ALMS 2011 Discussion

[dj4monie]

Originally Posted by Bob Riebe

Not as hard to grasp as, if you do not like to pay the monthly fee, that goes only up, you will not be watching anything on either screen.

Kind of like the carrot and the donkey.

New age ain't so grand really.

You can still watch a surprising amount without paying a red cent in TV content fees. HOWEVER that will require a high speed internet connection. But that's usually much cheaper than your average cable bill ($71).

If you don't watch NFL or College Football that requires Direct TV's NFL Sunday Ticket, then you can survive without cable or sat tv.

If you want completely free TV then you only be watching 3-4 Indy Car Race, the NASCAR races on Fox and that's roughly it. You can download torrents with a dial-up connection but I wouldn't recommend it, its like watching grass grow.

So yes while we pay for both (high speed net $70 and Direct TV $125), if we didn't need Sunday Ticket for Raider Games, we could largely do without cable, most of what I watch is available for download and my mom's soaps are on SoapNet.

If I had to pick between Pay TV and Broadband Internet, no brainer - Broadband all the way, I can do way more with it.

[fieldodreams79]

Originally Posted by Bob Riebe

Not as hard to grasp as, if you do not like to pay the monthly fee, that goes only up, you will not be watching anything on either screen.

Kind of like the carrot and the donkey.

New age ain't so grand really.

Who actually likes to pay a monthly fee?
And name one that don't go up...
name another that is actually worth every penny.
Personally, if new age means indoor plumbing, I prefer that over outhouses everytime.

Aren't we discussing the ALMS in 2011; how'd we get so far off into the bushes?
This forum has gotten very jumbled lately, for some reason; I just can't put my finger on why.

[chernaudi]

May not relate directly, but Matech is going to offer a conversion kit to make their GT1 cars into GT2 cars. I was also surprised that the FIA GT1 cars are so much less technically advanced than GT2 cars and why the GT1s struggled at some LMS rounds (no TC or a lot of other electronic goodies that GT2s have right now and being built for sprint races).

Anyone think that the Doran Ford GTs might be on their way out with this announcment, since the Matech cars have been eveloped with the help of Ford Racing and Roush Yates Engines?: http://auto-racing.speedtv.com/artic...martin-bartek/

[rich07]

Can both Ford GTs still run next year in the same series? Is there a rule preventing this?

[HORNDAWG]

Originally Posted by rich07

Can both Ford GTs still run next year in the same series? Is there a rule preventing this?

Both are homologated, albeit from different sanctioning bodies, so both are legal in ACO racing until the homologation lapses.





L.P.

[rich07]

Originally Posted by HORNDAWG

Both are homologated, albeit from different sanctioning bodies, so both are legal in ACO racing until the homologation lapses.





L.P.

Thanks.

[ubrben]

Originally Posted by JAG

Outside of Le Mans itself I've always thought quality edited highlights (preferably in HD) and a live online stream is the best option for sportscar racing.

The BPR GT 1hr highlights from 15 YEARS AGO are still the benchmark and far superior to anyhting Eurosport or Motors TV have put together.

I tend to agree. The number of people who want to watch a six hour endurance race is pretty tiny. I thought the live stream plus documentary presentation for Laguna was very good.

On the Vs. question - I've never watched and IRL race on Vs. but I used to watch their Tour de France coverage when I did MotoGP at Laguna in July for a couple of years. I was pretty impressed. Generally speaking a minority series needs a niche broadcaster that cares rather than a bigger broadcaster that doesn't.

Ben

[JAG]

I watched the Laguna documentary in full the other night and despite a slightly dodgy voiceover I though they did an excellent job of selling the ALMS.

The pitwall footage added a great deal to the race coverage and IMO made me appreciate the effort teams put in. It's easy to criticise but I warmed to the Dyson crew and felt for them when the car stopped in the last hour.

[Canada ALMS fan]

Originally Posted by HORNDAWG

Both are homologated, albeit from different sanctioning bodies, so both are legal in ACO racing until the homologation lapses.





L.P.

The car has been out for production for several years, is next season the last for the Ford GT to be eligible assuming no grandfathering?

[TWK]

I don't know about 6 hours, but sports fans watch 3 hour events all the time (NFL), and 4 hours, too (NASCAR).

What they won't watch in any significant numbers is an event for which they already know the outcome, no matter how elegantly edited.

[HORNDAWG]

Originally Posted by Canada ALMS fan

The car has been out for production for several years, is next season the last for the Ford GT to be eligible assuming no grandfathering?

Hmm, and when did production stop? And when were these cars homologated? Hmm!




L.P.

[Canada ALMS fan]

Originally Posted by HORNDAWG

Hmm, and when did production stop? And when were these cars homologated? Hmm!




L.P.

I will answer my own question then.
From the ACO 2010 Le Mans regs:
2.2.3 – lapsed Homologation
The homologation will become lapsed :
a/ The year following the stop of the production if a
minimum of 200 road cars has not been produced (50
for a "small manufacturer")
b/ 7 years after the stop of the production if at least a
minimum of 200 road cars has been produced (50 for
a "small manufacturer")
I though it was 5 years after production ceased, which is why I asked. It has nothing to do with when the race version was homologated. So, since the car was finished production in 2006, the Ford GT will be eligible as a platform until 2013, regardless if it is a Doran or a Matech.

[HORNDAWG]

Is it really that simple?! The car was not even in production when it was homologated! Who is to say that Bartek will not get a full homologation out of the FIA to ACO rehomologation? So saying that the (re-)homologation will run out at xxxx is optomistic at best!






L.P.

[Canada ALMS fan]

Is it really that simple? YES
The race cars were homologated after production ceased but within 7 years of being discontinued, when eligibility for homologation would lapse. That's how I read it anyway. Even Panoz had to play by these rules I believe.
My next question is that the ACO rules state at least 9 homologated race cars must be built of each model??? Surely they must allow an exception for that all the time...
Spyker
Panoz
Jaguar XKR
BMW
Ford GT
Can anyone else add any info to this discussion?

[HORNDAWG]

Maybe one should also read Art. 2.1.3 a/ which is criteria for homologation. It says nothing about being able to homologate a car that has been out of production at all, much less for 7 years!








L.P.

[Nick6]

Originally Posted by rich07

Can both Ford GTs still run next year in the same series? Is there a rule preventing this?

I think on the FIA side of things yes. But I don't think the ACO has anything against 2 different builders of the same car. Last season ALMS had 2 different corvettes running in GT2.

[chernaudi]

Who knows, this is the ACO after all...though Matech was told by the ACO that their cars can run in GT2/GTE if they're updated to GT2 specs.

Big difference was that Matech's cars were developled with backing from Ford Racing and Roush/Yates engines, the Doran cars had no such backing until late 2008/2009 time frame, and even then Ford still gave Matech more backing than Doran/Robertson ever got.

[rich07]

Originally Posted by Nick6

I think on the FIA side of things yes. But I don't think the ACO has anything against 2 different builders of the same car. Last season ALMS had 2 different corvettes running in GT2.

As far as FIA series goes (what series?) then thats not a problem because the Doran cars are only running in ACO races. My only query is if someone in ALMS buys a Matech car and runs it there, I cant see someone running a Doran car in an FIA series next year. And yeah I forgot about the two vettes..... Its a shame how it went for LG in ALMS (I gotta try and stop going off topic ).

[Fogelhund]

Originally Posted by rich07

As far as FIA series goes (what series?) then thats not a problem because the Doran cars are only running in ACO races. And yeah I forgot about the two vettes..... Its a shame how it went for LG in ALMS (I gotta try and stop going off topic ).

Three different builders had Ferrari 550's running at one point.

[rich07]

Originally Posted by Fogelhund

Three different builders had Ferrari 550's running at one point.

Ah yes-Prodrive, Italtechnica and was it Weith (sp) or JMB?

[The Badger]

Originally Posted by Nick6

I think on the FIA side of things yes. But I don't think the ACO has anything against 2 different builders of the same car. Last season ALMS had 2 different corvettes running in GT2.

And that is why Lou's car wasnt invited to Le Mans ..... the car can be homologated by one person , only . The car was homologated by P&M , so Lou got shafted , and wrongly I feel .

[The Badger]

Originally Posted by HORNDAWG

Both are homologated, albeit from different sanctioning bodies, so both are legal in ACO racing until the homologation lapses.





L.P.

No , Lou's car is not ACO compliant , as the car was homologated by P&M , and his car is not the same as a P&M example .

[HORNDAWG]

Originally Posted by The Badger

No , Lou's car is not ACO compliant , as the car was homologated by P&M , and his car is not the same as a P&M example .

That was pertaining to the Ford GTs of Doran and Bartek.

As to the Vettes..

It is more complicated than that, but...
P&M hold the GT-2 homologation with FIA who only allow 1 homologation holder per model per class.



L.P.

[Nick6]

Originally Posted by The Badger

And that is why Lou's car wasnt invited to Le Mans ..... the car can be homologated by one person , only . The car was homologated by P&M , so Lou got shafted , and wrongly I feel .

Its the FIA that requires 1 "paper holder" per model. Dumb rule, IMO!

[Nick6]

Originally Posted by rich07

Ah yes-Prodrive, Italtechnica and was it Weith (sp) or JMB?

N-Tech, First...

I believe Italtechnia sold kits of the car, which is what Rafanelli's cars were built from.