SCCA Trans-Am Series - Page 13

jjvincent · 12 Sep 2017, 20:31 (Ref:3766384)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bob Riebe

I know that and they are spec. horse power but they look different from each other.

Chassis comes from a few different suppliers. Then you pick the body (Ford, Chevy or Dodge) and then pick a motor. It's relegated to a point and there is still some freedom. That's why some are consistently up front and others are not.

The class is a good basic concept and it works good enough because they (Trans-Am) seems to get enough of them to run. They are about $120K complete and are pretty durable due to be a tube frame and using 15" NASCAR wheels, 4 speed NASCAR transmission, along with a sealed motor. They race them in the NA, Europe, Australia, Asia and in the Dominican Republic. Great for a club guy who can run it in GT2 and do a TA here and there. In the end, they hold their value much better than proper racecars because they have a life once you are done running it as opposed to proper cars that mostly sit in a garage.

If you are creative and want to do endurance club events, they work for that too. Slam it into a wall and for a few grand, cut off the tubes and put on new. Back to just like new, No retubbing required. Little downforce, no ABS, no TC and those 15" wheels means, you have to have talent behind the wheel to go fast. Technology won;t save you and downforce won't make you look like a pro out on the track. They only make around 500hp, so that's super easy and reliable for a LS motor, plus they even use fuel injection.

Bob Riebe · 12 Sep 2017, 23:33 (Ref:3766409)

LOL
I was speaking to the winner of the TA class and after awhile said I always preferred prod. based cars.
He said they are dangerous, so I told him they can be made safe.
He gave me a grin and said, well, they are expensive.

jjvincent · 13 Sep 2017, 12:20 (Ref:3766520)

When you are looking for value over a long period of time, you can't beat a tube frame car. Production cars have a limited lifespan but tube frame can go for years and years plus you can use different engines and bodies. They have their place in the market.

NaBUru38 · 30 Mar 2018, 16:13 (Ref:3811961)

Paul Tracy is back!

http://www.racer.com/scca-home/item/...-racing-return

**skycafe** · 30 Mar 2018, 17:03 (Ref:3811974)

Quote:

Originally Posted by jjvincent

Great for a club guy who can run it in GT2 and do a TA here and there.
.

Pretty much like the original TA days. Run car as A Sedan in regionals and nationals in your region, and the odd pro race (TA) that came to your region.

IMSA grew that way too. A Sedan/TA fit into GTO, the bigger SSCA production classes into GTO or GTU. They were field fillers, but you had big grids, which the spectators like.

This iteration of TA puts large field of loud cars on track, squirming around with their limited traction, the driver wrestling the car around. Spectators like that kind of stuff.

broadrun96 · 30 Mar 2018, 21:57 (Ref:3812036)

I'll see how it is tomorrow, SVRA historics and Trans Am at Road Atlanta in 70 degree sunshine. Great spring day after great weather for Ferraris a couple weeks ago

Chris Dysonis running in TA as well, and Butch Lietzinger in the IGT class with a GT3 cup car.

And HSR historics in a month, yup spring at Road Atlanta is looking good.

**skycafe** · 30 Mar 2018, 23:02 (Ref:3812043)

Quote:

Originally Posted by broadrun96

And HSR historics in a month, yup spring at Road Atlanta is looking good.

I love watching the historic T/A pony cars, not lowered to the deck but higher up and with body roll, V8 kicking tail out and thundering up straights. Glory Hallelujah

!

The historic stock car class at RA should be a hoot too.

Have fun!

fieldodreams79 · 31 Mar 2018, 00:45 (Ref:3812047)

Bill Elliott is there but sadly I won't be

Stupid family commitments.

*sigh*

JHamilton · 3 Apr 2018, 22:08 (Ref:3812690)

That was a good event, I was really impressed. Trans Am cars are cool, even though they haven't changed a bit since I was knee high to a grasshopper, but TA2 is the future of that series. Terrific field of very well prepared cars that sound good and are plenty quick. They look great too.

Quote:

Originally Posted by NaBUru38

Paul Tracy is back!

http://www.racer.com/scca-home/item/...-racing-return

He made quite the impression too! I have a video of a rival crew member letting Paul know he is "number one" after the race.

Quote:

Originally Posted by fieldodreams79

Bill Elliott is there but sadly I won't be

Stupid family commitments.

*sigh*

Awesome Bill from Dawsonville.

I have some pretty good photos from the event I will share as soon as I can edit them.

FormulaFox · 4 Apr 2018, 00:07 (Ref:3812703)

Quote:

Originally Posted by JHamilton

That was a good event, I was really impressed. Trans Am cars are cool, even though they haven't changed a bit since I was knee high to a grasshopper, but TA2 is the future of that series. Terrific field of very well prepared cars that sound good and are plenty quick. They look great too.

More accurate to say they're the BASIS of the series future. It'd be a pretty big step backward to just straight up dumb the top class for them.

But there's a few people close to the series who have some pretty good ideas for how to transform TA2 cars into the future of Trans Am, they just need an opportunity to present it to the powers that be.

broadrun96 · 4 Apr 2018, 21:57 (Ref:3812906)

God I hope not, the TA class was a JOKE at Road Atlanta. Only 2 cars were competitive and they spun, Francis slowed to give the position back and still were well out in front going away.

That's not to say they (TA) aren't crazy cars, the "Caddy" the most of all, it looks like it was stepped on and stretched. It's not a bad thing, but definitely looks crazy. And their hips make the Z4 look like they aren't trying at BMW.

But to me, the only race worth anything at Road Atlanta was the TA2. Was a great herd of cars bursting past and everyone was close the whole race. Even PT with a busted wing for half the race.

nasportscar · 5 Apr 2018, 18:38 (Ref:3813058)

I'd like to see Trans Am go only TA2, get rid of the wing, put on a lip spoiler and have 50+ more HP and call it good

FormulaFox · 5 Apr 2018, 19:56 (Ref:3813068)

Quote:

Originally Posted by nasportscar

I'd like to see Trans Am go only TA2, get rid of the wing, put on a lip spoiler and have 50+ more HP and call it good

The TA2 cars already have "lip spoilers" - or splitters, for an easier differentiation of the two. I think what you MEAN to say is that you want them to have BIGGER ones?

But they'd need more than that to really be able to take over as the headline class.

The big problem with bumping TA2 up to headline quality is that they're heavier - about 300 pounds over the TA1 cars. And they're on spec chassis that were designed explicitly to produce cars that meet that weight minimum with minimal variance despite differing engines and bodies. There's more wiggle room for weight reduction on an LMP3 car, and nobody can seem to agree on how much weight could be removed from them.

Here's the idea the guys I've talked to(who are actively working as mechanics on a full-time TA2 entry) feel need to be done to make TA2 ready to headline.

1: Two-inch wider tires. Wheel design can make it possible to fit these without having to change any suspensions components, though one would have to change for sure...

2: Upgraded shocks. The bulk of the suspension wouldn't necessarily HAVE to change, but to get the most out of the widened tires, better shocks would be a must.

3: TA1-spec splitter and wing.

4: Add not an extra 50, but an extra 150 horsepower. Despite being production-based, the engines in TA2 are extremely well-made, robust, and tuned well under what they're capable of - they only produce around 500 horsepower, and these guys figure you could squeeze out 700 or more before you induced major reliability problems, so 650 should be very easy.

5: A stronger rear differential and half-shafts to handle the power. These parts are the most common points of failure on current TA2 cars and would have to be upgraded if the engines were expected to give more power.

They figure these changes would cover around 70-80% of the current performance gap between TA1 and TA2, while costing well under 70-80% of a current competitive TA1 budget - even if this did bump up the cost to current TA1 prices, the attractiveness of a car that's easily convertible between the two classes would likely induce additional interest regardless.

As for getting rid of the wing, when I asked about that they pointed out that the wing design in TA1 was explicitly designed to produce similar downforce and drag to the old spoilers, so that'd be a purely aesthetic change. I'd still do it, personally, because I think TA needs to go back to branding itself as "stock car road racing" to help it's identity, and the going from the wing to a spoiler will help sell that identity.

(yes, this is one of VERY VERY FEW instances where I think a purely aesthetic change is necessary - the fact that there's no performance effect if it's done right DOES enter into it)

fieldodreams79 · 5 Apr 2018, 20:16 (Ref:3813070)

More horsepower + less downforce = a recipe for fun in most series.

FormulaFox · 5 Apr 2018, 20:56 (Ref:3813081)

Quote:

Originally Posted by fieldodreams79

More horsepower + less downforce = a recipe for fun in most series.

They're already pretty low downforce - it's not much, if any, higher than it was during the spoiler era. When the series moved to wings at the turn of the millennium, it wasn't done to increase grip - as was noted to me, the wings were explicitly designed to produce identical drag and downforce levels. The move was made to "make the lines of the car look closer to the road car," which is a stupid line of reasoning since the clear spoilers didn't changes the lines of the car any more than a wing would.

(The spoiler to wing proposal and the reasoning for it was allegedly made by Paul Gentilozzi, which will likely surprise no one)