JPM - 'The right deal wasn't available'

[chunterer]

JPM has allegedly spoken out about his departure from F1 in more revealing terms.

It seems he was holding out for a Renault or Ferrari offer, which never materialised (or he couldn't wait any longer for) and if such a deal had come he would've stayed.

I'm not sure there's anything massively new here, but he does mention that he was able to declare his intentions for next year at anytime and wanted to ensure his long term future after F1.

http://uk.sports.yahoo.com/01082006/...y-montoya.html

Bernie has been quoted a couple of times as saying that F1 could ill afford to lose 'characters' like Juan Pablo so I can only assume that had he known earlier that JPM was considering packing it in if he couldn't get a good drive that he would've 'advised' certain teams to pick up the Colombians services...

[Knowlesy]

No change in my mind, he made the right decision. A racers decision.

A shame we won't see him in an F1 car, but then there is more to life than F1.

[Bononi]

I believe he was told (or he knew) that Ferrari and Renault were not interested in him. It doesn't matter, JPM made a change of heart, and like myself, that was needed for his peace of mind, so he did the right thing.

[chunterer]

Nice sentiment Knowlesy.

But it still strikes me as a fundamental flaw with current F1 that a 'racer' and character like this cannot continue in a series that is supposedly the ultimate.

Circumstances prevailed but well, one of the top 4 drivers in the world, a race winner, previous and possible future credible title contender and 'star' name is out when a raft of run of the mill and arguably medicore talents who will never challenge for race wins yet alone titles continue to get drives.

But as you say, he weighed up his options and made a decision that suited him in the long term.

On a lesser scale it appears BMW have decided to rest JV because he's got fed up with the uncertainty forced upon him (his Hockeneheim weekend surely was illustrative of a frustrated driver).

I really better not comment but there's a certain theme here.

[Knowlesy]

Well, there is a tiny element of fitting in with F1, with it being totally topline and all that. 'Ultimate' as you put it, chuntz.

At this moment in time, chaps like JPM and JV don't really fit in. When you have a difficult year therefore, or even a rough patch, you are on thin ice.

[chunterer]

I know, I know, but it's these drivers, who like many many others (you included I suspect!!) that got us interested in this sport to begin with.

Hey, lets not let the clear out end with these two.

I can think of less deserving drivers or 'yes' men as I think of them who should be shown the door before these guys.

Do i really need to name names....

At least 3 of them have been re-signed by teams who clearly thought that no better option was available (team management failure or fear methinks) and another (the ultimate corporate professional driver) will probably be retained by a team with an image that supposedly promotes wild out there antics, traits which this driver certainly shows very little of?

Off topic just a bit but it ought to be discussed - Will the revolution of 2008 really bring us back to a level of competition, entrants and drivers that gains the respect of enthusiasts and the general public generally?

Then there'a another guy busting a gut as teammate to probably the best driver ever, and has proved he's the quickest teammate he's ever had but bizarrely still doesn't know if he's going to be retained by them.

If this was 1973 at Tyrrell and Schumacher was the Stewart to Cevert's Massa, then the latter guy would've been told by now that he would be the main man the following season, if you know what I mean!

It's all gone horribly wrong!

[chillibowl]

it certainly is a culture which places drivers below the equipment they are meant to drive Chunterer.
but alas, not the end of the world, arguably the 3 best drivers in the world are still showing that they command more respect than the cars they drive

[Marbot]

Originally Posted by chillibowl

arguably the 3 best drivers in the world are still showing that they command more respect than the cars they drive

Despite the fact that they are driving the 3 best cars on the grid.

[BootsOntheSide]

I'd call DC's long list of ex-girlfriends pretty wild and out there.

[chillibowl]

Originally Posted by martyn bott

Despite the fact that they are driving the 3 best cars on the grid.

it also helps that i only care about F1, so if there is a better driver out there i will gladly remain ignorant to it

[Knowlesy]

I see what you are saying chuntz and I agree for the most part. The situations some drivers find themselves in is ludicrous, but what can you do? That is, unfortunately, how things work these days. And it won't change, sadly.

Massa is a great example. The guy can really do no more. And yet.....it is feasible he will have no drive at all next season if the cards fall badly.

[Fantasy GP610]

Originally Posted by chunterer

At least 3 of them have been re-signed by teams who clearly thought that no better option was available (team management failure or fear methinks) and another (the ultimate corporate professional driver) will probably be retained by a team with an image that supposedly promotes wild out there antics, traits which this driver certainly shows very little of?

That particular driver has been "wild and out there" in the past.

Been there,done that,moved on,type of thing.

[FalconXRated]

Originally Posted by Fantasy GP610

That particular driver has been "wild and out there" in the past.

Been there,done that,moved on,type of thing.

So on that note Eddie Irvine will have a seat again next year?

Its not hard to see why the fans and drivers could easily become disenchanted with F1.

We've got 2 or 3 teams capable of winning the championship and races, we've
got rookie drivers capable of ruining anyones race with simple errors and we've got cars that breakdown well before the race distance.

All teams need to be reliable for a start, it makes a joke of " The worlds premier motorsport series " if teams can't keep a car together. its unprofessional and you can't follow a driver who's not on the track.

F1 surely has lost its way at the moment when a big name driver leaves for a lesser category.

[deejay]

This thread is absurd. We're talking about one driver leaving because he couldn't get a seat at one of the top 3 teams - and the reason for that is that there are better drivers those teams would rather have. Montoya hasn't been forced out of F1, he could have got a drive, but he didn't want to race mid-pack. He's not the first driver to decide that and he won't be the last.

We've got 2 or 3 teams capable of winning the championship and races, we've got rookie drivers capable of ruining anyones race with simple errors and we've got cars that breakdown well before the race distance.

Are you being ironic? When was F1 last NOT like that? Not while I've been alive anyway.

[safc_fan89]

To be honest, which teams did Montoya think may try and sign him? He's had one and a half seasons at Mclaren where he was comprehensively outperformed by Kimi Raikkonen...that spoiled the hard work he had done at Williams to be in a position to race at a team like Mclaren.

Anyway, he's gone now so there is little point going on about it. I can't say I have been traumatised by his departure, it has been barely noticeable really.

[chunterer]

Hmmm a REAL modern day F1 fan in our midst!!

Well this was one of the biggest F1 stories for the last 20 years so hardly unnoticeable, but I see your point.

On one hand there is a driver who had unfulfilled his potential to a degree and the 'dream' move to McLaren didn't pay off - fact.

Yet on the other hand this driver (forgetting the fact that he actually wanted to leave F1 anyway) even with a few shunts and outbursts to his name is undoubtedly a better option than 2/3 of the grid. Anyone who thinks otherwise, possibly doesn't recognise relative comparisons between drivers.

Just what was it about German driver R or Italian driver J that made them so attractive to re-sign and one of them for 3 years?!! After all he had thrashed them both on several occassions and both drivers let's be honest had average seasons up until a couple of races ago.

The equation surely was to sign him instead of one of them for a renewed push next year, (and dare I say it someone who would give the technical guys a true barometer of the cars limits) but hold up, somebody clearly didn't see that.

I would tend to use this kind of argument for any driver who lost out to less obvious choices for a drive.

We should be thankful as Knowlesy says, that the guy isn't that bothered by it all and is at ease with his decision to leave F1.

[Splatz the Cow]

Chuntz, I appreciate you trying to keep us updated with the JPM issue, but I don't think it is best done from this type of site, which is employing cut and paste journalism.

Montoya has made extensive declarations of his feelings about his move to NASCAR already.

I provided a link to this here. http://tentenths.com/forum/showthread.php?t=86027

I suspect many here on the F1 forum have not read it yet because of its length.

[chunterer]

Not totally sure where your coming from with that splatz?

However, I'm fairly comfortable with my knowledge of the background and F1 in general so feel able to kick off such a thread which can talk about further opinions and thoughts not purely related to JPM fans only!

Thanks for reminding everyone of said link mate.

But ultimately this thread isn't purely about JPM, it's arguably about a rather poorer bigger picture...

[alan1302]

I don't think it's as important as it's been made out to be...he couldn't get a top drive in F1 so he decided to go to NASCAR where he'll still get big bucks and probably have a longer career.

He's even said if Ferrari offered him a deal he would probably have taken it so he was happy to stay in F1 just not with a team outside the top 3.

This kind of thing has even happened before when Nigel Mansell left F1 for Indycars and he was the WDC at the time as well.

Alan

[Splatz the Cow]

Originally Posted by chunterer

But ultimately this thread isn't purely about JPM, it's arguably about a rather poorer bigger picture...

Ah, okay. Maybe adjust the thread title a little to reflect that.

I think the atmosphere of F1 is a problem that will get worse.

If steps are taken to change the testing schedule this would improve the situation.

[chunterer]

Alan, bang on - even Senna threatened to walk out of F1 (tested Indycar Penske) so as you say along with Nigel's case, drivers disenchanted with their lot isn't a new thing.

Of course Ayrton was quite clever and always in a position where he could call the shots, wheras JPM never got to that level in F1.

splatz, point well made, I am sure that there are several drivers whose careers will continue for several years who would long for a more relaxed atmosphere like they would have had on their way up the ranks and indeed like F1 was in the past.

Problem is today, drivers can't walk out on F1 if they get fed up, have a sabbatical and just come back after a couple of years, there's too much pressure and not enough drives.

Last guy to try it was Zanardi, albeit after he had built a reputation in the States making him effectively a newcomer as the cars had moved on so much between 1994 and 1999.

Lauda did it successfully, Alan Jones attempted it but in those days the pace of development wasn't as vast, nor was there the ridiculous pandering to mega bucks sponsors and car manufacturers!

Take away the excessive corporate style that F1 is subject to and that'll be a start, testing would also be a good one as you say.

But I don't want to get into yet another debate about cost cutting and bloated F1 budgets ruining the sport.

[deejay]

Interesting suggestion in a story about Dan Wheldon.

Wheldon won the 2006 Rolex 24 Hours at Daytona in Ganassi's Grand American prototype this January driving with Scott Dixon and Casey Mears.

With Mears leaving Ganassi's NASCAR operation and being replaced by F1 driver and 2000 Indy 500 winner Juan Pablo Montoya, the idea of three open wheel stars returning to the 24 hours is certainly interesting.

Wheldon liked the idea but said that was, “between Juan and Chip.”

http://irl.racing-live.com/indy/en/h...16220523.shtml

[spectator22]

Agree with deejays earlier post - Montoya is out because no-one wanted him. Too many mistakes brought about by attitiude and lack of (mental) fitness to survive at very top level. If you define character as going around crashing into others and throwing races away then yes, F1 has lost a character. The departure (along with JV it seems) means that a young up and coming driver will get his spot in F1 which is a good thing.

[chunterer]

Originally Posted by spectator22

Agree with deejays earlier post - Montoya is out because no-one wanted him. Too many mistakes brought about by attitiude and lack of (mental) fitness to survive at very top level. If you define character as going around crashing into others and throwing races away then yes, F1 has lost a character. The departure (along with JV it seems) means that a young up and coming driver will get his spot in F1 which is a good thing.

Last sentence is irrefutable spectator, but as for throwing things away, well plenty of people have done that over time. It certainly wasn't a case of no one wanting him, more him not wanting to drive for a lesser team for peanuts. Full respect.

[Splatz the Cow]

Originally Posted by spectator22

Agree with deejays earlier post - Montoya is out because no-one wanted him. Too many mistakes brought about by attitiude and lack of (mental) fitness to survive at very top level. If you define character as going around crashing into others and throwing races away then yes, F1 has lost a character. The departure (along with JV it seems) means that a young up and coming driver will get his spot in F1 which is a good thing.

Your just stirring for trouble, right?

There has not been a single bit of evidence produced to show that Montoya was not wanted by a team. What the post states, is in opposition to all of the reality that has occured in the time that Montoyta has been in F1. This post indulges in fantasy, but without the unicorns and fairies.

There are some reasons speculated about Montoya's departure, and these are based on the breaking down of the relationship between Juan-Pablo and Ron Dennis, the suspected favouratism given to Kimi Raikkonen by Dennis against Juan-Pablo, and the poor performance by the McLaren over the last few years. Whether any of these or other real issues had influence on Montoya's decision to leave F1 is unproven.

There are other, openly discussed reasons that have been put forward by Ron Dennis and Montoya, and it is interesting to note, that there is little or no ill feeling between the two. It seems both were aware of some troubles and are happy to move on in their own directions.

The reaction in the media has been big, but both Montoya and Dennis have remained publicly very professional and courteous throughout.

Sometimes we wish there were a sinister, dark, reason that we can shake in the faces of fans we don't like, and stick one to the driver we hate, but no matter how much one hates a driver, it won't change reality.

Montoya left F1 for NASCAR because:
1. he was unhappy with his situation in F1
2. didn't see much in the future to make him happy in F1
3. wanted to spend more time with his family
4. saw an oppurtunity to work with Chip Gannassi With Felix Sabates Racing in NASCAR
5. saw an oppurtunity to spend less time testing
6. saw an oppurtunity to spend more time racing
7. saw an oppurtunity to spend more time with his family
8. saw an oppurtunity to be close to some other relatives
9. saw an oppurtunity to be happy.

This was from what Montoya said - sorry, I couldn't find a better source...