[WEC] Toyota LMP1 Discussion

[AoB Special Stage]

[roderick]

A lot of info has surfaced and from my point of view all sounds true to extent.
- 100 Deg for battery is one thing that wont happen with the current setup. (cooling system will fail due to boiling)

- pre combustion they've used this year is unique to some extent. but no one knows who's using what...

- I thought Sic is being used already...maybe not full Sic but I'm pretty sure they are using it...(Toyota do have a large Hybrid R&D teams)

[chernaudi]

Originally Posted by Articus

Out of curiosity, why did Toyota so desperately need Buemi this weekend? When he wanted nothing to do with the Nurburgring. They have Kunimoto, Lapierre(well....), and Sarrazin possibly available to substitute.
And realistically could have done the race with 2 drivers.

Buemi's contract with TMG says that the WEC takes priority over Formula E in the event of a clash. Most of you already know my opinions on Formula E, but it's a fact that's what is stipulated in the contract.

[Adam43]

I suspect Articus knows that. That explains why they could demand he raced at Nurburgring, not why they would. He was wondering about why you would insist when there are good alternatives.

They do probably see him as the strongest in that car and want to keep him interested in the championship after Nurburgring.

[Scorchess]

Love these little technological tidbits about the drivetrain. Keep 'em coming!

[Japanese Samurai]

Originally Posted by TF110

Did he mean the technology for Toyota in general, or are they using a different/new type of pre combustion? I wonder if they have any plans on moving to a different type of battery beside li-ion. Also, is there any confirmation or talk about the silicon carbide semiconductor? I remember that being spoken of last year as tech they'd like to introduce.

Kota Sera (writer) confirms that Toyota's new combustion system is pre combustion chamber.
But he also says that details of pre combustion type is unknown.

[TF110]

On the battery front, I know Toyota are researching into solid state and lithium air. I read up a little and it seems they were using the SiC semiconductor on the front but not the rear last year.

I don't think Buemi would rather be in F-E over WEC or vice versa. I think he wants to do both and he's upset he cant. Everything from his comments shows this. He doesn't seem mad at Toyota, and if you look on his twitter feed, he mentions Toyota and his drivers title for them then his title in F-E. That might be nothing, but I feel the WEC might be a bit more prestigious

[Adam43]

Yep. He wants to do both, of course he does he's a racing driver. They looked at doing both, but it quickly became apparent that it wasn't on. So he's doing the WEC as he is a Toyota driver and that is what he wants.

Too much has been made of this. Here and in the press.

In this sub-forum it is clearly more prestigious. However I doubt they really used that language. They considered, looked at it, moved on. It is shame it wasn't on logistically as it would hark back to the "good old days" when such things did happen. It would have been a compromise though. I have now, again, made more of this than it deserves.

[Articus]

Curious to see the performance this weekend. Considering that everyone has 8MJ and the same fuel flow limit, the Toyota's have sure looked like they have more power than Porsche.

[TF110]

I don't know if Porsche will have the top speed advantage anymore either since they are running the high downforce kit. I think it's obvious the Toyota has more hybrid punch but Porsche has boosted later on from the initial acceleration zone.

[GasperG]

Post-race investigation has revealed significant damage to the underfloor of the #7 car as well as a hole in the rear wing, which caused cracks in the main plane during the race. The team believes this damage was caused by kerb riding for the underfloor and by unidentified flying debris which struck the leading edge of the rear wing main plane.

https://www.racingbytmg.com/addition...t-nurburgring/

[Akrapovic]

That would explain why the car was fast and then had a sudden speed drop off. Lopez got in and was pretty fast initially, but then dropped 30 seconds in a stint which didn't make sense.

[Hiro]

I think they should have change the rear aero during the race.

[Adam43]

That's a close call depending when it happened. They lost by 64s which is probably similar to the time in the pits of changing the wing and a lot less of changing the floor. Of course it might have been worth it if they had a SC at the right time to pull back that time.

A difficult call.

[TF110]

Well, the good thing is that it wasn't a fundamental issue but an accidental one. And if Toyota were keeping up pretty good for their so called worst track, I think they will be able to hang with Porsche everywhere else. So we still have potential close races to look forward to, and more fast laps!

[Articus]

Originally Posted by TF110

Well, the good thing is that it wasn't a fundamental issue but an accidental one. And if Toyota were keeping up pretty good for their so called worst track, I think they will be able to hang with Porsche everywhere else. So we still have potential close races to look forward to, and more fast laps!

Alternatively, their simulations were wrong for the Nurburg, and wrong for the rest of season where they "think" they will be competitive

[GasperG]

Is there any easy way how to measure #8 pace, they stared almost 5 laps behind and ended over 5 laps behind, how many seconds were they off if we take away those 5 laps?

[Bubak]

Num. 8 lost 8min: 25sec.235 (505 seconds) during a first pit stop (had 7 stops ... others had 6 and times from 6min19sec for wining num 2 and 6min: 42sec.137, seven was in the middle and lost that pace ....). They (8) crossed and finished line at time 6hour: 01 min: 47 sec.098, num. 2 6 hour: 00 min: 09 sec.607 as a winner. So, 8 almost did a whole end lap (spent more time on track in the end).

Of course, the data are from FIAWEC Alkamel page.

With one average laptime around 1min45sec (105 sec) it is 505 sec gap = first pit stop (five laps is 525 sec with 105 sec average ...) so, my very gross calculation (prediction) is saying to me, that num. 8 had more time on track and five laps gap is 525 sec, so they are on pace with Porsche, maybe slightly better. : D

And, also, num. 8 lost some time on the first pace lap when come to pits and others had already started a race, that is for sure...

Who knows, check lap times. But for me, it was OK!

[hondafan37]

Vasselon: 2020 LMP1 Regs to Feature “Fastest” Electric Cars of Era

http://sportscar365.com/lemans/wec/v...c-cars-of-era/

[Articus]

That sounded extremely positive. I'd love for Toyota to become the new Audi in the sport.

[GasperG]

Originally Posted by Japanese Samurai

Chunichi shimbun (local newspaper of Nagoya, HQ of Toyota) reports that Toyota to sell new gen all-solid-state battery EV in Japan in 2022.
It takes only few minutes to charge full.
http://www.chunichi.co.jp/s/article/...590085647.html

Looks like this news is already over the net:
http://www.independent.co.uk/life-st...-a7858616.html
https://www.businesslive.co.za/bd/co...-electric-car/
http://www.reuters.com/article/us-to...KBN1AA035?il=0

Automakers are apparently throwing massive R&D into batteries.

[AoB Special Stage]

Originally Posted by GasperG

Automakers are apparently throwing massive R&D into batteries.

And this is news, how?

[TF110]

Originally Posted by AoB Special Stage

And this is news, how?

A solid state battery being used in lmp1 would be a big move towards more electrification. And it'd be really good for packaging/weight saving.

[MaskedRacer]

Question: Does Toyota stay or go? If they stay, will they be unwelcome guests? Because I imagine they will scare off several potential buyers of LMP1 non hybrid cars if they do as little as run Le Mans only in 2018.

[broadrun96]

Originally Posted by MaskedRacer

Question: Does Toyota stay or go? If they stay, will they be unwelcome guests? Because I imagine they will scare off several potential buyers of LMP1 non hybrid cars if they do as little as run Le Mans only in 2018.

I don't know, their history doesn't show a dominant past so you can't help but think a few teams would take that swing. Although I'm in the 'Let's see the LMP1-Ps on track first' camp, not that I don't trust them but we've been told it's coming honest we'll have a car.