Mixed Engines for 2017 ??? (Merged x2) - Page 3

EfiOz · 28 Oct 2014, 06:02 (Ref:3469279)

Whatever it is, I do hope it comes with some noise and a bit of spectacle to it. It may not be fashionable to the larger world view but it's still a lot of fun for those that do enjoy it fast'n'loud.

Umai Naa · 28 Oct 2014, 06:28 (Ref:3469285)

Quote:

Originally Posted by mikuni

I used to love WTCC under the S2000 specs. Now, with the turbo 1.6l engines they are quiet and quite frankly, boring. The days of fire breathing, big horsepower turbo engines are gone. They may make big horsepower from small engines, but fire breathing and great sounding they will not be.

The days of Super Touring were special to me, and I remember them fondly. But even with a fantastic formula like this it still failed to impress the majority of the Australasian viewing public. This must be remembered, because the key to the future is the fans. Not manufacturers, not the teams, nothing else if no one is watching it.

ST was sadly about 20 years too early for the Australian public.

WTCC-style S1600 could work here, and the manufacturers already in V8SC have all been involved, or are about to be, at some stage, besides MB.

It just depends whether the fans can look past their rose-tinted servo-bought wrap-around sunnies.

**GTRMagic** · 28 Oct 2014, 06:41 (Ref:3469286)

Maybe its just me, but I LOVE the sound of the Volvo...

Somewhere, some how... I hope we dont lose that NOISE...

mikuni · 28 Oct 2014, 06:58 (Ref:3469293)

Quote:

Originally Posted by GTRMagic

Maybe its just me, but I LOVE the sound of the Volvo...

Somewhere, some how... I hope we dont lose that NOISE...

Same. I love the Erebus AMG engine, however it did sound better in it's early days (when it wasn't running that well). It was like an old F1 engine with the flat plane crank.

But the best thing is the diversity. You can hear the difference between the cars at lower engine rpm. That is what I love about the current spec, and this is something that WTCC and BTCC are missing big time. Noise at all in actual fact.

**GTRMagic** · 28 Oct 2014, 07:44 (Ref:3469300)

Quote:

Originally Posted by mikuni

Same. I love the Erebus AMG engine, however it did sound better in it's early days (when it wasn't running that well). It was like an old F1 engine with the flat plane crank.

But the best thing is the diversity. You can hear the difference between the cars at lower engine rpm. That is what I love about the current spec, and this is something that WTCC and BTCC are missing big time. Noise at all in actual fact.

I am not sure the teev coverage actually does the noise justice...

The Nissan sounds very much like the KR Commodores used to, but not all the time... the Benz has this growl to it..

Maybe the #7-ites (or the #10-ites now..) should be educating the folks at home as to how amazing these things sound at full noise!

TWRv12 · 28 Oct 2014, 10:51 (Ref:3469349)

Noise is energy, so if they put a recovery system after the turbo, there will be little noise.

If they change engine formula, they need a min noise level.

Umai Naa · 28 Oct 2014, 11:21 (Ref:3469356)

Why do we need a recovery system again?

Matt · 28 Oct 2014, 12:58 (Ref:3469374)

Stuff that hybrid crap.

Just make them loud, naturally aspirated motors.

TWRv12 · 28 Oct 2014, 14:49 (Ref:3469402)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Umai Naa

Why do we need a recovery system again?

Because manufacturers want it........

Analysis of F1 engine noise

Quote:

isn’t just about the absolute sound pressure level, there is also a big difference in the sound quality.

http://acousticengineering.wordpress...ars-too-quiet/

Matt · 28 Oct 2014, 19:24 (Ref:3469474)

Screw the recovery system. The manufactures may want it but when they eventually leave(they all do) it's pointless.

TWRv12 · 28 Oct 2014, 21:56 (Ref:3469527)

Jonathan Palmer made a good point on the motorsport podcast: Indycar have V6 turbo with roughly similar power to F1 but at maybe 10 to 20% of F1 unit.

TWRv12 · 28 Oct 2014, 22:52 (Ref:3469546)

Roughly how much is a current engine budget?

**GTRMagic** · 28 Oct 2014, 23:27 (Ref:3469557)

Quote:

Originally Posted by TWRv12

Jonathan Palmer made a good point on the motorsport podcast: Indycar have V6 turbo with roughly similar power to F1 but at maybe 10 to 20% of F1 unit.

The base engine might be similar but the electronics packs, the KERS and the like are not in the IndyCar package ..

TWRv12 · 28 Oct 2014, 23:37 (Ref:3469562)

Quote:

Originally Posted by GTRMagic

The base engine might be similar but the electronics packs, the KERS and the like are not in the IndyCar package ..

Point is the cost of each bhp.

F1 v Indy, $15m v $2m (?) engine package.

**GTRMagic** · 28 Oct 2014, 23:42 (Ref:3469565)

The Indy engine is subsidised significantly by the car manufacturer... where as the F1 engine isnt to the same extent

**FIRE** · 29 Oct 2014, 17:45 (Ref:3469777)

Quote:

Originally Posted by TWRv12

There is a lot to learn in the BTCC, about how not to do things, especially all the fiddling with turbo boost.

But in general the BTCC does a good job with the engines.

TWRv12 · 29 Oct 2014, 23:06 (Ref:3469847)

Quote:

Originally Posted by FIRE

But in general the BTCC does a good job with the engines.

There'd so good, they had to make big changes for next, but can't decide yet on final regs.

Quote:

All engines have now been re-tested and re-validated by both TOCA and an independent specialist company – this will result in a boost level being set for each car/engine type for the season. As the larger amount of success ballast will have a greater effect than before, the lap-time boost level adjustment can be dropped.

http://www.btcc.net/2014/10/28/regul...for-btcc-2015/

**FIRE** · 30 Oct 2014, 17:43 (Ref:3470018)

There are NO big changes just fine tuning.

**GTRMagic** · 31 Oct 2014, 03:28 (Ref:3470146)

Quote:

Originally Posted by TWRv12

There'd so good, they had to make big changes for next, but can't decide yet on final regs.

http://www.btcc.net/2014/10/28/regul...for-btcc-2015/

This seems to be a parity readjustment more than anything... as FIRE says, just fine tuning...

The series has other issues though, with only a couple of factory-assisted outfits in Honda and MG.. and at least one of those complaining about the level of boost & other problems with their package.

**FIRE** · 31 Oct 2014, 18:11 (Ref:3470298)

Quote:

Originally Posted by GTRMagic

This seems to be a parity readjustment more than anything... as FIRE says, just fine tuning...

The series has other issues though, with only a couple of factory-assisted outfits in Honda and MG.. and at least one of those complaining about the level of boost & other problems with their package.

Lack of manufacturers is not a real problem...engine boost and FWD vs RWD is a different story...

**GTRMagic** · 31 Oct 2014, 22:47 (Ref:3470345)

Quote:

Originally Posted by FIRE

Lack of manufacturers is not a real problem...engine boost and FWD vs RWD is a different story...

FWD vs RWD vs AWD has been a BTCC bugbear since forever.. definitely through the SuperTourer era.. weight doesnt fix it.. you cant fix physics..

Either way, the BTCC cars havent and dont sound as loud, as mean, as the V8 engines... except.. that 5 cylinder Volvo... now that was a noise... one easily replicated in an 850 road car...

**FIRE** · 3 Nov 2014, 16:40 (Ref:3471242)

Quote:

Originally Posted by GTRMagic

FWD vs RWD vs AWD has been a BTCC bugbear since forever.. definitely through the SuperTourer era.. weight doesnt fix it.. you cant fix physics..

Either way, the BTCC cars havent and dont sound as loud, as mean, as the V8 engines... except.. that 5 cylinder Volvo... now that was a noise... one easily replicated in an 850 road car...

They don't have the sound but the best racing in touring car world.

Matt · 3 Nov 2014, 22:59 (Ref:3471372)

Quote:

Originally Posted by FIRE

They don't have the sound but the best racing in touring car world.

No way, the V8's do.

**Woolley** · 4 Nov 2014, 13:34 (Ref:3471516)

Quote:

Originally Posted by FIRE

They don't have the sound but the best racing in touring car world.

No way. I'd rather watch the dodgems at the fair.

RED55 · 4 Nov 2014, 17:02 (Ref:3471563)

Personally I Think V8 Supercars has the best series in the world, Enduros, sprints , Bathurst, Gold Coast , a full racing weekend with races on both sat and sunday.

and a main reason is because it doesnt use Turbos !

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