ALMS Round 1: Sebring 12h, March 15 2008

[Dani Filth]

Originally Posted by gsmith2424

Dont be surprised if the driver line ups change in both Porsches as the LMS has dropped the pro/am rule in LMP2.

Merksteijn owns the car i believe . so it's unlikely he's gonna be dropped

[henk4]

Originally Posted by canam

Who was the GD in the Essex car? As far as I remembered you always had one former LM winner and a modern touring car winner.

I doubt if Mr VM will give up his seat so I don't see much change there.

Essex drove with Nielsen and Elsgaard at Paul Ricard.

[dj4monie]

Originally Posted by gsmith2424

Dont be surprised if the driver line ups change in both Porsches as the LMS has dropped the pro/am rule in LMP2.

Oh really? Are you sure? If so, Henri is not only gonna be complaining about the diesels but those Porsches! Again, LMP1's have straight line speed, but over the twisty bits which is not a Pesa strength to start with, they put up a bit of a fight not seen by LMP2's currently.

Okay Monza the LMP1's will be fast, but as seen at Sebring, they have problems and I expect LMP2s to capitalize, because even with full ACO regs as everybody likes to tout, they still have a mileage and tire wear advantage...

[canam]

Originally Posted by henk4

Essex drove with Nielsen and Elsgaard at Paul Ricard.

neither of those look too 'gentlemenly' to me!!

[SebringMG]

Originally Posted by dj4monie

Okay Monza the LMP1's will be fast, but as seen at Sebring, they have problems and I expect LMP2s to capitalize, because even with full ACO regs as everybody likes to tout, they still have a mileage and tire wear advantage...

Not so much in the LMS as the P2 cars run with smaller fuel tanks than in the ALMS so should be similar stints (though less time to re-fuel) !!

[brielga]

Originally Posted by Spyderman

What's the quarrel between the two of them?

Lammers was managing the Dutch A1 GP team when, just before the 2006 Dutch race with 1000s of people attending Verstappen allegedly asked for his pay or he wouldn't race. Verstappen claims that Lammers was behind in paying his salary, Jan in turn blamed it on the A1 GP organization... in the end Bleekemolen jumped last minute on the car and did a great race to 4th but everyone was left with a bitter taste, most fans calling Verstappen a scrooge, some others pointing the finger at Jan for not honoring his financial commitments... truth might be somewhere in the middle but the Dutch press has stimulated the conflict a bit as well....

[chernaudi]

Originally Posted by cmk

I follow the LMS as closely as anyone I have ever seen on this board. If you want to dredge this down to the level of personal insult, at least make it based on a fine thread of truth. Both the LMS and Le Mans are renowned for having weak entries every year, to a similar level that the ALMS does. Neither the LMS or the LM 24 have had more factory involvement (equal at best) than the ALMS has had since 1999. Certainly they do not today. Last year the ALMS prototype battle was hammer-and-tongs every race, the LMS was a case of falling asleep while the Pugs walked away.

Furthermore, with the exception of the works Zytek LMP2 at PLM last year, which put in a creditable performance, European visitors got absolutely shredded by the ALMS cars at Sebring, PLM, Laguna and this year's 12 hours. Look where Barazi-Epsilon, LMS pacesetter, was...back of the prototype pack. Look at the pace of the VM Porsche in testing this year - now imagine what Penske would do after years of experience with the same car, and then remind yourself that the Acuras and Dyson Spyders were all running at the same pace. See what we're getting at here? If you need further confirmation, go ask LMS petrol pacesetter in '08 testing, Creation Autosportif's Ian Bickerton, what he thinks about the level of competition on both continents...



His attempt to diss me right above you says otherwise.

All I can say is that both Series have their strengths and weaknesses. But both can trace their issues to the same basic problems.

In the ALMS, you have the big factories(Audi, Porsche, Acura/Honda, GM Aston Martin, Mazda, Ferrari, et al.), more than NASCAR, the recently deceased Champ Car series, and Indy Car racing, and even Grand Am(which has plenty of factory supported entries) combined. And the quality of the field in most of the classes(save GT1 and often times LMP1) is excellent.

However, slim car counts, lack of cars in GT1, and too many cars staffed by gentleman drivers in LMP1 are big problems.

In LMS, you have plenty of LMP1 and LMP2 entries, and LMP2 is more in keeping with the ACO's beliefs for that class. However, their GT1 class also has slim pickins'(though not as bad as the ALMS), and there is lack of competition for LMP1/overall wins until Audi threw their hat into the ring. The main reason for that is that there are no factory teams hardly in LMP1, or any other class in the LMS for that matter.

But the source for that fact(lack of factory interest) is due to two things: marketing, and that both series are going up against the two 800lb gorillas of the motorsports world. ALMS is up against NASCAR, and LMS is up against F1.

And for marketing, NASCAR has enough clout in that department to convince car makers to spend $100 million a year to race cars that barely look like their road car, let alone utilize technology that road cars use. F1 does the same in Europe, but is 1-3 times more expensive than NASCAR.

Hopefully, Scott Atherton can capitalize on his skills(he's Penske trained and proven) to take advantge of the fact that NASCAR's rating are falling and that many NASCAR events aren't the sell outs that they were, and that Open Wheel, inspite of the CART Champ Car/IRL merger, is still a mess to boost the ALMS into the best of the rest behind NASCAR in the rating race(IMSA is already there, according to Audi of all people).

However, I don't know what can be done about the LMS in that area, as F1 is just too big in Europe, and the LMS needs more headliner/factory teams in all clases.

[Spyderman]

Originally Posted by brielga

Lammers was managing the Dutch A1 GP team when, just before the 2006 Dutch race with 1000s of people attending Verstappen allegedly asked for his pay or he wouldn't race. Verstappen claims that Lammers was behind in paying his salary, Jan in turn blamed it on the A1 GP organization... in the end Bleekemolen jumped last minute on the car and did a great race to 4th but everyone was left with a bitter taste, most fans calling Verstappen a scrooge, some others pointing the finger at Jan for not honoring his financial commitments... truth might be somewhere in the middle but the Dutch press has stimulated the conflict a bit as well....

Thanks for the explanation brielga.
Sounds like a right mess!

[eddsc]

However, I don't know what can be done about the LMS in that area, as F1 is just too big in Europe, and the LMS needs more headliner/factory teams in all clases.

That suggests that a great grid of almost 50 cars in previous years has been 'unpromotable', which I don't believe to be the case. We'll have to wait and see whether promises to promote this year's events are carried out with sufficient determination, or not.

[HORNDAWG]

Originally Posted by henk4

probably because somebody had the temerity to question both the quality and the quantity of the ALMS starting grid???

No, I would think it was because of the inanity of someone's questioning!

L.P.

[jhansen]

Well it was a great race, but it seems we've long since stopped talking about it. We can revisit this thread if someone has a compelling reason to do so (ie some major event from the race that we have not yet discussed). Closed.

[TWRv12]

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