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Old 19 Dec 2006, 20:32 (Ref:1795082)   #1
I love 04s
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I love 04s has a lot of promise if they can keep it on the circuit!
Which LMP2 car?

Really interesting to see Dyson dumping Lola after one year.....there must be some conflicts somewhere for that to happen.

Anyway, I cannot help but notice that LMP2 is really going to be interesting to watch unfold next season - but my question is which car would you choose to run..........let the voting do the talking.....!!!
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Old 19 Dec 2006, 20:35 (Ref:1795086)   #2
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Originally Posted by I love 04s
Really interesting to see Dyson dumping Lola after one year.....there must be some conflicts somewhere for that to happen.
Or they just wanted a Porsche! Anyway that is for: http://tentenths.com/forum/showthread.php?t=91978
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Originally Posted by I love 04s
Anyway, I cannot help but notice that LMP2 is really going to be interesting to watch unfold next season - but my question is which car would you choose to run..........let the voting do the talking.....!!!
The Porsche!

It is the complete package for next year. It has over a year of development. It is a Porsche.
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Old 19 Dec 2006, 20:35 (Ref:1795087)   #3
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I love 04s has a lot of promise if they can keep it on the circuit!
Which LMP2 car?

Really interesting to see Dyson dumping Lola after one year.....there must be some conflicts somewhere for that to happen.

Anyway, I cannot help but notice that LMP2 is really going to be interesting to watch unfold next season - but my question is which engine chassis combo would you choose to run..........

My preference surprisingly......Zytek 07s LMP2 with 3.4l Zytek V8.......
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Old 19 Dec 2006, 20:36 (Ref:1795088)   #4
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If I have money and connections, I would do what Dyson did and buy the Porsche.

If I am a struggling privateer then the Lola B05/40 would be my choice. It seems to run quicker with the AER motor than the Judd as well.
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Old 19 Dec 2006, 20:50 (Ref:1795105)   #5
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Radical SR9 /Accura would be a good bet, I reckon! Assuming I could get the engine of course. You don't get any marks for choosing the Porsche; way too obvious!
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Old 19 Dec 2006, 21:04 (Ref:1795117)   #6
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I'd go with the Zytek personally. Definitely a good value and probably just as quick as the RS Spyder given like drivers and tires. Not to mention, it is a fully integrated car. It's not piece meal.
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Old 19 Dec 2006, 21:05 (Ref:1795119)   #7
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I doubt that Acura would lease you the engine....at least in 2007 anyway....

Radical is designed for the Judd and the AER engines....There might be issues with mounting any other engines in it (fit, cooling, chassis geometry, etc.)

Personally, I'd like to see someone install a Subaru WRC engine into a LMP2 chassis...I'll bet it would kick some butts and take some names....

But given the scenarios available and reality as we know it at this time:

the best bargain would be to buy the Rollcentre Radicals off of Martin Short and do a Judd lease, since that is what was in the car to start with...you wouldn't have to make whatever chassis, cowling or other minor changes that may be required to it to fit the AER engine...

They were quick in Europe....
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Old 19 Dec 2006, 21:09 (Ref:1795122)   #8
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SALEEN S7R should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridSALEEN S7R should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridSALEEN S7R should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
Personally I would go for a Lola EX264 or the Lola B06/10. The Radical is a good car but at the moment I cant help but feel it is under developed. As for the Porsche, well we wont really know how good it is until it goes up against some top LMP2 oppostition. At the moment all they have had to compete against really is the Intersport Lola.
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Old 19 Dec 2006, 22:11 (Ref:1795207)   #9
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I think the yellow Porsches will be winning most P2 races, with a mix of Acura powered race cars and white and blew Porsches following.
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Old 20 Dec 2006, 15:25 (Ref:1795905)   #10
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dj choc ice should be qualifying in the top 10 on the griddj choc ice should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
if i had the connections and the money i would probably go for the porsche RS, its a good all round package, very fast, reliable and efficient.

if i was a privateer team i would perhaps go for a courage LC75 with the zytek 3.4 V8, if the LC70 is anything to go by the LC75 will be hugely quick piece of kit, more than capable of going toe to toe with the porsche's
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Old 20 Dec 2006, 15:39 (Ref:1795916)   #11
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I'd take the Porsche. Last years version was clearly the fastest LMP2 car, and this years should see it going faster, even with the restrictor reduction. This is a car that will see continuous development, that you can upgrade your car with on an ongoing (expensive) basis. Porsche has an established track record of supporting their customers, that is unsurpassed.

My second choice might just be the Zytek, as it would be a tantalizing proposition, and should have great potential. I can't quite imagine them providing customer support and development at the same level of Porsche though. It sure would be interesting to see a capable Zytek LMP2 go against the Spyder though.

It will also be interesting to see how the Fernandez Acura goes, as I'll suggest that will be the fastest Lola LMP2 on the planet this year.
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Old 20 Dec 2006, 15:58 (Ref:1795938)   #12
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Tim Northcutt should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridTim Northcutt should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridTim Northcutt should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridTim Northcutt should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
Big Budget: Porsche RS Spyder...bet they aren't cheap...

Middle Range: Zytek LMP2

Want a Deal: Buy the Rollcentre Radical...

I'll stand by that one that I stated earlier...Judd lease preferred due to the chassis being bought already can accommodate it....Should be competitive.

Not sure if I'd do the Courage LC75 above any of those three choices
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Old 20 Dec 2006, 16:11 (Ref:1795953)   #13
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What would be the price of the Zytek?
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Old 20 Dec 2006, 16:51 (Ref:1795998)   #14
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For me I think 2 cars could be faster than anything else out there and the reasons are quite similar :

the Zytek LMP2 - full integration
the LC75 LMP2 - designed around what worked best in the C65 (AER)
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Old 20 Dec 2006, 19:42 (Ref:1796158)   #15
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Hammerdown should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
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Originally Posted by Tim Northcutt
Radical is designed for the Judd and the AER engines....There might be issues with mounting any other engines in it (fit, cooling, chassis geometry, etc.)

Personally, I'd like to see someone install a Subaru WRC engine into a LMP2 chassis...I'll bet it would kick some butts and take some names....
Well if the Lola can be made to work with it, I doubt the Radical would be a problem. Besides, we are in fantasy land here, aren't we!

Subaru engine sounds good (both literally and metaphorically!). How much power do WRC engines chuck out these days? I'm a bit out-of-touch with the rally scene.

The Zytek could well be a good bet. I'd love to see them mixing it with the Porsches and Accuras.
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Old 20 Dec 2006, 20:03 (Ref:1796171)   #16
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I've been told that modifying a stock Subaru WRC Turbo with just a few SEMA upgrades would take it to more than 450 hp.

The racing WRC engines already run with certain restrictors on them.

A specific race build of a Subaru WRC engine tailored to sportscar racing would easily be on par with other engines in the LMP2 class
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Old 20 Dec 2006, 20:43 (Ref:1796192)   #17
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Originally Posted by Tim Northcutt
I've been told that modifying a stock Subaru WRC Turbo with just a few SEMA upgrades would take it to more than 450 hp.

The racing WRC engines already run with certain restrictors on them.

A specific race build of a Subaru WRC engine tailored to sportscar racing would easily be on par with other engines in the LMP2 class
WRC cars can reach in excess of 550 hp in the European Rallycross Championship. I don't think there's a Subaru this year, but since LMP2 cars have about 500 hp with a restrictor, some tweaking could probably do it, in theory.

However, I don't remember a modern 2.0-litre Turbo using this kind of power in endurance racing (last time I remember was the old ETCC Sierra RS500s). WRC engines work for several hours at a time, but are less powerful with restrictor, while unrestricted rallycross engines are only on for about 20 minutes each time (even with all the qualifying runs). You might need to engineer an LMP2 Subaru (or Ford, or Peugeot, or Citroen, or Mitsubishi) from scratch.
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Old 20 Dec 2006, 21:06 (Ref:1796203)   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tim Northcutt
I've been told that modifying a stock Subaru WRC Turbo with just a few SEMA upgrades would take it to more than 450 hp.

The racing WRC engines already run with certain restrictors on them.

A specific race build of a Subaru WRC engine tailored to sportscar racing would easily be on par with other engines in the LMP2 class
I'm guessing it would be an expensive option. Unless you can buy one independantly from Suburu and tweak it yourself.

The privateer available options are pretty plentiful at this time. Lots of good options already. And most are developed and ready to go.

Edit: Could the WRC engine be a stressed member of the chassis?
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Old 20 Dec 2006, 21:08 (Ref:1796206)   #19
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Originally Posted by EuropaBambaataa
WRC cars can reach in excess of 550 hp in the European Rallycross Championship. I don't think there's a Subaru this year, but since LMP2 cars have about 500 hp with a restrictor, some tweaking could probably do it, in theory.

However, I don't remember a modern 2.0-litre Turbo using this kind of power in endurance racing (last time I remember was the old ETCC Sierra RS500s). WRC engines work for several hours at a time, but are less powerful with restrictor, while unrestricted rallycross engines are only on for about 20 minutes each time (even with all the qualifying runs). You might need to engineer an LMP2 Subaru (or Ford, or Peugeot, or Citroen, or Mitsubishi) from scratch.
ROC used a Lehmann tuned VW 2L engine in their Reynard (and won LMP675 class at LM in '02). If I remember well this engine was developed for rally cars. (I admit, you cannot compare this engine with the high cost WRC engines)
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Old 20 Dec 2006, 21:53 (Ref:1796229)   #20
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Which LMP2 Car

Chewymonster: white and blew Porsche??? I did not think a Porsche ever blew!!! Now blue maybe. Sorry about that, but I couldn't resist.
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Old 20 Dec 2006, 22:11 (Ref:1796239)   #21
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From the discussion I had with a Japanese Subaru engine tuner, 500 hp with the new restrictor would be possible. The installation might need a specific angle for the engine to have with the current known gearboxes and the shape of the diffuser.
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Old 21 Dec 2006, 00:23 (Ref:1796311)   #22
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Originally Posted by jhansen
What would be the price of the Zytek?
Do you want me to enquire........I can tell you if you want.....

It would be around half a Porsche. Therefore - 2 Zyteks vs one Porsche....I know what I would prefer if I was on that budget!

PS. Who reckons two new Zytek 07s LMP1s (or 06s) would have been a better choice for Dyson next year? Interesting that with enough money to buy two new LMP2 Spyders they didnt go for some revenge against Audi......cant help but feel they may struggle in LMP2 next year. LMP1 would have been a better bet imho.....

Last edited by I love 04s; 21 Dec 2006 at 00:30.
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Old 21 Dec 2006, 01:24 (Ref:1796344)   #23
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I agree, P2 with the Porsche Spyder RS won't guarantee a class win for sure. First of all, the factory (Yellow) Porsches will be the toughest challange for Dyson. Second, the three Acura powered P2s should provide nice competition. In P1 Dyson was just about guaranteed 3rd place in class, But in P2 not so much. But I guess they wanted a quicker car as the Porsche RS Spyder beat them last year on several occasions.
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Old 21 Dec 2006, 02:29 (Ref:1796383)   #24
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Anybody think that LMP2 could be the new battleground without any ACO restrictions on competitors, privateer vs manufacturers? Gotta believe Porsche is out for the overall win with the LMP2, (not sure ACO will EVER allow that but the ALMS/IMSA?) And Acura I'm sure wants no part of following behind them even though their goal is moving up, plus will they have both the LMP2(privateer) and LMP1(factory) cars running? Plus with Zytek, fairly proven and fast in LMP1 and then the best looking of them all, the Radical (who I'm sure wouldn't leave LMP2 when/if they go LMP1 too). Plus then all the other Lola, Courage, Pillbeam(or are they LMP1s?, sorry don't see any in ALMS) and other that are out there already running. LMP2 is looking like the biggest class now after almost looking the Intersport-only class a few seasons ago. I personally love it and hope to see them become more stable and durable with the added makes/competition and can challenge on the smaller US tracks. Still I gotta go with the Radical. Maybe somebody can convince VDS racing to go with the Acura engine in a few years. A Radical/Mazda rotary would be great but probable never happen.
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Old 21 Dec 2006, 15:39 (Ref:1796911)   #25
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Originally Posted by jhansen
I'm guessing it would be an expensive option. Unless you can buy one independantly from Suburu and tweak it yourself.

The privateer available options are pretty plentiful at this time. Lots of good options already. And most are developed and ready to go.

Edit: Could the WRC engine be a stressed member of the chassis?

I know of at least one constructor who at one time was strongly considering it, but he was trying to do it via a factory engine perspective....but talks stopped right after Acura announced their program last April...that is all I am at liberty to say about this subject...

However, the info about the relatively inexpensive SEMA options to really increase hp in that engine was from an engine builder

Advantages include the low center of gravity due to the boxer design, the excellent torque and power throughout the rpm range and the relative light weight of the engine package as a whole...

I would agree that there are options available, but apparently, competitors seem to feel that the Judd and the AER options are the only two that are the most viable at this time....

Unless someone in LMS ran a Zytek 3.4L package last year that I wasn't aware of...

Options like Nicholson-McLaren, Menard Competition Technologies, Nissan V-6 power and JPX have either gone by the wayside or have not been tried yet (in the case of Menard).

The options exist, but teams are voting with their wallets based on costs and results...and the choices seem to be two or three at this time at the most.
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