[Driver] Should Frijns, Bianchi or Bird be given a chance to join the 2013 F1 grid?!

[ace007]

Should Frinjs, Bianchi or Bird be given a chance to join the 2013 F1 grid?!







What do you think guys ?

[Bononi]

All three, two or just one ?



Who should leave then ?

[wnut]

Bianchi - Force India 2013 is my tip.

[Mekola]

Perhaps Bianchi at Force India, Frijns as Sauber tester.
Or one of them trying at the three (or two) minnow teams.

[bella]

it's absolutely perfect timing for bianchi. he's completely ready. his racecraft is awesome, he understands tyres and how to use them, and he's got the experience with teams to be able to get them working for him as well as with him. watching him this season has been a bit of a masterclass in the difference between a driver and a f1 driver, without the princess attitude that comes with actually racing a f1 car and having everything done for you.

i think frijns still needs to learn a lot of that - his speed and talent has carried him so far and he's righteously talented but imo he needs to learn the people skills that bianchi has. i guess that's maturity as a human being rather than a driver. a worthwhile watch and listen is the interview he did with espn at paul ricard, when he's not on the offensive and he drops the prickly media face he's very likeable and his honesty is far less... offensive.

i'd really like to see bird get a chance in f1 just to see his racecraft on display, but unless hamilton (or rosberg) throws his toys sky-high in the next year or two then realistically i'm not sure the opportunities will be there.

i started to name some other drivers in 3.5 that imo f1 teams should be looking at as well but got up to about 7 or 8 names and realised i was probably going to name half the field

[Hawkwood]

Originally Posted by bella

i started to name some other drivers in 3.5 that imo f1 teams should be looking at as well but got up to about 7 or 8 names and realised i was probably going to name half the field

That's the main problem when talking about feeder series guys who could slot in at the top table and do a good job.
As you alluded to, probably around half would do fairly well (which is all that could be expected of a rookie).
If you took the top 6 say, from GP2 and FR3.5 and swapped them for F1 drivers, in all honesty there's probably only around 7 or 8 F1 drivers who would be missed. For the rest, it wouldn't really make a difference, if you know what I mean.

[BackmarkerUK]

Originally Posted by ace007

Should Frinjs, Bianchi or Bird be given a chance to join the 2013 F1 grid?!

Should they be given a chance? Yes, I don't think there's any good reason for F1 teams to rule them out completely.

Should they actually join the grid? Well, if we're going to give the top three of Formula Renault 3.5 serious consideration, then there are plenty of other drivers who should also be given serious consideration. Luca Filippi, Davide Valsecchi, Robert Wickens, etc. etc. etc. And also you have to consider who on the current grid would chose to lose out.

[ptclaus98]

Interesting omission in AFDC. He's shown great adaptability as well as pace I think if RBYD are looking for another Vettel, this kid is it. I think he could handle being thrown in on the deep end.

[bella]

i think afdc is a given, there's far less uncertainty about him. red bull will either use him as a weapon to get the best out of jev and ricciardo next year or just kick one of them out mid-season when they can't quite match their teammate, regardless of the reasons behind it. the named 3 - the top 3 - are all in slightly less clear situations.

Originally Posted by Ostrogothicus

That's the main problem when talking about feeder series guys who could slot in at the top table and do a good job.
As you alluded to, probably around half would do fairly well (which is all that could be expected of a rookie).

i think perez is a good example of exactly the type of job half the grid would do. i don't think that's a huge praise of the 3.5 2012 grid, or throwing shade at sergio, it's just... i think it's just how it is.

i seem to be about the only one outside of belgium whos seriously impressed with stoffel vandoorne though so maybe my judgement is questionable

[chico]

I think Bianchi is quick enough for sure but too much of a tendency for recklessness and silly misakes a la Grosjean and Maldonado. Frijns is impressive but not ready yet. Bird would do well I think. Always races strong and impressive when coming through the field! Unless you start them with Red Bull, they've got to be able to battle through traffic and that's where Bird is strong.

[bella]

you say bianchi makes silly mistakes, i can think of two - binning it at the nurburgring and misjudging it into magnussen at barcelona. which is no worse than frijns did the following day... and a big improvement on his gp2 years. i've probably forgotten more though?

imo it's not going to convert into a maldonado or grosjean situation - he's too smart for that. he had plenty of opportunities to cock it up and drive into someone during the season but didn't do it.

agree about bird being a ninja in traffic, but i wonder how much his challenging season with isr has impacted on his reputation? or is it the same as the wobbly year ricciardo had with the same team the previous year?

[chico]

Fair point bella on Bianchi and Frijns. Both made mistakes although the Frijns one on Sunday may not have been a "mistake". That's a different debate altogether though. Concerning Bianchi, I'm a fan... the guy has serious talent. But for as long as I've followed him, he's had problems with spatial awareness. IF he can sort that out... wow.

As for Bird and Ricciardo, I think that the people in the know appreciate that they were racing for a more modest team and that they "outperformed" their car. I think the team owner even said that he felt his car was pretty poor.

Again, because F1 rookies are never going to land straight at RBR / Ferrari / McL, it's always quite telling for me how drivers do in the less fancied teams in the feeder categories.

[bella]

i don't know if bianchi's problem is spacial awareness per se - he seemed to be a victim of the wrong place/wrong time accident black hole in gp2, and if i remembered anything about his f3 years i'd comment on those too maybe it's his anticipation of others that isn't quite up to scratch, he sees them but he doesn't guess what they're going to do correctly. i think he was demonised a bit in gp2, and if driving standards are as poor in fr3.5 as him and bird (allegedly) declared, then why wasn't he and everyone else involved in more accidents?

i agree with you about the previous experience in the uh, quieter teams being important for looking at their f1 potential. bird's monaco drive was outrageous but on his quieter weekends he did disappear a long way back. when bianchi had a wobbly weekend he still finished in the points, or was going like a bat out of hell trying to get there. much like frijns, but then he didn't do particularly well at the changing conditions races, whereas bird and bianchi (and sorensen) were the ones finding the grip the quickest.

i'm sure we're discussing this in the wrong forum, but it's always interesting to get a f1 biased angle on the non-f1 battles... or er, something

[JeremySmith]

I would put Bianchi alongside Sutil at Force India myself..

Of course this whole excersise may be in vain..

[Hawkwood]

Originally Posted by JeremySmith

I would put Bianchi alongside Sutil at Force India myself..

Of course this whole excersise may be in vain..

You'd bring Sutil back over di Resta?

I've never really been enthused with Bianchi, but he is clearly one of the guys that seems destined for F1.
The men at the top obviously see something I don't (or don't 'quite yet').

[wolfhound]

Looks like Force India now has a lot of young talent and experienced talent to choose from judging from all those who are loosing drives.

[JeremySmith]

Originally Posted by Ostrogothicus

You'd bring Sutil back over di Resta?

I've never really been enthused with Bianchi, but he is clearly one of the guys that seems destined for F1.
The men at the top obviously see something I don't (or don't 'quite yet').

Yes because I think Sutil is faster and more clinical..

[ace007]

If I was running a team, I would save Kobayashi for his raw speed and "freshness", enthused Japan + some extra sponsorship and forget about "boring" di Resta or "chatty" Alguerssari.

Combining experience with raw talent, I would give Bird a green light over Bianchi without the shadow of a doubt. Why? Because it is about the overall package and even if Bianchi is mighty fast on one lap, he does seem to make too many mistakes in racing conditions whereas Bird delivers most of the time when fighting along and giving each pilot coming next a run for his money (see Spa in WSR this year... From last (fuel penalty...) to 5th - The drive of the year in many people's mind in the WSR paddock).

But politics and sponsorship packages are usually taking a lot of importance, even for a now well-funded team like F. India.

[Jacques Rabbit]

Bird's name doesn't come up if he's not British, in my opinion. There's not much there, though I'll take him over Chilton if I need an English media darling on my team.

Frijns? Definitely someone I think is worth a shot. I liked his move in the finale, too.

I liked the one Bianchi put on him before that even better, though.

da Costa? Give him another year. He has more potential than anyone, so I'd like to see him get one more year. Or I'd just like to see him and Magnussen fighting.

[Mekola]

Frijns confirmed as Sauber 3rd and reserve driver for 2013.

[m355y]

Like others I'm slightly in the dark about what people in F1 see in Bianchi. He's got to a level where he'd do a decent job and has definitely improved from his GP2 days but he's been around forever without really winning anything to put his name up in lights, and he's got experience most of the rest of the FR3.5 grid would kill for - full GP2 seasons, F1 test experience, friday outings for FI, etc - is it any wonder he's growing into a decent all-round package when he's competing against someone like Da Costa, even Frijns (and generally losing out to both) who have a fraction of the raceday experience level he does. On paper he should be anihilating them, if he's not then it suggests the latter two are simply better, more talented prospects.

Da Costa is exceptional, Frijns has the chance to make it. Behind them I kinda see Bianchi/Bird/Razia/Valsecchi etc as 'nearly but not quite', been around to long without really catching the eye.

Nobody seems to mention Calado either. Better prospect than Bird, surely.

[chunterer]

Razia and Valsecchi, really?

Neither of those guys are anything particularly remarkable, lower formula journeymen, who would be taking up seats away from decent drivers if promoted, nothing more. I would compare them possibly to the likes of Gugelmin, Henton, Gachot, Larrauri, Baldi, Surer, Manfred W, Alliot. All guys who looked like they were the real deal below F1 but weren't at all mega imo.

Bianchi is a seriously, seriously quick and gutsy driver and I really want to see what he can do in an F1 campaign up against some others who have recently come in like Di Resta, Hulk, Perez and Madlonado etc.

Frijns could be the next Verstappen if you know what I mean - not the latter day version, but maybe like the meteoric young guy who tested the Arrows in 1993?

I don't want to see Frijns racing until he's had plenty of mileage in the Sauber.

[barnettracing]

Didn't Bianchi bin the Force India on his first ever out lap with the team? That didn't particularly ingratiate himself with the team. He's fast, as I've said before, but he didn't really deliver in GP2 (not that Perez did either, to be fair). His F3 Euroseries campaign suggested he was the next French F1 champion. However, since then he hasn't looked quite as 'shiny'. 2012 has been good for him, but I don't know if he's F1 material in the same way that Frijns and da Costa are.

On a side note, I'm disappointed that Frijns 'only' got reserve at Sauber. I rate him much more than Gutierrez. Though, I suppose RF is still very young. What is he going to be doing next year though? Surely he needs to be racing as well as 'testing' in F1? But, he's already won FR3.5 and the only thing left is GP2 (but a campaign in that risks being a flop). Complicated.

[bella]

Originally Posted by m355y

Nobody seems to mention Calado either. Better prospect than Bird, surely.

i agree in principle - he hasn't raced in a series i haven't been able to have a hard, serious look at. but his first gp2 races were pretty impressive!

i think it helps to watch one of bianchi's races with timing screens as well as tv footage. he manages the races and tyres incredibly well. writing him off based on the odd rookie error is a bit harsh. i see the way he manages the races being one of the big selling points to f1 teams - some guys aren't capable of driving at anything other than 100%, whereas jules is a lot more controlled about it. which makes his blonde moments all that more bewildering. nobody is completely perfect, and if it's just a couple of misjudgements that cloud a drivers ability rather than being generally overaggressive or having no idea about the technical side of things then i would give him a punt too. he's incredibly consistent, unlike many other new drivers who have got the nod from teams in recent years.

i'm a bit disappointed frijns didn't get the drive too, but he is hideously unprepared. his attitude is a bit marmite - you either love him or hate him, sometimes both at the same time. he's completely honest as well, and whilst that might not reflect reality it does at least reflect his view on it. i think maybe throwing him into the deep end might ruin him rather than being the making of him, but that's just a guess. next to bird and bianchi it's almost that he's too naive.

[W.A Trichlorostyrene]

Autosport(hard paper) said that Peter Sauber was very tempted in giving a race seat to Robin Frijns for 2013, but in the end Telmex forced him to pick Esteban Gutierrez.

Autosport then drew an interesting comparison with 2001, when main backer Red Bull wanted Sauber to put Enrique Bernoldi in the second seat alongside Nick Heidfeld, but instead Peter decided to make an enormous gamble on an obscure Formula Renault 2.0 driver named Kimi Raïkkonen. This time however, the sponsors' pick won.

Although it is understandable, I'm rather disappointed by this choice to be honest. I was really looking forward seeing Frijns in F1. Plus, unless Hulkenberg moves up to a better team in 2014, there is a clear risk that Frijns still might not get the nod in 12 months.

Despite his 2 full GP2 campaigns, I'm not sure that Gutierrez is more ready than Frijns for the big pond right now... But that's another topic I guess