If Cart Fails will it affect F1 ?

Kirk · 9 Dec 2003, 00:28 (Ref:807078)

Sadly, CART seems to be barely hanging on this day. If it does indeed fold, the IRL will definitely be affected as there will be some decent drivers looking for work. The question I have: will F1 be affected in any way? Before you jump to say "NO WAY" remember that Townsend Bell had a less than auspicuous bout in CART and in fact failed rather miserably, yet he gets a chance to test in a F1 car. How about a svelt Paul Tracy, does he get a test for an F1 team? Are there any other drivers currently in CART that may get attention?

**Woolley** · 9 Dec 2003, 01:02 (Ref:807092)

The only thing that truly affects F1 is money. Every aspect is governed by the scramble for more. Either they've got way too much, or not enough, although curiously this doesn't stop the owners of very poor teams appearing in the rich lists.

Golden rule for an F1 driver is average to good + pots of money = seat time.

Kirk · 9 Dec 2003, 01:22 (Ref:807097)

Quote:

Originally posted by Woolley
The only thing that truly affects F1 is money. Every aspect is governed by the scramble for more. Either they've got way too much, or not enough, although curiously this doesn't stop the owners of very poor teams appearing in the rich lists.

Golden rule for an F1 driver is average to good + pots of money = seat time.

And I thought I was cynical. But you're right unfortunately .. and the continued fan support fuels such. The possible CART demise will only strengthen F1 and it's greed. Oh how I crave an alternative series!

alonso11 · 9 Dec 2003, 01:30 (Ref:807100)

If CART fails it will be a bit of a crusher for Ford as they are the one and only engine suplier of the category.It may effect Jaguar's budget.

By the way Tracy has already tested the Benetton in '94(or '95?), Haberfeld tested for McLaren, Stewart and Jordan, Junqueira was official Williams test pilot,Bourdais tested (and almost signed) with Arrows and tested for Renault too,so did Monteiro (who is -even if droped from the RDD program- still a Biatore pilot AFAIK) ... But since already over 10-15 pilots (Kovalainen, Lopez, Gommendy, Karthekeyan, Pantano, Verstappen, Wilson,Burti, Baumgartner, Yoong, Frentzen just to mention a few of them) are running for next season's 3 remaining F1 seats I don't think that any of those CART drivers will drive in F1 earlier than 2005.I mean IF CART fails but of course I really hope that it won't happen and as a matter of fact today I've read some positive news about the series' future finaly.

mountainstar · 9 Dec 2003, 01:40 (Ref:807102)

I would nominate Tracy for F1. He is at his peak performance and would do just as good as many others.

GTV27 · 9 Dec 2003, 02:03 (Ref:807108)

Some sponsors might migrate to F1.

Doubt that any of the drivers will though (thinks - they'd already be in F1 if they could, but they aren't, so they can't, and the failure of the series wouldn't affect that)

Having said that, if a sponsor wanted to take a Cart driver into F1, then money talks.

senna12 · 9 Dec 2003, 02:20 (Ref:807114)

Quote:

Originally posted by GTV27
Having said that, if a sponsor wanted to take a Cart driver into F1, then money talks.

And Gerald Forsythe, who is Paul's benefactor, has no shortage of coin. However, I think they would go to NASCAR first.

Bernie was going to get involved in CART, but he bailed, obviously for good reason. I'm sure he doesn't expect any negative effect on his little party, outside of increasing the driver pool somewhat.

Snrub · 9 Dec 2003, 02:43 (Ref:807123)

Not much effect I imagine. The only substantial impact on F1 that CART had was letting drivers compete on a more level playing field and show what they're really made of.

Fogelhund · 9 Dec 2003, 04:17 (Ref:807149)

Quote:

Originally posted by alonso11
If CART fails it will be a bit of a crusher for Ford as they are the one and only engine suplier of the category.It may effect Jaguar's budget.

FWIW, Ford Sponsors the series, but CART owns the engines, and has a contract with Cossie to service them. I'm not sure how it would be a crusher to Ford, nor how it would affect Jag's budget in any manner.

ascarracinguk · 9 Dec 2003, 06:52 (Ref:807217)

if cart fails then im wondering where the drivers will come from...f3000 looks like its gonna fail...theyll be comin from f3 and frenault....ok i know some have made the jump but its a big leap to make....only the cream can do it

GTV27 · 9 Dec 2003, 07:27 (Ref:807233)

There is never a shortage of drivers per se, but sometimes the pool of "experienced" drivers can be a bit shallow (I think is is what ascarracinguk is referring to).

Thus it can be a big jump from F3 to F1, but the testing positions (incl Friday's) will mean that the good (or well funded) ones will get some experience.

Super Tourer · 9 Dec 2003, 09:25 (Ref:807308)

IMO it's already had an impact.

The demise of CART began with the IRL/CART split which has demonstrated that two similar series are not sustainable, there aren't the budgets or sponsors to fund two parallel series.

Contrast this with the GPWC's plans to set up a breakaway series from F1 and you could have seen an action replay, but with F1 teams.

As we know, the GPWC and FOM are now working together over the future of F1, and it looks like a split is no longer on the cards.

Bearing in mind that many of the manufacturers in F1 either are, or have been recently been actively involved in IRL or CART, and will have watched events at close quarters - so I'm sure the CART/IRL split, and the result has had an impact on both sides of the F1 'divide'.

DriverT · 9 Dec 2003, 09:35 (Ref:807312)

Quote:

Originally posted by mountainstar
I would nominate Tracy for F1. He is at his peak performance and would do just as good as many others.

Would he fit into an F1 car? Isn't he a bit "muscular"?

climb · 9 Dec 2003, 09:40 (Ref:807315)

Apossible CART failure is not real problem for Tracy, who has several good links with NASCAR; in general I don't see why should CART end affect F!; should F1 fail, it would bring effects on CART, maybe, cos many F1 stars could attract sponsors to feed the "poor" CART teams..

BootsOntheSide · 9 Dec 2003, 10:04 (Ref:807329)

Considering that F1 has taken 5 drivers from CART in 10 years, and a lot of drivers who faiiled to get into f1 after F3000 managed impressive US careers, some reaching F1 later, it will have an impact on where the drivers will come from.

Anotehr effect might be to increase the popularity of F1 in North America, among fans who don't enjoy oval racing as much, or hate Tony George.

Relating to this, the temptation to add a second US race at a circuit like Laguna Seca might be too much to resist.

Had the split not happened, CART was starting to become a series rival to F1, and, had it moved towards Europe quicker, it may have forced F1 to go in a more 'human' direction, with lower technology and more accessible drivers and teams - alternatively, they may ahve gone the other way, making the technology and 'soap opera' their USP. This clearly hasn't happened.

climb · 9 Dec 2003, 10:28 (Ref:807346)

Arrivals from CART popular drivers like JPM or CDM did'nt really increase F1 appeal in the States.
Only a very strong yankee behind the wheel of a F1 car would succeed, regardless which series he comes from.
(Tony Stewart would undoubtedly work)

**Adam43** · 9 Dec 2003, 10:49 (Ref:807356)

Off topic, but Tracy has already tested an F1 car. A Benneton in the early '90s.

**Adam43** · 9 Dec 2003, 10:51 (Ref:807358)

On topic, CART has provided some drivers to F1 so a certain route to F1 has been lost. So maybe F3000 will benefit, although I don't think it would a lot.

Money wise, I think it'll make little different. A lot of the money in CART would not go to F1 because it is a different market.

f1manoz · 9 Dec 2003, 11:05 (Ref:807367)

Although CART won't fail, the apparent demise of F3000 will close another door to F1 for many up-and-coming drivers. Talent scouts will have to start hanging out at Formula Three events, although that appears to be what they are doing anyway. Who was the last driver to go from being F3000 straight to F1 (Nick Heidfeld wasn't it?)

If, and it's a BIG if, CART does disappear, then it will simply mean there will be 18 or so drivers without rides next season. Though most will end up in ALMS, a couple of NASCAR, a couple in Crapwagons probably.

The effect on F1 will be negligible. Won't make a difference either way.

**Bononi** · 9 Dec 2003, 11:38 (Ref:807384)

The only effect will be on drivers that didn't find a seat in F1 could find it in a "top" series.

RWC · 9 Dec 2003, 14:30 (Ref:807516)

I agree with most others-not much effect at all.
In fact you could ask an f1 team manager and they may even not know what you are talking about!Exaduration of course but there won't even be any sponser pickings for the vultures.I suspect most sponsers would change to indycar to keep exposing themselves to their chosen market

BootsOntheSide · 9 Dec 2003, 14:46 (Ref:807531)

Quote:

Originally posted by Super Tourer
IMO it's already had an impact.

The demise of CART began with the IRL/CART split which has demonstrated that two similar series are not sustainable, there aren't the budgets or sponsors to fund two parallel series.

Contrast this with the GPWC's plans to set up a breakaway series from F1 and you could have seen an action replay, but with F1 teams.

As we know, the GPWC and FOM are now working together over the future of F1, and it looks like a split is no longer on the cards.

Bearing in mind that many of the manufacturers in F1 either are, or have been recently been actively involved in IRL or CART, and will have watched events at close quarters - so I'm sure the CART/IRL split, and the result has had an impact on both sides of the F1 'divide'.

Quote:

Originally posted by ascarracinguk
if cart fails then im wondering where the drivers will come from...f3000 looks like its gonna fail...theyll be comin from f3 and frenault....ok i know some have made the jump but its a big leap to make....only the cream can do it

Quote:

Originally posted by Kirk
The possible CART demise will only strengthen F1 and it's greed.

And there are more examples. Not really unanimous that it'll ahve no effect, is it? And the changes people have come up with are largely unrelated.

high contrast · 9 Dec 2003, 14:58 (Ref:807541)

Super Tourer...I think the downfall of CART was the disasterous engine rule change that saw the major engine manufacturers leave the series, followed by the top teams defecting to IRL. Up untill then IRL was a poor cousin with alsoran drivers going around in circles! Who cared who won Indy?...At least now Indy has it's credability back again.

The pending demise of CART is a serious loss for 'Roadracing' in the USA in general and as a alternative berth for 'coming men' from Europe in particular! Not Good!

cos · 9 Dec 2003, 15:23 (Ref:807557)

I'm sure Bernie would love to have Long Beach back on the F1 schedule.

Super Tourer · 9 Dec 2003, 16:31 (Ref:807601)

Quote:

Originally posted by cos
I'm sure Bernie would love to have Long Beach back on the F1 schedule.

I think that's a distinct possibility, I'm sure Bernie would like 2, or even 3 races in America.

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
How does the budget affect you ?	touringlegend	Road Car Forum	23	26 Mar 2006 16:18
If CART Fails, How Will It Effect The IRL?	GP Racer	IRL Indycar Series	43	18 Jan 2004 20:01
How will Formula BMW affect British motor sport?	alfaman	National & International Single Seaters	57	31 Aug 2003 11:33
How will this affect?	Vandas	Australasian Touring Cars.	7	13 Oct 2001 23:43