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Old 23 Mar 2012, 20:38 (Ref:3047253)   #1
dtype38
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Middle age men and Hot Hatchbacks

In another place it's generally been agreed that in the UK, a man of a certain age and colour of hair should only be seen in a convertible if it's a timeless classic, preferably of significant age, and enhanced by a handlebar moustache and a flying jacket (in arctic or monsoon weather only).

Well that may or may not happen, but what is for sure is that the same man still needs to run around town on mundane shopping trips, ferry the kids about, buy stuff that doesn't fit in the back seat of a convertible, and have something with a roof for when rainy days and flying jacket just don't appeal!

And yet surely it can have some interest besides its eco credential and fuel economy. Can't it be small, practical, but nippy with good handling, and be generally fun to drive?.... a HOT HATCH maybe!

So that's the question. Can a self respecting man of a certain age find a Hot(ish) Hatchback that doesn't look like a Nike trainer on wheels or attract the insurance premium normally associated with 17yr olds? Any ideas?
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Old 23 Mar 2012, 22:20 (Ref:3047299)   #2
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mountainstar should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridmountainstar should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridmountainstar should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
This guy says yes:

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Old 23 Mar 2012, 23:21 (Ref:3047329)   #3
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MG ZS180 hatch - quick, involving and with nice noise and excellent handling. Plus cheap as chips to buy as everybody thinks Rovers are unmaintainable (untrue).
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Old 24 Mar 2012, 00:56 (Ref:3047355)   #4
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Well here (not in the UK) middle aged men (such as me) are often seen in hot hatches (as well as other vehicles of course).

Of course, tend to be the "quieter" looking models and there are plenty of high end hot hatches these days. Personally, I roll with a Golf R32 but there's plenty of middle aged dudes you see around in GTIs, Golf Rs, Audi A & S 3s, TTs, Renault Meganes, Alfas etc etc.
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Old 24 Mar 2012, 14:08 (Ref:3047481)   #5
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yeah, by all means drive a "hot hatch" at an advanced age but for the love of god make it one that has decent build qualities and is money well spent.

as a current owner, i object to the audi s3 being called a hot hatch, it's far more refined than that! it's as jekyll and hyde as the bigger rs- versions and i'm still totally stunned at just how much car i've got for my money with it. one minute i'm driving a nice stable long distance car, the next i've just done 90mph round a challenging corner and it didn't bat an eyelid. sometimes i wish it wasn't quite so keen to tell me exactly what was going on on the road surface (particularly on the a14) but it's a small complaint.

on the other hand i've had a clio 172 and it's somewhere between a trackday car and a sunday car for a bit of fun on a budget. there's no way you can just sit back on a motorway, engage cruise control and just enjoy the drive because it's all involving, all the time.

for me, a grown-up "hot hatch" is one that you can rag senseless and have a really rewarding driving experience from, and then just have a nice normal comfortable drive in too.
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Old 24 Mar 2012, 15:25 (Ref:3047506)   #6
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Just spent 30mins trying to copy and paste, but to no avail (virus caused by viewing too much "extreme gymnastics"?)

Pic was going to be an Abarth 850TC, nice and understated.I agree with bella - at a "certain age" it needs to be tasteful rather than brash.I think personally that the ZR is a bit too "young", but an R32 which has been "left alone" by the modders would be just right.

What about that Volvo C30 thingy? Pretty quick,I hear.
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Old 24 Mar 2012, 16:33 (Ref:3047536)   #7
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er, ZS not ZR (the latter has an unusual driving position which is not everybody's cup of tea). The ZS is the 45-based one, BTCC and all that. In its day 'the finest-handling FWD road car' according to some racer who did a road test. Being a Rover it suffers from the usual prejudice that brought the company down, a lot of it at the time from people who never sat in one yet alone owned and ran one.
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Old 24 Mar 2012, 16:45 (Ref:3047541)   #8
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er, ZS not ZR (the latter has an unusual driving position which is not everybody's cup of tea). The ZS is the 45-based one, BTCC and all that. In its day 'the finest-handling FWD road car' according to some racer who did a road test. Being a Rover it suffers from the usual prejudice that brought the company down, a lot of it at the time from people who never sat in one yet alone owned and ran one.
Yes cheap as chips, as long as you dont mind fitting a new head gasket now and then
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Old 24 Mar 2012, 17:43 (Ref:3047555)   #9
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This guy says yes:
If I could drive like him I would drive whatever the hell I liked too.... and someone would probably pay me to do it!
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Old 24 Mar 2012, 18:02 (Ref:3047559)   #10
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Putting some images to the other suggestions. Definitely food for thought, but I would query if the front of that Audi could in any way be called "understated" or if the Golf at 1.6 tonnes is actually not just a large saloon that's been washed on hot cycle. As for the Fiat, er where is the shopping supposed to go? I like the Clio though...
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Old 24 Mar 2012, 19:06 (Ref:3047591)   #11
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Yes cheap as chips, as long as you dont mind fitting a new head gasket now and then
no Gordon, the KV6 does not suffer from the same problem of its lesser 4 cyl cousin.
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Old 24 Mar 2012, 23:03 (Ref:3047690)   #12
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Putting some images to the other suggestions. Definitely food for thought, but I would query if the front of that Audi could in any way be called "understated" or if the Golf at 1.6 tonnes is actually not just a large saloon that's been washed on hot cycle. As for the Fiat, er where is the shopping supposed to go? I like the Clio though...
the audi is very understated, honest. the big obvious grille is an option on the standard a3 iirc. it has a bigger spoiler on the back window, but apart from that there's very little to set it apart from a standard a3 apart from the insane amount of time you spend at petrol stations

oh and the wheels on mine and the other one i've seen "in the wild" are better than the ones in the photo, they're the twin 5-spoke ones. *very* tidy and definitely understated. and easier to wash

the golf is about 200kg heavier than the audi which seems a bit odd. what on earth do they do to it! is that the difference in the v6 engine over the 2l turbo in the audi? surely not...
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Old 24 Mar 2012, 23:37 (Ref:3047699)   #13
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I'm a big fan of Seats - I had an old shape Leon Cupra a few years back & loved it. 1.8 20 valve turbo, 180bph, didn't look much different to a standard Leon but went like absolute stink. It was basically an Audi S3 at 2/3 the price. The new shape Leon & Ibiza FR's look good - not quite as 'trainer' like as the Cupras & with relatively small turbocharged engines so insurance isn't quite as high.
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Old 25 Mar 2012, 00:27 (Ref:3047706)   #14
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the new cupra r, the s3 and golf r has 261bp from a 2 litre turbo now which is NUTS!

my folks both have older bmw alpinas - ok, so they don't count as hot hatches but they're a similarly low key way of having very silly amounts of power in a decidedly normal looking car and perhaps a little more older gentleman friendly.

not sure whether a bigger car is more or less fun though?
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Old 25 Mar 2012, 05:31 (Ref:3047736)   #15
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the golf is about 200kg heavier than the audi which seems a bit odd. what on earth do they do to it! is that the difference in the v6 engine over the 2l turbo in the audi? surely not...
Only 100kg difference here in Oz which I would imagine is largely the engine difference. Might be a wider variety in spec in the UK to reduce the weight of the Audi there by a further 100kg?
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Old 25 Mar 2012, 09:01 (Ref:3047788)   #16
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not sure whether a bigger car is more or less fun though?
I'd say less. I have a Mazda 6 2.2d, the 185 Sport version. A bit like the S3 it's a great every day car with solid performance, unlike the S3 it doesn't make me want to go into corners at warpspeed, but that might be because it usually has my daughter in the back!

My 306 Rallye, on the other hand..... there's something about it that makes every journey a bit more thrilling, much more chuckable, something I think only comes with the smaller cars.
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Old 25 Mar 2012, 10:45 (Ref:3047884)   #17
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Just back on-line after a night's work - so a bit late with the "funnies".
The shopping goes in the boot of the Abarth - they've left the lid open for you.

The mix-up with ZR/ZS is cos I forgot which one was a hatch, one of your stipulations. Still can't think of any sensible suggestions - don't touch a Seat if you want to have you car on the road more often than off it.Don't even start me on that one.

Oh,just thought , Honda Civic TypeR, if you don't mind the looks.
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Old 25 Mar 2012, 11:14 (Ref:3047910)   #18
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I've got a Fabia vrs - good fun to drive but because it's a Skoda the 'yoof' don't tend to drive them so much (which is a good thing). Things like a Corsa VXR are a definte no - it's just trying too hard. Can't say I'd ever go for a Clio - I have never driven a Renault that I haven't wanted to burn immediately afterwards.
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Old 25 Mar 2012, 11:24 (Ref:3047918)   #19
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Sorry to link to the dark side but here's one for dtype38. It's hot, It's a hatch and It's everything he could want as he can modify it to his heart's content.
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Old 25 Mar 2012, 11:29 (Ref:3047925)   #20
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Sorry to link to the dark side but here's one for dtype38. It's hot, It's a hatch and It's everything he could want as he can modify it to his heart's content.

Some people seem to have a lot of time on their hands! Exactly what's it for? What's he going to do with it?
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Old 25 Mar 2012, 16:03 (Ref:3048105)   #21
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Regarding the weight of the Golf R32, I understand a lot of it is to do with the number of electric motors for seats, windows, mirrors etc etc, plus more substantial structure and brakes etc to deal with the extra power. Did you know the the Golf R32 is nearly exactly twice the weight and twice the power of the original Golf GTi. So open road missile - yes, nippy about town - no.

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Sorry to link to the dark side but .......
Now if my name was Graham I might be inclined to go off at the deep end at a pointless suggestion completely missing the point of the question. Fortunately I understand your sense of humour. Actually, that car reminds me a lot of when Ford had a go making a Fiesta Cosworth similar to the Escort Cosworth... then found when you pinned the throttle the floor pan folded up! Obviously learning from Fords mistake, this chap has put in some 'reinforcements'. So now he had a heavy powerful car with tyres too small to take the performance and still no space to put the shopping. Round of applause please.

As for the more sensible ideas, The idea of a Cupra R or Civic R is quite appealing, but will have to look their insurance groups up.
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Old 25 Mar 2012, 18:36 (Ref:3048211)   #22
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Now if my name was Graham I might be inclined to go off at the deep end at a pointless suggestion completely missing the point of the question.
I'm beginning to think it should be.
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Old 25 Mar 2012, 19:27 (Ref:3048248)   #23
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I know its not a hatchback, but the BMW 3 series 320d is a very fast car, handles as well as most hot hatches i've driven and has plenty of power and torque, after a re map your talking about 225bhp and 0-60 in just under 6 seconds. Yet when you want to cruise on a motorway it's also very comfortable and refined giving excellent fuel consumption. Just be sure to ditch the run flat tyres!
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Old 25 Mar 2012, 20:48 (Ref:3048318)   #24
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I'm beginning to think it should be.
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Old 25 Mar 2012, 22:08 (Ref:3048391)   #25
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Sorry to link to the dark side but here's one for dtype38. It's hot, It's a hatch and It's everything he could want as he can modify it to his heart's content.
If he had spent more time on building it rather than taking pictures of it he would have finished it ages ago
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