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Old 2 May 2018, 02:22 (Ref:3818772)   #2801
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Originally Posted by Peter Mallett View Post
As everyone knows I come from the less tech, more driver input school of thought.
Which tech do you want removed?

I certainly want the hybrid gubbins removed.

Aerodynamic surfacing is not really tech, it's just a consequence of a racing car that travels fast in an atmosphere rather than in a vacuum. F1 cars should be fast beasts that zip through corners in an astonishing way IMO. (And they should have naturally aspirated V12s, hehe.)
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Old 2 May 2018, 04:55 (Ref:3818792)   #2802
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The Mercedes teams have the best PU
HAD the best PU. Not anymore. The Ferrari PU is marginally ahead so far in 2018.
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Divide and rule, with only 4 teams voting in favour of the change?
One of those teams is powered by Ferrari. So your point that Mercedes and their customer teams have only voted for their own advantage is flawed.

You are indeed entitled to your opinion, but you are coming over as an unbalanced crank regarding the Mercedes PU.



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Old 2 May 2018, 05:04 (Ref:3818795)   #2803
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On the subject of the Ferrari PU, the FiA are keeping a close eye on the Ferrari ERS. They have had an initial look at it, and will apparently be having a closer look at the entire system in Spain.

Wonder if this has come about as a result of former Ferrari Chief Engine Designer Lorenzo Sassi (was fired from Ferrari last year), who is now with Mercedes? Maybe he has some "secrets" to be revealed.


Personally, I doubt the FiA will find anything at all. Can you imagine the uproar if they did and had to take away points from Ferrari??



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Old 2 May 2018, 06:49 (Ref:3818806)   #2804
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Old 2 May 2018, 11:04 (Ref:3818843)   #2805
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Originally Posted by F1Guy View Post
HAD the best PU. Not anymore. The Ferrari PU is marginally ahead so far in 2018.
One of those teams is powered by Ferrari. So your point that Mercedes and their customer teams have only voted for their own advantage is flawed.
It's clear that, despite claims to the contrary, F1 teams will only vote for things that give them a perceived advantage - or at the very least eliminate another team's advantage.

In this case, the point is that all 3 Mercedes powered teams, and one Ferrari powered team, are pushing for this change in aero regulations.
So surely the factor to consider is the aero - not who has the best PU. It would seem that those 4 teams involved feel that they want to eliminate other team's aero advantage(s).

Why only those 4 teams? Red Bull and McLaren claim the best chassis - perhaps Mercedes see RBR and McLaren as a genuine threat, and likewise with Sauber/FI/Williams view of STR?

I would definitely prefer to see discussion of the reasons behind the decision here - as opposed to throwing insults at other members - unless you are saying that the cause for the decline in Mercedes dominance is due to crank balancing?
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Old 12 May 2018, 11:42 (Ref:3821671)   #2806
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It is very interesting to read the transcript of the Friday press conference in Spain.
The four manufacturer engineering chiefs put the whole development of the Hybrid power units in perspective.
None of them are happy to loose the MGUH but they seem resigned for that to happen even though they seem to consider it is the most useful, and challenging part of the current engine.
There seems to be some doubt that the loss of that as a research area will in fact attract other manufacturers.
Even Honda, who purportedly have had the greatest difficulty on getting up to speed in that area will be disapointed to loose it.
I am still concerned that we are dumbing the power units down purely because a fixation by some fans, and some pundits, that energy wasting noise is vital to the continuation of F1.
A greater concentration in eliminating aero technology that has little use outside single seat racing would make a far greater contribution to the show.
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Old 13 May 2018, 10:33 (Ref:3822008)   #2807
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F1 is such a rudderless mess in terms of where the rules are going, its pretty farcical. To have all these multimillion dollar companies involved and they contiunue to make bonehead decisions time and time again with little accountacy is just astounding to me. I for one am completely for a reduction in aero, however the 2017 rules should never have come to pass in the manner in which they did. For all of Christian Horner's moaning and obvious vested interests, he is spot on with his comments. Why change the rules for 2019 only to change them again in 2021. F1 will forever continue to shoot itself in the foot and waste billions of dollars in the process.
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Old 13 May 2018, 10:45 (Ref:3822013)   #2808
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The increase in aero should never had happened. If anything aero should have been reduced, with tyres made bigger and DRS got rid of. But the people inside of the sport don’t seem to realise this
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Old 13 May 2018, 15:09 (Ref:3822117)   #2809
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The increase in aero should never had happened. If anything aero should have been reduced
Because that worked so amazingly well in 2009 and 2014
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Old 13 May 2018, 17:58 (Ref:3822139)   #2810
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I havnt been able to watch the F1 this weekend and ultimately keep up with the news. But I keep seeing something about Pirelli have change the tyre construction half way through the season? Which has benefited Merc and Red Bull
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Old 13 May 2018, 18:24 (Ref:3822141)   #2811
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They have changed the construction of the tyre after blistering issues at Barcelona during testing. I believe this construction is also going to be used at Paul Ricard and Silverstone.
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Old 14 May 2018, 01:47 (Ref:3822237)   #2812
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The problem is the more you simplify the more you risk looking like, as Marchionne said, 'global NASCAR'.
So what!?

Simplified front wings are a hugely sensible step.

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Old 14 May 2018, 01:50 (Ref:3822238)   #2813
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The increase in aero should never had happened. If anything aero should have been reduced, with tyres made bigger and DRS got rid of. But the people inside of the sport don’t seem to realise this
The tyres *were* made bigger!
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Old 14 May 2018, 07:40 (Ref:3822269)   #2814
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They have changed the construction of the tyre after blistering issues at Barcelona during testing. I believe this construction is also going to be used at Paul Ricard and Silverstone.
But should they be allowed to change the construction of the tyre half way through a season? I can fully understand if it was for a safety issue. But it’s clearly not otherwise they would change the construction fr the Monaco race.
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Old 14 May 2018, 08:45 (Ref:3822277)   #2815
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Maybe it should be up to the tyre company, within the rules obviously. At the end of the day I don't like this control tyre thing. More tyre manufacturers would make racing more exciting.
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Old 14 May 2018, 15:08 (Ref:3822338)   #2816
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for me the concern of multiple tire manus is that one team will sign up an essentially bespoke deal with a tire manu and the two will use their money and size to further tilt the scales to their advantage....but then again thats really my problem with everything F1 related.

anyways, i think what we are seeing from Pirelli is just a function of more testing....with every test they complete they will naturally collect more data and as a result modify the construction of their compounds accordingly.

certainly prefer this pattern to the lack of testing paradigm that plagued the early days of the Pirelli era.
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Old 14 May 2018, 15:54 (Ref:3822350)   #2817
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I think after 7 years they finally figured something out... 2017 was a pretty decent year and Bahrain was a great race because drivers were able to push the tyres. What you ideally want is for there to be two choices during a race: either push hard or save tyres. For all the Pirelli years bar last year there was always one clear better strategy: saving. Now with better tyres that don't degrade as much teams have a choice again.


I maintain the only way to get good racing in a near-spec series like F1 is to give drivers and teams as many strategy choices as possible.
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Old 14 May 2018, 16:22 (Ref:3822357)   #2818
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I’m not sure what was worked out. 2017 was good, but could have been much better. Bahrain was as good as could be though. Really though we do not need tyres that are below par. It would be better to have another tyre company to push Pirelli along
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Old 14 May 2018, 16:38 (Ref:3822368)   #2819
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are you kidding? the last thing f1 needs is a tyre war.
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certainly prefer this pattern to the lack of testing paradigm that plagued the early days of the Pirelli era.
the scary thing is that those days will be upon us again if pirelli ever decide not to renew their contract or another company outbids them.
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Old 14 May 2018, 16:45 (Ref:3822371)   #2820
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No, F1 needs a lot less things than a tyre war. By not allowing competition, it’s been to easy for Pirelli. I’m sure Pirelli are here to stay, but they need to provide the teams with the best tyres available
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Old 14 May 2018, 17:47 (Ref:3822391)   #2821
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are you kidding? the last thing f1 needs is a tyre war.
yep no tire war for me either.

maybe if F1 sorts out its other issues first then i would see more appeal but all things equal i would have to think fixing F1, whether that be through aero, engine, money rule tweaks, then keeping the tires a constant would make that work easier to accomplish no?

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the scary thing is that those days will be upon us again if pirelli ever decide not to renew their contract or another company outbids them.
when does their contract expire? do any other tire companies even want to deal with F1?

i dont think things have really been that easy for Pirelli. the teams complain far too much for that.
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Old 14 May 2018, 17:49 (Ref:3822394)   #2822
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Well no tyre war means less likely to see an underdog do well. Really though we need less aero more than anything. Then it’s up to the tyre companies to decide how to design their tyres. They need to open it up for more companies to join
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Old 14 May 2018, 19:16 (Ref:3822410)   #2823
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But should they be allowed to change the construction of the tyre half way through a season?
I've no problem with it. It doesn't have to be for just safety. They were given a direction to produce tyres that can be pushed this may help that.

to be a bit silly for fun I'd have them change it randomly before each race and not tell the teams what they were getting.
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Old 14 May 2018, 19:21 (Ref:3822411)   #2824
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Well no tyre war means less likely to see an underdog do well.
I am not sure how that would work. I agree with the prior comments that tire manufactures will end up optimizing tires for larger teams and everyone else will get screwed. Given that is how things has seemed to work in the past?

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Old 14 May 2018, 20:29 (Ref:3822421)   #2825
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I guess the suggestion is that we used to get results like Minardi on the front row at Phoenix with Pirelli.
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