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Old 30 Aug 2017, 11:35 (Ref:3762899)   #16
Taxi645
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Originally Posted by morninggents View Post
I think the OP is being a bit niaive if he thinks fans speaking out will have any effect on either the FIA, the F1 hierarchy or the engine suppliers. When did 'fan power' ever have any influence in F1 and come to think of it - why should it? Further, is 'fan power' united? Would Merc and Ferrari fans join the protest?
It IS naive, but it's just a call from frustration. Without the fans there would be no brand value to be gained for Mercedes and Ferrari, yet we still allow them to deny us what could've been for seven years. Again we don't know how long petrol engines will last in motorsport.

Realistically I don't expect the fanbase to have enough understanding, effectiveness or cloud to change much. Still, we as fans have kept remarkably quiet in light of the current situation.

On the topic of Red Bull, yes they didn't handle the situation with Renault in the most elegant fashion, giving Mercedes and Ferrari a nice excuse. But that's all it was, an excuse, real reason being they didn't want competition. Same for McLaren.

On the matter of how it was in the past. I'm not romanticising the past, I've never said competition was perfect in F1. That's part of F1's problem have always had. Probably I just getting impatient as I have faith in Liberty and Ross Brawn to make a huge improvement in this regard by 2021. It's just a shame that drivers like Alonso, Ricciardo and Verstappen most likely will never have much of a chance from 2014/15-2020. Alonso probably never getting a shot again with a competitive car. To me that's just intensely sad. Being on top of your game, but not being able to fight because of politics.
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Old 30 Aug 2017, 11:47 (Ref:3762901)   #17
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I must admit, I don't really see a lot of difference from the past here. Great drivers and champions have generally always ended up in the best cars and it comes as no surprise at all to me that teams and drivers who have them jealousy guard their assets from those who don't. That's how you win and keep winning.....
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Old 30 Aug 2017, 12:42 (Ref:3762911)   #18
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My personal take on things is that we've been through era after era since Grand Prix racing started (even before it was F1) where someone manages to build an era-changing mousetrap or comes up with something utterly ingenious.

For a short period, everyone inside F1 rails against it before trying to do their own version; meantime the fans (generally newer ones) are ecstatic as there's a new mousetrap in town that can have their support while it beats the old guard.

Then everything settles down and eventually the fans (new and old alike) and some teams start complaining that the new mousetrap maker has manipulated the rules or is playing fast and loose with the regulations or has the FIA in their pocket, everything gets a bit dull and the best mousetrap keeps on winning.

Then either someone builds a better mousetrap *or* the FIA decide that the rules must have a sweeping change, perhaps as a result of a team/company lobbying them, so we go round the whole cycle again.

Twas ever thus.

Oh - money. That's the crux of it. More money equals better mousetraps, and better lobbyists.
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Old 30 Aug 2017, 12:47 (Ref:3762915)   #19
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Originally Posted by morninggents View Post
I think the OP is being a bit niaive if he thinks fans speaking out will have any effect on either the FIA, the F1 hierarchy or the engine suppliers. When did 'fan power' ever have any influence in F1 and come to think of it - why should it? Further, is 'fan power' united? Would Merc and Ferrari fans join the protest?
"Fan power" had so much influence in F1 at one stage that a certain Gordon Murray designed Brabham was only allowed to race once!
OK, I'll get my coat...
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Old 30 Aug 2017, 13:38 (Ref:3762926)   #20
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"Fan power" had so much influence in F1 at one stage that a certain Gordon Murray designed Brabham was only allowed to race once!
OK, I'll get my coat...
Far too subtle for the younger or less informed members Viv, I remember 'Ban the Fan', I always thought it a brilliant idea to negate the Lotus' aero.

Still you can't have people throwing stones at their rivals can you?
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Old 30 Aug 2017, 14:12 (Ref:3762933)   #21
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When I posted my comments I was thinking of the Brabham fan car but thought if I mentioned it no-one would know what I was talking about. Forgot there were a couple of old codgers lurking in the historic sections that might look at more modern threads.
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Old 30 Aug 2017, 14:31 (Ref:3762940)   #22
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No one wanted to supply RBR with engines with the way they always publicly complained about Reanult engines. They've dug their own hole
they pay 40 million a year for those engines, if they are both not fast and not reliable they have a right to complain.
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Old 30 Aug 2017, 14:33 (Ref:3762941)   #23
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When I posted my comments I was thinking of the Brabham fan car but thought if I mentioned it no-one would know what I was talking about. Forgot there were a couple of old codgers lurking in the historic sections that might look at more modern threads.
You don't have to be so old really - I'm 60 but I don't consider myself old - in body but not in mind!
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Old 30 Aug 2017, 14:33 (Ref:3762942)   #24
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When I posted my comments I was thinking of the Brabham fan car but thought if I mentioned it no-one would know what I was talking about. Forgot there were a couple of old codgers lurking in the historic sections that might look at more modern threads.
Oi! I resemble that remark... (Plus, I'd say that there are more than a couple, and go on to say that some are more old and more codger than others!)
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Old 30 Aug 2017, 15:49 (Ref:3762967)   #25
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Our delivery van burns oil all the time, haven't noticed an increase in power from the old dear
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Old 30 Aug 2017, 15:58 (Ref:3762968)   #26
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Well, don't you go bad-mouthing your employer, it would be highly disrespectful....... !
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Old 30 Aug 2017, 16:23 (Ref:3762980)   #27
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You don't have to be so old really - I'm 60 but I don't consider myself old - in body but not in mind!
Well I'm a bit older than that but don't consider I'm old ........... then I look in the mirror.
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Old 30 Aug 2017, 16:24 (Ref:3762981)   #28
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I'm not doing too bad, until I look down below my neck........
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Old 30 Aug 2017, 16:27 (Ref:3762983)   #29
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Well, don't you go bad-mouthing your employer, it would be highly disrespectful....... !


It is a Mercedes Benz too
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Old 30 Aug 2017, 16:45 (Ref:3762987)   #30
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It is a Mercedes Benz too
In that case, you shall now forever be known to me as Fernando.......
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