Turn 8 at Clipsal

[b195]

IIRC Skaife's car tripped on the kerb, rolling onto its roof, bouncing off the fence, then back into the middle of the track.

[STEALTHY]

Originally Posted by b195

IIRC Skaife's car tripped on the kerb, rolling onto its roof, bouncing off the fence, then back into the middle of the track.

Brad jones did that in the ozemail falcon, similar accident, or are you thinking of that rollover?

[Axeman444]

Originally Posted by b195

IIRC Skaife's car tripped on the kerb, rolling onto its roof, bouncing off the fence, then back into the middle of the track.

Originally Posted by STEALTHY

Brad jones did that in the ozemail falcon, similar accident, or are you thinking of that rollover?

b195 is correct, was in a Skyline.

Originally Posted by madman16

Take the inside wall off the apex and drivers will still try and steal more "track"

exactly this, with the potential result as above with Skyline & Jones.

SAFER barrier or something equally shock absorbing would be good, but these need to go up against permanent walls do they not?

[Mixer]

Originally Posted by Axeman444

SAFER barrier or something equally shock absorbing would be good, but these need to go up against permanent walls do they not?

I don't think SAFER barrier is good in this case as its going to suck the car in and not let it glance off as some do.

[PVDA]

I haven't reread the entire thread but I'm sure I've mentioned this in the past.

The first year Turn 8 had a huge area on the outside of the corner but the drivers used that run off as race line so they have fiddled with the corner ever since.

Why don't they simply reintroduce the wide "run off" area and install those kerb hopping sensors they've got at Turn 2, if anyone runs wide more than a few times they get pinged.

[Matt]

Originally Posted by Mixer

I don't think SAFER barrier is good in this case as its going to suck the car in and not let it glance off as some do.

A SAFER barrier won't suck a car in.

[TWRv12]

In the past V8SC have been care to say they meet all FIA requirements. A SAFER barrier probably exceeds FIA requirements.

There also parts of many circuits which need FIA High Speed Barriers / TecPro but none use them
http://www.tecpro.fr/f1/english/advantages.php

However the FIA High Speed Barriers / TecPro are not suitable in some cases
http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/groups/f1...tyre-barriers/

[F J Nedos]

Oh how I long for the return of the GP circuit in Adelaide... it won't happen because it involves work...but...

You eliminate turn 8 discussions.

Also, imagine the overtaking opportunities on the long back straight? It's useless as zip up socks right now, as by the time a car pulls alongside another to overtake - yep - they hit turn 8.

That wouldn't happen on the GP circuit. Remember those famous images of Mr Mansell overtaking on the back straight...

Ahhh....

Sure, the corner leading onto the back straight has had its issues, but it's never taken a life and Mika Hakkinen won two world championships after his excursion there.

With the GP circuit layout, I am not talking about something that hasn't been done before. It sometimes make me wonder whether NASA are looking to poach some people from V8 HQ land to assist with their engineering efforts for the space shuttle replacement...

[Tourer]

Originally Posted by TWRv12

In the past V8SC have been care to say they meet all FIA requirements. A SAFER barrier probably exceeds FIA requirements.

There also parts of many circuits which need FIA High Speed Barriers / TecPro but none use them
http://www.tecpro.fr/f1/english/advantages.php

However the FIA High Speed Barriers / TecPro are not suitable in some cases
http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/groups/f1...tyre-barriers/

Last I was aware, SAFER barrier is not compatible with temporary block walls - that MAY have changed but given SAFER design, would be unlikely. Other drawback of SAFER at turn 8 Adelaide is that the block wall is already as far back as it can go and SAFER would effectively narrow the width of the outside of the corner by (depending on the exact SAFER spec) between two thirds and one metre.

Tecpro is OK for F1 cars in some circumstances (your second link points out that tyre buffers are still preferable in other circumstances) but a V8 Supercar, due to it's weight, carries a huge amount of force into a fence and I'd have my doubts if Tecpro would do anything other than get flattened if hit by a V8 at circa 200 kmh.

[mountainstar]

Originally Posted by Tourer

Last I was aware, SAFER barrier is not compatible with temporary block walls - that MAY have changed but given SAFER design, would be unlikely. Other drawback of SAFER at turn 8 Adelaide is that the block wall is already as far back as it can go and SAFER would effectively narrow the width of the outside of the corner by (depending on the exact SAFER spec) between two thirds and one metre.

Tecpro is OK for F1 cars in some circumstances (your second link points out that tyre buffers are still preferable in other circumstances) but a V8 Supercar, due to it's weight, carries a huge amount of force into a fence and I'd have my doubts if Tecpro would do anything other than get flattened if hit by a V8 at circa 200 kmh.

According to the manufacturer, SAFER Barriers can be configured for a temporary street circuit.

To me Turn 8 needs to be pushed back to it's original width with SAFER barriers installed.

[madman16]

[QUOTE=mountainstar;3036809
To me Turn 8 needs to be pushed back to it's original width with SAFER barriers installed.[/QUOTE]

That's probably the best solution.

Restoring the original track will just change it from a turn 8 problem to a turn 10 problem

[Tourer]

Originally Posted by mountainstar

According to the manufacturer, SAFER Barriers can be configured for a temporary street circuit.

To me Turn 8 needs to be pushed back to it's original width with SAFER barriers installed.

Well there you go - they reckon it works on temporary walls:
http://www.nussli.us/fileadmin/conte...r_EN_final.pdf

About a metre thick so it'd need some clever work regarding the space behind the wall but according to this spec sheet, it can be affixed to temp walls so it's certainly been undergoing development.

[STEALTHY]

Originally Posted by madman16

That's probably the best solution.

Restoring the original track will just change it from a turn 8 problem to a turn 10 problem

Rundle Rd is alot shorter than the Bartels section.

Added to the lower entry speeds to the corner, the intersection to Dequetteville Tce is about double the size, so there is plenty of room to have more runoff and have the walls further away.

[Purist]

I have to agree that the full Grand Prix Circuit would be a real improvement as far as dealing with this corner.

The old Jones Straight is significantly shorter than the present Brock Straight. Also already mentioned is the fact that the intersection on the old circuit is much more spacious to accommodate more suitable run-off.

With Brewery Bend in its present state, I actually think it makes accidents more likely. There is less total space to work within since the barriers were realigned. In addition, the narrowing up on entry makes it more probable that drivers will enter the turn on too shallow a line to make the exit without getting into the wall.

In general terms, I think V8s should do a couple of things on their temporary circuits. Since they already have those sensors that tell how far beyond the desired racing line (as desired by the stewards), there is no need for those tire bundles right there on the curbing.

Also, especially for quicker corners, I'm dubious about having exit curbings that the cars can get fully airborne off of when they happen to run a bit wide. The V8 Supercars are heavier than an LMP900 Audi R8, but I definitely remember the video of the Capello/McNish Audi launching over the Turn 8 curb (Turn 8 on the GP course) and into the wall in morning warm-up for the Adelaide race on December 31, 2000.

[peckstar]

im sure Adelaide will love to have such a major intersection shut off for a week.

that will make the race popular with the non attending locals

[Purist]

I see no reason why it would have to be anywhere near to a week of closure.

You only need the full-on barriers in place during and right around the times of the actual track sessions. You can move a few key wall sections and reopen the roads for evening, overnight, and early morning traffic to get through, certainly on Friday, and at least for overnight from Saturday into Sunday. For special parades or displays beyond the practice, qualifying, and race sessions, local police and road crews can marshal things and use temporary barricades, which can be put up and taken down within minutes.

[peckstar]

maybe you need to come to adelaide Purist

The racing is happening during the times when the road is most needed.

but at anypoint , im not the expert, i just know because it says it on there website that most road closures are for a week

[Oran Park Forever]

Take it from a local, despite the old 'Jones/Brabham Straight' intersection being better suited, there is no way the full GP circuit will be used again!

It's been 12 years since the American Le Mans Series used it & Adelaide's traffic volume has increased significantly since 2000, (Eastern Staters can stop laughing now!) resulting in the East side of the city choking under the strain (even with Rundle St opened!) Couple that with March being our 'Events Month' for Festivals, Fringe etc & you have an impossible scenario............even if Bertony Cochranstone moves it to another date!!!

As for Turn 8, not much can be done as many trees would need to be lopped for any modification...........& we all know the answer to that possibility!


.

[Purist]

That may be, but it's not going to be enough to stop my practical, German side from saying that, "The Grand Prix Circuit is the better solution, so that is just how it should be done."

Also, it's unacceptable for the series not to run in the vicinity of Adelaide, but if another serious incident happens at Turn 8, the FIA could force some hands. In that case, I don't see a remotely adequate replacement in the area in the form of a permanent circuit.

[STEALTHY]

Originally Posted by peckstar

maybe you need to come to adelaide Purist

The racing is happening during the times when the road is most needed.

but at anypoint , im not the expert, i just know because it says it on there website that most road closures are for a week

Only selected roads are closed for the whole week.

The rest are closed wednesday, and reopened monday.

Looking at it from 'additional' roads taken out if the GP track was to be used, Rundle road is used less than north terrace (mainly because rundle st is barely walking pace all day) so it wouldn't be that much more of an inconvenience. Even with the closure of grenfell st/east tce intersection, it wouldn't be that big a loss. Because, when drivers know the racing is on, they choose another way to travel home right...

The locals to the track aren't the smartest, look at the pits stuff around. They didn't want a permanent facility, so whats the second option? construction 11 months of the year as opposed to 5 months or whatever it was going to be.