Audi R15 TDi - the thread

[dxk1]

Originally Posted by Ultimo

I would be tempted to go were this the case.

This report by Mr. Philips says so:

http://www.americanlemans.com/Home/ALMSHome.aspx

Click on the Dave Philips Diesel Porsche report, even though it is about Porsche. Listen closely near the end.

DK

[broadrun96]

Originally Posted by dxk1

Isn't there a report that the Audi R15 will be revealed at the Detroit Auto Show?

DK

Doubt it, thought Audi had said it would be revealed at Sebring week with the first test session. They didn't make a mention of appearing at the winter test session even. Surprised they would skip it but would save on shipping the car over and back if they can just as easily test it in Europe.

[dxk1]

Originally Posted by broadrun96

Doubt it, thought Audi had said it would be revealed at Sebring week with the first test session. They didn't make a mention of appearing at the winter test session even. Surprised they would skip it but would save on shipping the car over and back if they can just as easily test it in Europe.

If you listen to the Dave Phillips report I cited in my last post above, he says Detroit. I'm only saying what I heard. Whether it's true or not, we'll just have to wait and see.

DK

[broadrun96]

Yeah, was just going by the Audi releases saying car would be revealed at Sebring. Guess we will know by the 20-somethin of January.

[Aslak Vind]

Tom Kristensen has just launched a press release, Tom spent the days before Christmas tesing the new R15 in Spain. Nothing about the new car, as it was a private test with a high securitylevel.

Normally Audi tests the new car before Christmas, and then the holidays is used pondering about improvements. And the experienced TK has already found several improvements in the setup.

But TK is saddened by the ACO decision of cutting the Le Mans testday. Audi Sport had this day planned as the big datacollection day, and now its gone. But Audi will have to solve that riddle, without running testkilometeres on La Sarthe.

Tom is also amazed, that Audi managed to win the Le Mans 2008, with a car 3,5 seconds slower than the 908. But Audi is hard at work as always, and will look forward to Le Mans 2009, and he think that the R15 will be the biggest challenge yet. TK will be 42 at that time, but he is still looking to clinche number nine!

Thanks to Nils Finderup.

[CTD]

Last night i made a drawing on how i thing the R15 will look.
It's not done with the rear end but the front is.

It's very much like this one, execpt i changed it to a Spyder, gave it a smaller rear wing and edited the som Aero.

[CTD]

Originally Posted by Aslak Vind

Tom Kristensen has just launched a press release, Tom spent the days before Christmas tesing the new R15 in Spain. Nothing about the new car, as it was a private test with a high securitylevel.

Normally Audi tests the new car before Christmas, and then the holidays is used pondering about improvements. And the experienced TK has already found several improvements in the setup.
But TK is saddened by the ACO decision of cutting the Le Mans testday. Audi Sport had this day planned as the big datacollection day, and now its gone. But Audi will have to solve that riddle, without running testkilometeres on La Sarthe.

Tom is also amazed, that Audi managed to win the Le Mans 2008, with a car 3,5 seconds slower than the 908. But Audi is hard at work as always, and will look forward to Le Mans 2009, and he think that the R15 will be the biggest challenge yet. TK will be 42 at that time, but he is still looking to clinche number nine!

Thanks to Nils Finderup.

The whole press release can be found here (translated):
http://www.translate.google.dk/trans...98&sl=da&tl=en

[lukebarcelos]

Originally Posted by CTD

Last night i made a drawing on how i thing the R15 will look.
It's not done with the rear end but the front is.

It's very much like this one, execpt i changed it to a Spyder, gave it a smaller rear wing and edited the som Aero.

Interesting draw. Near of reality, I hope !

Thanks

[GT2-R]

Comme la R8, et comme la R10, la R15 est un prototype ouvert. « Nous pensons que c’est la meilleure formule » poursuit Tom Kristensen. « Nos ingénieurs ont également équipées la R15 d’un plus petit moteur pour permettre Ã* la voiture d’avoir une meilleure répartition du poids et d’être plus équilibrée. Pour résumer, toute l’expérience emmagasinée avec la R10 a été optimisée dans le nouveau modèle. C’est un important pas en avant. »

A short general translation: It will be an open prototype. Kristensen thinks this is the best choice for Audi. The R15 will be equipped with a smaller motor in order to obtain a better weight balance. Kristenses also says that all experience of the R10 is used and optimised in the new R15.

These drawings, although they are very nice, are not very realistic if you compare them to this interview.

SOURCE: www.endurance-info.com

[FGE]

Of course an open car, everything else would be a surprise for an Audi.
A smaler engine is also nothing new.

Ah, finally some news: "all experience of the R10 is used and optimised in the new car." Thank you Mr.K. Never thought about that one.

Sad but true, we have to wait until we see the first official fotos.


I think the drawings belong to another forum.

[chernaudi]

Back to the engine choice topic about the R15-what engine is most likely to be used. Audi would obviously want to go with as light an engine as possible, as that seemed to be a stumbling block to optimizing the R10 as much as Audi wanted to. So a V8 would make some since-problem is if this is a 2011 engine, it would almost have to be a stock block engine-Audi has no aluminium block V8s that size, and the 4.2 steel block V8 weights almost as much as the 5.5 V12. The only exception that I see is if Audi designs a silumin(aluminum alloyed with a large amount of silicon) block and heads-that type of aluminum may've been used in the R8 and R10 engines because it's very rigid and unyelding, but still very light. Then all Audi has to do make the numbers required by the homolgation rules to make the engine compliant.

But then there's Marshall's thoughts on the engine being maybe a V10, likely of 4.5-5.0 liters. That would seem more likely, as with an engine of that size, Audi will likely be allowed to run turbo boost and air restictor levels similar to what the V12 had, and thus likely have about the same power, or only very little less than what the V12 had. Also, if Audi runs the 3.7 V8, regardless if it's block and heads are steel, iron, or aluminum alloy of some kind, can it withstand the turbo boost pressures that would be required for it to equal Peugeot's 5.5 V12?

And did the R10's V12 run VGT turbos on it, and if not, would the R15 use them?

Just some thoughts on the power unit.

[HORNDAWG]

Originally Posted by chernaudi

Back to the engine choice topic about the R15-what engine is most likely to be used. Audi would obviously want to go with as light an engine as possible, as that seemed to be a stumbling block to optimizing the R10 as much as Audi wanted to. So a V8 would make some since-problem is if this is a 2011 engine, it would almost have to be a stock block engine-Audi has no aluminium block V8s that size, and the 4.2 steel block V8 weights almost as much as the 5.5 V12. The only exception that I see is if Audi designs a silumin(aluminum alloyed with a large amount of silicon) block and heads-that type of aluminum may've been used in the R8 and R10 engines because it's very rigid and unyelding, but still very light. Then all Audi has to do make the numbers required by the homolgation rules to make the engine compliant.

But then there's Marshall's thoughts on the engine being maybe a V10, likely of 4.5-5.0 liters. That would seem more likely, as with an engine of that size, Audi will likely be allowed to run turbo boost and air restictor levels similar to what the V12 had, and thus likely have about the same power, or only very little less than what the V12 had. Also, if Audi runs the 3.7 V8, regardless if it's block and heads are steel, iron, or aluminum alloy of some kind, can it withstand the turbo boost pressures that would be required for it to equal Peugeot's 5.5 V12?

And did the R10's V12 run VGT turbos on it, and if not, would the R15 use them?

Just some thoughts on the power unit.

Huh? Why would they use a stockblock anything in the R-15?



L.P.

[chewymonster]

Originally Posted by chernaudi

But then there's Marshall's thoughts on the engine being maybe a V10, likely of 4.5-5.0 liters. That would seem more likely, as with an engine of that size, Audi will likely be allowed to run turbo boost and air restictor levels similar to what the V12 had, and thus likely have about the same power, or only very little less than what the V12 had. Also, if Audi runs the 3.7 V8, regardless if it's block and heads are steel, iron, or aluminum alloy of some kind, can it withstand the turbo boost pressures that would be required for it to equal Peugeot's 5.5 V12?

And did the R10's V12 run VGT turbos on it, and if not, would the R15 use them?

Just some thoughts on the power unit.

All diesels run the same restrictor, whether 4 or 5.5 liters, or in between. But the amount of boost varies from 3,620 mbar for 4 liters to 2,750 for 5.5 liters. According to the spirit of the rules the 4 liter and 5.5 liter engines should make an equal amount of horsepower. Yet, (except in GT) you usually see engines that are as big as the ACO rules allow. Torque probably plays a role in this, and likely you end up with more horsepower with the bigger engine as well. It will be interesting how Audi works with this.


The ACO rules say that closed top gets .4 mm more restrictor (they don't even mention the AC anymore) Basically I see this as giving more horsepower to closed top cars. Has Peugeot even ran with a real AC unit that would actually suck up power? And how much extra hp would .4 mm restrictor give?

[ger80]

For closed cars equipped with an air conditioning system, the restrictors diameter above must be increased by :
- 0.5 mm for 1 restrictor
- 0.3 mm for 2 restrictors

http://www.lemans.org/sport/sport/re...fr_gb_2008.pdf

[CTD]

It's only the first drawing i see as a possible R15, so i dont see why it's not realistic.
I made the drawings from the original interview from Tom K, where he says that the R15 will be more different to the R10, than the R10 was to the R8!.

And i dont see why they dont fit to this forum "FGE", i made the drawing to express the way i think the R15 may look.

[knighty]

I dont mean to pee on your fire, but I seem to remember that Audi have already announced it will be an open top car.........not a coupe.

[HORNDAWG]

Originally Posted by chewymonster

All diesels run the same restrictor, whether 4 or 5.5 liters, or in between. But the amount of boost varies from 3,620 mbar for 4 liters to 2,750 for 5.5 liters. According to the spirit of the rules the 4 liter and 5.5 liter engines should make an equal amount of horsepower. Yet, (except in GT) you usually see engines that are as big as the ACO rules allow. Torque probably plays a role in this, and likely you end up with more horsepower with the bigger engine as well. It will be interesting how Audi works with this.


The ACO rules say that closed top gets .4 mm more restrictor (they don't even mention the AC anymore) Basically I see this as giving more horsepower to closed top cars. Has Peugeot even ran with a real AC unit that would actually suck up power? And how much extra hp would .4 mm restrictor give?

Daniel Poissenot stated at the ACO conference (par. 6) that the A/C restrictor rule would be rescinded in 09'. Although it does not seem that particular change made it into the rules for 09'.



L.P.

[HORNDAWG]

edit to last post:

That is, it did not get rescinded for prototypes, where it did for GTs!



L.P.

[Hugewally]

Interesting article about Audi and not racing the R15...

http://lastturnclub.com/index.php?op...d=538&Itemid=1

[carsten66]

Originally Posted by Hugewally

Interesting article about Audi and not racing the R15...

http://lastturnclub.com/index.php?op...d=538&Itemid=1

Good points... and with many of the stuff I only can agree.

In the media Wiedeking often is praised to the skies although amongst the management and the unions working alongside with him he is said to be dictatorial and is called the 'boss with two faces'... but at least I really hope it's not the end of prototype racing for Audi and Porsche and particularly with regard to his age we have to be with him in the position for a long time (he is born in 1952)...

[JAG]

TBH you can't really complain about Audi, whatever they do, they've supported the ALMS for many years, the same can't be said for home grown manufacturer's.

Likewise Porsche with the RS Spyder and GT2, Spyders will once again be competing in the LMS, with cars available for US teams to run.

Even if Porsche return with a factory P1, the ALMS needs to attract privateer teams to run customer cars and boost fields.

[HORNDAWG]

Originally Posted by JAG

TBH you can't really complain about Audi, whatever they do, they've supported the ALMS for many years, the same can't be said for home grown manufacturer's.

Likewise Porsche with the RS Spyder and GT2, Spyders will once again be competing in the LMS, with cars available for US teams to run.

Even if Porsche return with a factory P1, the ALMS needs to attract privateer teams to run customer cars and boost fields.

While I appreciate your point about Audi's longevity. I fail to see how you can think that GM, aka:Corvette Racing, are not "home grown manufacturers", with the added fact that they have been there the whole of the ALMS's existence!



L.P.

[Bentley03]

Originally Posted by HORNDAWG

While I appreciate your point about Audi's longevity. I fail to see how you can think that GM, aka:Corvette Racing, are not "home grown manufacturers", with the added fact that they have been there the whole of the ALMS's existence!



L.P.

I would suggest he is talking in terms of home grown manufacturers collectively. GM (Corvette) are the exception, rather than the norm (of course others have come and gone over the years). That said, I've always considered ACO regs racing to be the domain of European and Japanese manufacturers anyway.

[TWK]

Originally Posted by Bentley03

I would suggest he is talking in terms of home grown manufacturers collectively. GM (Corvette) are the exception, rather than the norm (of course others have come and gone over the years). That said, I've always considered ACO regs racing to be the domain of European and Japanese manufacturers anyway.

Corvette represents one of three (major) "homegrown manufacturers." Among "minor" there is Panoz, between the LMP1 and GT2 they've been there the whole time. Cadillac was around for three years. We've had Ford for a season now, and we had Vipers for most years, including championships the first couple.

How many Japanese manufacturers have we had in the decade that the ALMS has been around? Right. One. For two seasons. Korean? None. What Japanese manufacturers have you seen ANYWHERE in sports car racing, ACO regs or otherwise (other than in the "home islands" as they like to call them) in the past decade? Hell, in damn near twenty years.

Europe? Ferrari and BMW about half the seasons. GT2 was once a Porsche parade. Aston Martin shows up and wins when the whine a bit and quits, then fields a half-hearted GT2 attempt. In prototypes, Audi...Porsche three big years in LMP2 - the same as Cadillac - big deal. Lola.

"Homegrown" manufacturers take a back seat to NO ONE in ALMS participation.

[Fogelhund]

Should also be noted that in the past decade, Saleen, Mosler, Chrysler LMP, Callaway are North American built sportscars competing around the world.

Tom did miss Mazda as Japanese in ALMS...