Nissan LMP1 Discussion

[Chuliandred]

Originally Posted by Acid09

The Nissan crew looks to lack training as well. The way they handle the cars in and out of the garage, it all looks very awkward and uncoordinated at times.

One guy needed three tries (including doffing of his glove) to open the door...

[FormulaFox]

The #23 Nissan has dipped below 3:40 - 3:38.468. The KCMG P2 car is still faster, but by less than half a second.

[MoMedic9019]

Originally Posted by Chuliandred

And? They will never make up the ground with this car. They are worse than Aston Martin back in the days

Complete BS.

They completely lack the classical british understatement.

Japanese team.

They haven't got any LeMans program together in the last years.

They also have not made a serious attempt.

The deltawing was okay and was hit, but Nissan was only added quite late. The ZEOD was a complete failure. Yeah they got their electric lap... they started to drive 24 hours... not only one lap.

Both pure marketing efforts done half-a**ed....

And now the LMP1... buying to many vital parts

Care to share the list of parts they've bought? I'm certain that Audi doesn't purchase a thing right?

failing to bring it together, being far of the pace and completely unreliable...

What's been unreliable? They hybrid? Trust me...WHEN they get it working(and they will) it's going to be an absolute cruise missile. And the pace has been explained a million times.

Doesn't matter if its the first year. Remember Toyotas first year. They got their **** together.

They also went with a cut and paste design... and with that were able to get to speed quickly.

I bet that not a single Nissan will drive into the night on saturday.

I'll take that bet.

I had high hopes and wished them only the best, but with the gap between their bullishness and their performance they just went to far. Hopefully after the race they calm down a little bit

They calmed down months ago. There is a reason homie left for AMR... his joke of a marketing scheme was exactly that. Nissan is marketing differently. They don't care that some purists are angry about it... the only thing you do when posting rants like this is make yourself look foolish.

It also shows that you have no concept of the effort it takes to develop a car.

[MoMedic9019]

Originally Posted by Acid09

The Nissan crew looks to lack training as well. The way they handle the cars in and out of the garage, it all looks very awkward and uncoordinated at times.

All brand new crew.. they will improve.

[FormulaFox]

Originally Posted by MoMedic9019

All brand new crew.. they will improve.

Probably not in time for the race, though.

This is the one area I think Nissan may have actually failed - they were so focused on building the car they didn't put enough into pit crew training.

[Acid09]

Originally Posted by MoMedic9019

Japanese team.

Yeah, and we all know how cocky those Japanese can be

Seriously, in terms of their talk the team is distinctly un-Japanese, Japanese people are all about being polite, saving face etc.

[MoMedic9019]

Originally Posted by Acid09

Yeah, and we all know how cocky those Japanese can be

Seriously, in terms of their talk the team is distinctly un-Japanese, Japanese people are all about being polite, saving face etc.

I was being snarky on purpose... If you are going to call them out based on expectant cultural attitude, at least get the country right, even if your desired stereotype is blatantly wrong.

[MoMedic9019]

Originally Posted by FormulaFox

Probably not in time for the race, though.

This is the one area I think Nissan may have actually failed - they were so focused on building the car they didn't put enough into pit crew training.

Meh... I remember being handed a wheel gun early on in my time, with a just a handful of time to practice... they will get there.

[FormulaFox]

Originally Posted by MoMedic9019

Meh... I remember being handed a wheel gun early on in my time, with a just a handful of time to practice... they will get there.

As with all things in racing, we shall soon see one way or another.

[Ronald_Fish]

Originally Posted by MoMedic9019

I was being snarky on purpose... If you are going to call them out based on expectant cultural attitude, at least get the country right, even if your desired stereotype is blatantly wrong.

So its an american team... Think they are matching the stereotype to a tea

[Chuliandred]

Originally Posted by MoMedic9019

I was being snarky on purpose... If you are going to call them out based on expectant cultural attitude, at least get the country right, even if your desired stereotype is blatantly wrong.

Yes, I always knew they planted Cox and Bowlby secretly in british woman and facelifted them on embrionic level to match the european looks. And we here have this stereotype for Brits, but you must be right.

The Nissan motorsportteam is as japanese as the Toyota or the ByKolles from Austria. It does not depend on the flags waved but on the people holding them up.

About buying parts. Their hybrid system which does not work at all and their engine which delivers just not enough power if it's realy only 470hp as you stated in another thread.

I won't go into detail about the other points as I don't think that we will ever agree about them. The race will tell. But I am quite aware what it takes to develope a car. For sure Nissan should know it even better. But apparently they got a lot wrong and not ready. Especially compared to Porsche last year. And remember Porsche also had a lot of trouble during the preparation phase (vibrations / one car burning down to call the worst). But they sorted their problems out to a point that they lead the race on sunday morning. I will not be surprised if even next year at LeMans Nissan still is more than 5 seconds behind.

[hcl123]

Originally Posted by jswarde

hcl123; for someone with so much to say about the Torotrak "slippery" CVT you are remarkably badly informed. It has never been tried in F1; Honda adopted it and were well advanced in their plans to use it in F1 but they pulled out of F1 before they used it. When Brawn took over the team they could not use the Honda Drive train and adopted a Mercedes drivetrain that had their own hybrid design. You obviously do not have a skooby of understanding on the flywheel Kers. Lets wait and see if Nissan can get their design to harvest the performance of the mechanical flywheel Kers.

Well... perhaps, but this is not about me.

IIRC plans were high in motion for more teams to use this kind of systems... or at least i think the idea was well sold... if no one in F1 pick it up (can't remember, a time when i was disconnecting from boring1) then is not me the villan for not liking the system-> i assure you i didn't influence anybody...

Lets wait and see ? ... ok! but somehow i have this feeling that compels to say; "if i were you i wouldn't be too optimistic of it revealing itself anything but inferior to other hybrid systems" ( its polemic and prone to bickering i know... just hope to remain outside of the last part).

[MoMedic9019]

Originally Posted by Chuliandred

About buying parts. Their hybrid system which does not work at all

The hybrid is fine. They just need to get the power down reliably.

and their engine which delivers just not enough power if it's realy only 470hp as you stated in another thread.

When you have a significant decrease in frontal area, you don't need all the power. For a bit of perspective, many of the others are only making 550...fuel flow limits are about 600.

But I am quite aware what it takes to develop a car.

I've gone through the process with three different teams, three different cars... all major works. If your statement was true, you'd cut them an absolute ton of slack.

[Coach Ep]

Originally Posted by MoMedic9019

The hybrid is fine.

Which of the two?

Originally Posted by MoMedic9019

The hybrid is fine.
I've gone through the process with three different teams, three different cars... all major works. If your statement was true, you'd cut them an absolute ton of slack.

Do you care to name 'm and may I ask how successful they were?

[TF110]

Aside all their big talk, they did a 3:38 today, thats getting better. So they're off pace. We knew it would be. No one should care about PR. It dont mean squat. Words are nothing, results are what really speaks. If they gain more pace from here to the race, then that's great. They are heading forward not backward. If anyone here expected it to be at lmp2 pace, you can congratulate yourself, but lets move on. And theres no reason to defend them. They'll get it together or they'll fail. Only time will tell. Lets just hope it's the former so they stay in the wec!

[MoMedic9019]

Originally Posted by Coach Ep

Which of the two?

Both.

Do you care to name 'm and may I ask how successful they were?

Carsport America-Pagani(Complete Failure) Further developed the Viper GTS-R(minor stuff, but it was a side project with Zakspeed)Not a major program in many peoples eyes, but, there was huge money getting tossed around. Technically the same team, but, we were tasked by two different org's...We split time in the same shop working on things.

Bucknum P675 Pilbeam/Nissan(half failure, half success)Also worked on Formula Mazda development with them when the new chassis came around.

I spent a short three race stint with TRG during their switch from manual to sequential boxes back. I got tired of the travel and left motorsports for awhile. I've been back since, but, noting meaningful.

[nkoske]

Thank god they decided to miss the first two WEC races to focus on development, because if they hadn't I'd hate to know where they would be at this point.

Also, pretty sure everyone would give them more credit with a car closer to the pace than 3 slow cars. What's the saying quality over quantity. If you're 20 secs off pace you're still going to lose even if you brought 10 cars.

[FormulaFox]

Originally Posted by nkoske

Also, pretty sure everyone would give them more credit with a car closer to the pace than 3 slow cars. What's the saying quality over quantity. If you're 20 secs off pace you're still going to lose even if you brought 10 cars.

If they only ran one car they'd probably be even MORE off the pace and most would be accusing them of not taking things seriously.

More cars = more data to develop off of.

[Acid09]

Even taking into account that it is a brand new car, 20 seconds are an eternity in motor racing. It just seems to be too much to ever make up, especially because the competition isn't standing still either.

[MoMedic9019]

Originally Posted by Acid09

Even taking into account that it is a brand new car, 20 seconds are an eternity in motor racing. It just seems to be too much to ever make up, especially because the competition isn't standing still either.

And it's still a brand new car, in it's first race weekend. They made up a ton of time in one session... they will get way closer by the end of the season.

[DeezPutz]

If one car makes it into the night, it will be an accomplishment. It's sort of embarrassing Nissan ran such a ridiculous marketing campaign then shows up two races late and gets out qualified by ByKolles.

[MoMedic9019]

Originally Posted by DeezPutz

If one car makes it into the night, it will be an accomplishment. It's sort of embarrassing Nissan ran such a ridiculous marketing campaign then shows up two races late and gets out qualified by ByKolles.

And? Get over the stupid marketing program. Seriously. It was dropped after Andy Palmer left for Aston.

As for the rest of it. For some reason it has to be repeated a million effin times...

New car, new circuit, new everything. It takes time to develop a car. anyone expecting pole level pace out of a car with 10 months of work on it is a complete fool. Audi, Peugeot, Toyota, Porsche and just about every other major factory has had well over a year of development into the car before it hit the track on a race weekend.

We are 10 months into the development of Nissan. Two of the three chassis were only finished a few weeks back. There is an absolute ton of work to be done. Until they get through a full year of development they are going to be behind. That's just how it is.

Porsche is nearly FIVE YEARS into their project and are unlikely to finish the entire distance...so...explain that one champ.

[FormulaFox]

Originally Posted by DeezPutz

If one car makes it into the night, it will be an accomplishment. It's sort of embarrassing Nissan ran such a ridiculous marketing campaign then shows up two races late and gets out qualified by ByKolles.

Excuse me, but the leading Nissan qualified over two seconds FASTER than the ByKolles car.

And there's still two qualifying sessions for the other two to catch up.

[hondafan37]

Endurance-info says that a current LMP2 team could be racing a Nissan GTR LMP1 in the future.

- Une équipe privée roulant actuellement en LM P2 se verrait bien rouler en Nissan GT-R LM NISMO �* moyen terme même si aucune annonce n’a encore été faite. Tout dépendra certainement de l’avancée du programme LM P1.

http://www.endurance-info.com/fr/inf...otos-du-mardi/

[MitchZ06]

I've probably been called out but yes, after the first quali session the GTR-LM is just plain slow and reaffirms my questioning of the designing behind this car. Will be a tough race for them to even beat the LMP1 privateers...