate taxes to fund their schools, projects, and salaries.

Fools....
Ken_T is offline  
__________________
Ken
Old 25 Jun 2011, 01:52 (Ref:2905557)   #824
wnut
Veteran
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 8,088
wnut has a real shot at the championship!wnut has a real shot at the championship!wnut has a real shot at the championship!wnut has a real shot at the championship!wnut has a real shot at the championship!
Ads by Google
Ask a Solicitor Online
9 Solicitors Are Online. Australia Law Answers Today: 27.
Law.JustAnswer.com



Yeh right!


wnut is offline  
Old 25 Jun 2011, 21:26 (Ref:2906004)   #825
ujoint
Racer
 
ujoint's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
United States
usa, virginia
Posts: 332
ujoint should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridujoint should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by wnut View Post



Ask a Solicitor Online


9 Solicitors Are Online. Australia Law Answers Today: 27.


Law.JustAnswer.com







Yeh right!


You mean my name is philip (from mumbai) may i help you. Me: don't think so.
ujoint is offline  
__________________
Fast is not fast enough.
Closed Thread

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Grand Prix Manager : French Grand Prix results Wrex Formula One 4 10 Jul 2003 10:25
Grand Prix Manager : French Grand Prix Asp Formula One 6 3 Jul 2003 10:31
Grand Prix 4 ... Why didn't they call it Grand Prix 2.5? DNQ Virtual Racers 18 27 Oct 2002 17:09
How is the USA living up to the Grand Prix? Gerard Formula One 12 26 Aug 2000 18:24


All times are GMT. The time now is 14:42.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Original Website Copyright © 1998-2003 Craig Antil. All Rights Reserved.
Ten-Tenths Motorsport Forums Copyright © 2004-2021 Royalridge Computing. All Rights Reserved.
Ten-Tenths Motorsport Forums Copyright © 2021-2022 Grant MacDonald. All Rights Reserved.