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Old 30 Nov 2004, 10:20 (Ref:1167861)   #26
iucrmh
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Originally posted by SALEEN S7R
The LM 2004 annual is available now at amazon.co.uk - now to order my copy.
It is preorder only at the moment, it was supposed to have been published on November 15th, but there has been some delay. Mine should come as part of my ACO Collector Membership but at £21 the Amazon offer is an absolute bargain. Recommended to any Sportscar fan.
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Old 30 Nov 2004, 10:39 (Ref:1167885)   #27
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Yep I normally buy all my motorsport books from Amazon now if I can, some more shall we say "recognised" companies operating on the internet would charge u £35! for the LM annual, which I would still pay. But when u can get it so much cheaper at somewhere like Amazon it does make me kind of mad that there are a few big companies on the internet specalising in motorsport goods and that are basically ripping people off. Ah well, rant over.
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Old 30 Nov 2004, 12:04 (Ref:1167956)   #28
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I understand what you mean. However, I do like to support the specialist sellers when I can, they do carry a vastly wider selection than Amazon (for instance) and I would hate to see a time when they are no longer around. That said, if I can find a book cheaper by more than a couple of pounds elsewhere, that's where I'll go.
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Old 30 Nov 2004, 15:44 (Ref:1168137)   #29
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Originally posted by iucrmh
Well, I'm lucky enough to have finally got a complete set of annuals (the wonders of ebay), from 1978 to 2003, still waiting for 2004 to appear. The following are available in French only, 1980-1983, 1985, 1986 and 1994.
I have them all in English.
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Old 30 Nov 2004, 16:44 (Ref:1168171)   #30
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My first post since I had to register to query the last comment. I have the full set of Le Mans Year Books and after extensive research thought that I had bottomed out the question of which issues were only in French text. I support iucrmh's comment since I believed these to be 1980, 81, 82, 83, 85, 86 and 94. I have checked with two well known motorsport booksellers this afternoon, and both were 'on my side' and had never seen English text versions of those that simon c possesses. Simon c, where did you obtain your English versions from?

The first two editions, 78 and 79 were imported from France in English, and then in 1980 this ceased. I gather they issued the 1984 edition in English because of the involvement of Jaguar and the thought of good sales in the USA etc. I assume the same thought, although a year late, was behind the English edition in 87, and thereafter. 1994 was never printed in English because of a change of publisher so the story goes. I shall be interested to hear more since if I have been under a misaprehension for some while I would like to obtain the English versions.

Incidentally, the 2004 edition has been held up because of a change of publisher. Virgin have taken over and currently have not set a date for release even though the books are ready to go!

Last edited by jna; 30 Nov 2004 at 16:45.
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Old 30 Nov 2004, 17:18 (Ref:1168190)   #31
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Welcome to the forum, jna. I'm with you on all dates mentioned above. I heard a whisper once of a 1982 in English, but every specialist I've ever spoken to has giggled at the suggestion.

Regarding booksellers, I have to rant in response to Saleen's rant. You might well find that Amazon can do the book for £14.99, but just because Amazon are doing it over-cheaply doesn't mean that anyone else is engaged in a "ripoff". The recommended retail price as set by the publisher is £35 and that's what most suppliers will offer it at because the margins don't allow them to do anything else. Just because Amazon has either got an exquisite deal from the publisher or is just possibly using the book as a loss-leader to attract more custom doesn't mean that everyone else is in a position to do the same.
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Old 30 Nov 2004, 17:44 (Ref:1168211)   #32
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I have never heard of a 1994 in English - the publisher sent out a circular inviting orders for the French version as they were not going to do an English one...

The 1988-91 editions had 2-5 on the spine, I think, so there was a definite "new series" feel to them.
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Old 30 Nov 2004, 17:52 (Ref:1168220)   #33
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BTW, this year book should be published next week (French version).

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Old 30 Nov 2004, 19:16 (Ref:1168273)   #34
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I order the English version of this years book of Amazon last night, I can't have till christmas though to get it. Saying that last years copy turn about 3 days after christmas, I am not holding my breath,
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Old 30 Nov 2004, 19:25 (Ref:1168280)   #35
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Well, I have been searching for 1989, 1991, 1992, 1993, 1994, 1995, and 1996 for the longest time. If I ever come across any of these , I am willing to pay a large amount for one or all!!! I have 87, 88, 90, 97, 98, 99, 00, 01, 02, 03, and waiting for 2004!
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Old 30 Nov 2004, 20:21 (Ref:1168311)   #36
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I confer with the dates listed for 'French only' issues. I have even started buying them if they're going at the right price..!

If anyone knows where I can get 91, 93 or 97 in English at a sensible price let me know please
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Old 30 Nov 2004, 20:24 (Ref:1168314)   #37
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Oh, and ref the source of my new books, I will always go with the cheapest of Collectors Carbooks, Chaters, Duke and Amazon - all four offer good service and I would always aim to buy from one of the first two presuming the price is right. I do often wonder though how small the marging must be on Amazons rates and, presuming they're making a profite however small, why the specialists won't match their prices. Even a £1 profit is a profit after all?
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Old 30 Nov 2004, 21:12 (Ref:1168363)   #38
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Last year Amazon screwed up (I think) and discounted the price from $30 to $21 - yes, $ - and then translated the $ into £. So I got the 2003 edition for little more than a tenner.

I got the 1991 edition brand new whilst at Univ for £12.95 as that was the price sticker on it in Dillons. Still puzzling over that one, it was pre-Net Book Agreement. I guess because it was still sealed in its wrapper they did not see the RRP inside and guessed.
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Old 1 Dec 2004, 08:07 (Ref:1168661)   #39
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Its bargains like that that make the hunting around worth while!
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Old 1 Dec 2004, 11:28 (Ref:1168875)   #40
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[QUOTE]Originally posted by jna
[B]My first post since I had to register to query the last comment. I have the full set of Le Mans Year Books and after extensive research thought that I had bottomed out the question of which issues were only in French text. I support iucrmh's comment since I believed these to be 1980, 81, 82, 83, 85, 86 and 94. I have checked with two well known motorsport booksellers this afternoon, and both were 'on my side' and had never seen English text versions of those that simon c possesses. Simon c, where did you obtain your English versions from?


I bought a few at LM last year. Others - there were limited English runs. My old fella has 83 and 86 in English too. There was an 83 English version on Ebay last year too.
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Old 1 Dec 2004, 12:03 (Ref:1168894)   #41
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Hello Simon,

Thanks for that information. I really am amazed at what you say, and indeed am most surprised that those in the profession that I referred to have never heard of these English text versions and yesterday kind of laughed at me for suggesting they existed. In particular 1994. We all thought that one was a most definite no no! I never saw an English version offered for sale at the time.

I currently have two emotions running side by side. Firstly I'm a little envious of you, and the second is the annoyance of having taken what I thought was good firm advice which was clearly wrong.

The result of that advice was to buy a run of the books a while ago to obtain what I thought were French only editions. When they were first published I didn't bother with them, taking the view that the articles in English in Grand Prix International specials and Autosport etc. were good enough for me. My French is not good enough to sit and read a technical book with ease. The seller wouldn't split the run so I had to buy some English editions I already owned, thus I could fulfill Garrett's ambition to have the 1989 and 1992 editions.

Simon, the 1984 English edition's sleeve says "24 Heures Du Mans" on the spine (as per the French version) and in small print "English Edition" on the front picture. Is that style mirrored on the English versions you own of 1980/1/2/3/5/6 and 1994? I would be interested to know.

Oh well, back to the eBay search engine. Never rains does it!

John

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Old 1 Dec 2004, 12:32 (Ref:1168923)   #42
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Hello John,
It looks like my delight in achieving a complete set was short lived, given that there may be some English editions about. I would say though that these were definitely not on any kind of general release, so must be very rare. Where at Le Mans did Simon manage to get these? I try my best to trawl around the various sellers. The search goes on.

Cheers
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Old 1 Dec 2004, 16:09 (Ref:1169076)   #43
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I do often wonder though how small the marging must be on Amazons rates and, presuming they're making a profite however small, why the specialists won't match their prices. Even a £1 profit is a profit after all?
Craig, as you know I do have a little bit of an inside track on this. Trust me - none of the book specialists you mentioned who have a physical shop could even come close to matching Amazon's price and still turn a profit of any kind. It's a combination of Amazon twisting the publishers' arm for an exclusive percentage that they don't offer to the little guy (in this context anyone from WH Smith downwards) and the fact that Amazon doesn't have a shop or shops to staff and pay rent on.

Why do Amazon get such good terms? Well, they'll be able to confidently predict selling a thousand of any given title such as a LM yearbook, but will be able to get away with offering (for example) the new Italian book on Luigi Villoresi as a photo on their website. If someone wants to buy that, Amazon can then get it from the publisher.

Collectors Carbooks and Chaters have to get in examples of both titles and a hundred more to physically sit in the shop to be inspected by the customers. The money Amazon will have saved on not stocking those specialist titles will go towards the investment they have to make in the Yearbook.
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Old 2 Dec 2004, 15:39 (Ref:1169930)   #44
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A UK motorsport bookseller is advertising the 2003 (English text I assume) Moity/Tessedre Le Mans Year Book at a sale price of £7.99. A bargain indeed for anyone out there still in need of one. Would mention the name, but not sure if that is allowed.
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Old 2 Dec 2004, 15:49 (Ref:1169937)   #45
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I haven't seen or heard any complaints about mentioning names of suppliers before so I'll take the risk, Chaters have the 2003 Annual for £7.99 and the 2000 Annual at £9.99 as well.
Cheers
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Old 4 Dec 2004, 14:10 (Ref:1170588)   #46
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I received the 2004 issue yesterday. Wonderful!
The 1924 edition for the historical part, and still, very good pictures.
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Old 6 Dec 2004, 17:19 (Ref:1172575)   #47
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I finally got my hands on the 2004 English edition at the weekend...........as usual it is a must have item for anyone with pretensions to being a Le Mans freak.

A few niggles such as getting Steve O'Rourke's name wrong in the obit section but otherwise v good.

But then I am biased.
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Old 8 Dec 2004, 13:08 (Ref:1174323)   #48
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Reverting back to the posts regarding the English and/or French editions of the older editions of the book, I wonder if Simon C can help me.

At the end of last week I emailed Chaters in the UK, as I guess they ought to know, and they quickly responded to say that they had never seen English text versions for 1980/1/2/3/5/6 and 1994. Simon Lewis Booksellers, Pooks, and Motorsport Books at Silverstone all said the same. I also contacted T E Worth, a bookseller in the USA who regularly, and currently, has around two thirds of the full set in stock. Their response was the same, adding that they would love to see one.

I was also able to track down David Waldron in France. He translated the 1987 edition and in total has edited and/or translated about a dozen editions in all, including the 2004 edition. His reaction was no different, and in particular agreed that 1994 was missed out. He surely ought to know, I think you will agree.

One way of establishing the facts, and as an avid Le Mans collector I am very keen to do so, is if you would be so kind as to scan a page from two or three of these English editions, and post them on the forum. If you wish I can give you my email address instead. How about 1980, 1983 (the rare edition in French), and 1994?

I feel awkward about this since on the face of it this post impiles that I don't believe you. Trust you understand and I will freely apologise if all the people I have spoken to are incorrect.

John

PS, I know this sounds daft, but are your Year Books the ones issued annually with Autosport?
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Old 13 Dec 2004, 21:01 (Ref:1178669)   #49
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I have just had an e-mail from Amazon to say that it is not yet in stock and it will not be in stock for another 4 to 6 weeks.
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Old 14 Dec 2004, 09:55 (Ref:1179021)   #50
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I have just had an e-mail from Amazon to say that it is not yet in stock and it will not be in stock for another 4 to 6 weeks.
Yes, and that was followed by another one today stating that the book has not yet been published. This appears to ratify a comment to me by a bookshop a couple of weeks ago inasmuch as with Virgin now publishing the English edition there was likely to be a long delay with the release.

Now, whilst on the subject of English versions, I am disappointed that I have not as yet had a response to what I hoped was a reasonable request for some help from Simon C in connection with the older editions that on the quiet were published in English.

I know that I am a very new member to the forum, but I am not a new reader. I hate the term lurker! I have no insight into driver or team thoughts or news as I do not have the contacts, hence I have never had anything to say. I did, until this scenerio arose, think that my knowledge of Le Mans books was reasonable, hence my shock at what Simon had to say.

Simon, I know that you have read my PM to you, so please can you help with some evidence that I can show the bookshops that deny all knowledge of these editions? Please?

Many thanks

John
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