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Old 5 Oct 2010, 18:26 (Ref:2769882)   #31
J.C.
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idk, I still say Williams will be the first team, because Williams and Porsche have a small partnership with the Flywheel KERS Systems, and the Porsche Hybird Car.

I still also say Toro Rosso. Because VW is a supplier sponsor for the team.

I don't think Red Bull Racing, because they want to get there hands on a Mercedes engine. Don't know if it will happen, but maybe it will.

I see Sauber switching to Mercedes power in the coming years.

But I still say McLaren could switch to Porsche power after there contract is up with Mercedes in 2015. Porsche wont come in till after 2013 (engine supplier only) I still say the contract could end a year or two early.
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Old 6 Oct 2010, 14:30 (Ref:2770317)   #32
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Originally Posted by phoenix;
In the history of the Constructors Championship, there have only been two car manufacturers who have one it - Ferrari and Renault...

However there have been 10 engine manufacturers that have won...
that just sounds too crazy to be true, but it is. I suppose you could say Honda came close but close doesn't account for much. if past history is anything to go by, the only conclusion I can draw is the the 'manufacturer era' has been a complete failure. not just in terms of victory but also in terms of the condition of the sport and the spend spend spend attitude all the teams have now adopted to the detriment of sustainable development.

when I first read the story I though wow what great news, but your perspective on it makes me now think its better if the manu's just stick to what they know and supply engines.
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Old 6 Oct 2010, 15:57 (Ref:2770354)   #33
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Originally Posted by phoenix View Post
In the history of the Constructors Championship, there have only been two car manufacturers who have one it - Ferrari and Renault
Ever heard of Lotus? Manufacturers and winners of many constructors titles (7 WCC's I think, to go with the 6 WDC titles.)

Actually whilst on the subject, you also overlooked Matra, French car manufacturers, who won the WDC & WCC in 1969.

McLaren have also manufactured cars since launching the F1 (3 seater) roadcar project in the early 1990's... more latterly they built the McLaren Mercedes Sports Coupe at their Woking factory, and of course they are soon to be marketing (it has already been released to the world) their own range of road cars.

You could also say Alfa, Maserati and Mercedes came close, winning WDC's in the years immediately prior to the WCC being introduced in 1958. They likely would have won the WCC to back their Drivers titles had there been a WCC from the start of the WDC. But I am splitting hairs really, the point you make is very valid.

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Originally Posted by phoenix View Post
That only leaves Honda and Porsche who have previously won (in other people's chassis) but are not racing in F1 today.
I know you are probably talking of Championships here, but both Honda and Porsche won races in their own chassis, powered by their own engines. (Honda won 3, one each in 1965, 1967 and of course 2006), Porsche winning the 1962 French GP in the hands of Gurney.

Last edited by E.B; 6 Oct 2010 at 16:03.
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Old 6 Oct 2010, 17:53 (Ref:2770404)   #34
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Originally Posted by E.B View Post
Ever heard of Lotus? Manufacturers and winners of many constructors titles (7 WCC's I think, to go with the 6 WDC titles.)

Actually whilst on the subject, you also overlooked Matra, French car manufacturers, who won the WDC & WCC in 1969.

McLaren have also manufactured cars since launching the F1 (3 seater) roadcar project in the early 1990's... more latterly they built the McLaren Mercedes Sports Coupe at their Woking factory, and of course they are soon to be marketing (it has already been released to the world) their own range of road cars.

You could also say Alfa, Maserati and Mercedes came close, winning WDC's in the years immediately prior to the WCC being introduced in 1958. They likely would have won the WCC to back their Drivers titles had there been a WCC from the start of the WDC. But I am splitting hairs really, the point you make is very valid.



I know you are probably talking of Championships here, but both Honda and Porsche won races in their own chassis, powered by their own engines. (Honda won 3, one each in 1965, 1967 and of course 2006), Porsche winning the 1962 French GP in the hands of Gurney.
I was suggesting that Porsche would be only the third car manufacturer to become WCC winners if they produced a winning engine and chassis. Lotus never won with a Lotus engine, Matra didn't win with their own engine, McLaren have never won with their own engine - though maybe one day? Similarly Mercedes haven't - yet. Who knows what Rosberg & co can manage in 2011?

I don't think 'nearly' winning would suit Porsche - they wouldn't want to be just another Honda, Alfa Romeo, BMW effort that failed. Providing only winning engines rather than cars has never harmed Ford/Cosworth, Tag Porsche, Honda or Mercedes however.
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Old 6 Oct 2010, 20:00 (Ref:2770486)   #35
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http://www.carmagazine.co.uk/News/Se...Le-Mans-teams/
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Old 8 Oct 2010, 01:46 (Ref:2771161)   #36
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Originally Posted by E.B View Post
Actually whilst on the subject, you also overlooked Matra, French car manufacturers, who won the WDC & WCC in 1969.

.
1969 WDC was Jackie Stewart driving a Matra-Ford for Ken Tyrrel.
Matra built the chassis, but then sold it to Tyrrel who ran it for JYS.
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Old 8 Oct 2010, 02:06 (Ref:2771169)   #37
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Originally Posted by wnut View Post
1969 WDC was Jackie Stewart driving a Matra-Ford for Ken Tyrrel.
Matra built the chassis, but then sold it to Tyrrel who ran it for JYS.
The chassis was the MS80. The team was run as a non works team, though under the auspices of 'Matra International'.
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Old 8 Oct 2010, 17:44 (Ref:2771524)   #38
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Skoda clearly. Or Bugatti. Or Lambo. Or Bentley again? Having said that I have ignored the obvious; Scania and MAN.
A I right in thinking that the diesel land speed record is held by JCB ? Bring on Team JCB in F1
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Old 8 Oct 2010, 17:49 (Ref:2771526)   #39
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A I right in thinking that the diesel land speed record is held by JCB ? Bring on Team JCB in F1
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Old 8 Oct 2010, 21:50 (Ref:2771650)   #40
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Surprised no one has linked to this article http://motorsport.com/news/article.asp?ID=390309&FS=F1 Official says Porsche can afford OWN TEAM. In other words, not an engine manufacturer, but a constructor as well.
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Old 8 Oct 2010, 21:59 (Ref:2771659)   #41
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Surprised no one has linked to this article http://motorsport.com/news/article.asp?ID=390309&FS=F1 Official says Porsche can afford OWN TEAM. In other words, not an engine manufacturer, but a constructor as well.
That's interesting in itself, it suggests Porsche see an up turn in the world economy if they are able to run their own team in 2013.
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Old 8 Oct 2010, 22:07 (Ref:2771665)   #42
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Glad to see this thread has gone back to resembling something to do with the title!!!

Well that is interesting, running their own team might not be that surprising, as by then they may have already owned one for 1 or 2 years as the basis?

Then here's another addition to the mix there's the Toyota Cologne premises with all that R&D Design and manufacturing facility.
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Old 5 Sep 2017, 10:25 (Ref:3764682)   #43
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Back from the dead!


Finally we're getting somewhere.

Porsche confirms interest as engine supplier.

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/p...r-2021-949446/

Would be great to see them on the grid in 2021.
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Old 5 Sep 2017, 10:42 (Ref:3764685)   #44
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Back from the dead!


Finally we're getting somewhere.

Porsche confirms interest as engine supplier.

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/p...r-2021-949446/

Would be great to see them on the grid in 2021.
There's definitely a big leap in the article though from Porsche saying they attended meetings and are glad with the direction the regulations are heading, and the writer claiming they are 'seriously considering'. Nothing from Porsche suggests anything else than being an interested observer, who is open to potential and just sounding out the possibilities.
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Old 5 Sep 2017, 10:59 (Ref:3764687)   #45
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There's definitely a big leap in the article though from Porsche saying they attended meetings and are glad with the direction the regulations are heading, and the writer claiming they are 'seriously considering'. Nothing from Porsche suggests anything else than being an interested observer, who is open to potential and just sounding out the possibilities.
Perhaps they are waiting for a patron to fund the design, build & development of the engine, like in the TAG days
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