Round 10: Honda Indy Toronto. Exhibition Place, Toronto. June 12-14, 2015

[Salamus]

This race has com alive in the past 15 laps. Amazing stuff

[bjohnsonsmith]

Congrats to Newgarden on his 2nd win of the season and congrats to CFH on a 1 - 2 , especially after the last couple of races.

[canamman]

Originally Posted by bjohnsonsmith

Congrats to Newgarden on his 2nd win of the season and congrats to CFH on a 1 - 2 , especially after the last couple of races.

Ditto - good stuff.

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by canamman

Ditto - good stuff.

An absolutely cracking race and what a great way to end a superb weekend of motorsport.

[Nikki Katz]

That was a really good race. I'm still struggling to understand how Castroneves suddenly ended up 3rd after being at the back on a not vastly different strategy?

It was a bit weird how the commentators kept saying how nobody knew who had what push to pass left, particularly when the graphic showing it was whizzing across the screen at the time.

I hope they let Honda improve the aero package soon. It may be too late for this season but they really have to give them a better chance for next year.

[bjohnsonsmith]

Result:

1 Josef Newgarden, CFH Racing, Dallara/Chevrolet. 1h38m59.9460s
2 Luca Filippi, CFH Racing, Dallara/Chevrolet. 1.4485s
3 Helio Castroneves, Team Penske, Dallara/Chevrolet, 3.9027s
4 Will Power, Team Penske, Dallara/Chevrolet. 4.7766s
5 Sebastien Bourdais, KVSH Racing, Dallara/Chevrolet. 6.7215s
6 Tony Kanaan, Chip Ganassi Racing, Dallara/Chevrolet. 7.8160s
7 Juan Pablo Montoya, Team Penske, Dallara/Chevrolet. 8.7242s
8 Scott Dixon, Chip Ganassi Racing, Dallara/Chevrolet. 9.5397s
9 Graham Rahal, Rahal Letterman Lanigan, Dallara/Honda. 11.8704s
10 Takuma Sato, AJ Foyt Enterprises, Dallara/Honda. 18.9723s
11 Simon Pagenaud, Team Penske, Dallara/Chevrolet. 20.6315s
12 Conor Daly, Schmidt Peterson Motorsports, Dallara/Honda. 21.9187s
13 Marco Andretti, Andretti Autosport, Dallara/Honda. 33.2063s
14 Jack Hawksworth, AJ Foyt Enterprises, Dallara/Honda. 44.5250s
15 Gabby Chaves, Bryan Herta Autosport, Dallara/Honda. 46.0971s
16 Sebastian Saavedra, Chip Ganassi Racing, Dallara/Chevrolet. 46.6248s
17 Tristan Vautier, Dale Coyne Racing, Dallara/Honda. 47.0229s
18 Rodolfo Gonzalez, Dale Coyne Racing, Dallara/Honda. 51.3658s
19 Ryan Hunter-Reay, Andretti Autosport, Dallara/Honda. 1 Lap
20 Charlie Kimball, Chip Ganassi Racing, Dallara/Chevrolet. 1 Lap
21 James Jakes, Schmidt Peterson Motorsports, Dallara/Honda. 1 Lap
22 Carlos Munoz, Andretti Autosport, Dallara/Honda. Mechanical
23 Stefano Coletti, KV Racing Technology, Dallara/Chevrolet. Contact

Not a great result for the Honda teams, with only Rahal and Sato finishing in the top 10.

[Salamus]

Again, really disappointed with Pagenaud. It all fell apart for him in the second half of the race. Disappointed with Coletti too. And bummed for Munoz, he had a top 5 car.

[10TENTHS]

Originally Posted by Nikki Katz

That was a really good race. I'm still struggling to understand how Castroneves suddenly ended up 3rd after being at the back on a not vastly different strategy?

The second caution (for Coletti's crash) brought him back into sequence. He pitted from ~6th, by the way.

Originally Posted by Nikki Katz

It was a bit weird how the commentators kept saying how nobody knew who had what push to pass left, particularly when the graphic showing it was whizzing across the screen at the time.

The exact amount of P2P was supposed to be hidden, but I hear the international feed still had it for some reason.

Originally Posted by Nikki Katz

I hope they let Honda improve the aero package soon. It may be too late for this season but they really have to give them a better chance for next year.

You want balance of performance? Chevy\Pratt & Miller did a better job and on top of that they attracted Ganassi over (at the end of 2013), which combined with Andretti Autosport's struggles have made the gap look bigger than it is. The gap is typically a few tenths in qualifying, the problem is Indycar is so competitive that a few tenths knocks you down several positions.

As I stated in the main thread, all parties agreed to freeze the designs in the off-season. You could blame the teams for whining about buying upgraded parts, but I really don't see how you build a better car without spending a bit more.

[fieldodreams79]

Good stuff for Newgarden. Pretty good race. I enjoyed the drying track and the different strategies and compared to some of the s*** shows they've had on the streets of Montreal in recent years, I thoroughly enjoyed this race.

[Burp]

Very good race. A lot less yellow than I expected when they started switching to slicks.

[NaBUru38]

Originally Posted by 10TENTHS

of P2P was supposed to be hidden, but I hear the international feed still had it for some reason.

WIth some 15 laps to go, we got a graphic showing that Newgarden had no pushes left, whereas the other drivers in the front pack did (but no numbers).

[Salamus]

Originally Posted by NaBUru38

WIth some 15 laps to go, we got a graphic showing that Newgarden had no pushes left, whereas the other drivers in the front pack did (but no numbers).

I thought that was very dumb. There was no point in hiding the number of P2P if they were going to tell us when someone runs out.

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by 10TENTHS

You want balance of performance? Chevy\Pratt & Miller did a better job and on top of that they attracted Ganassi over (at the end of 2013), which combined with Andretti Autosport's struggles have made the gap look bigger than it is. The gap is typically a few tenths in qualifying, the problem is Indycar is so competitive that a few tenths knocks you down several positions.

When Ganassi switched to Chevy for 2014, Andretti Autosport switched to Honda and RH-R won the 500 that year but the highest placed Honda driver that year, was Pagenaud who came 5th in the driver's championship.

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by 10TENTHS

The exact amount of P2P was supposed to be hidden, but I hear the international feed still had it for some reason

IIRC, it came up towards during the last few laps of the race.

[rwintle]

Originally Posted by bjohnsonsmith

If you have any photos, please post them.

This should sate almost anybody's need for photos: the Honda Indy Toronto photo team strikes again:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/hondaindy

And a few selects from me. There will be more coming.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/ricard...57654461034762



Great to meet Mr. BudLightJaguar in person after some conversations by TenTenths PM and email.

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by rwintle

This should sate almost anybody's need for photos: the Honda Indy Toronto photo team strikes again:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/hondaindy

And a few selects from me. There will be more coming.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/ricard...57654461034762



Great to meet Mr. BudLightJaguar in person after some conversations by TenTenths PM and email.

[joeb]

Originally Posted by Burp

Very good race. A lot less yellow than I expected when they started switching to slicks.

Me too, and it was fun to see the cars sliding around between the walls.

[BudLightJaguar]

Originally Posted by rwintle

Great to meet Mr. BudLightJaguar in person after some conversations by TenTenths PM and email.

It's always nice to see that there actually is a real person behind the username.

There may have been moments especially on Friday when I was just wishing the rain to stop. However, my first IndyCar experience was great and definitely it won't be the last one.

[David A Scott]

The number of grandstands at the Honda Indy continued to shrink this year and are now at embarrassing levels. A race that once packed 75,000 fans into Exhibition Place now likely has somewhere around one-tenth that number in grandstand seats. The biggest reduction this year happened behind pitlane on the start-finish straight where about half of the seats were removed due to ongoing construction. While there exists room elsewhere at the venue, the seats were not relocated or replaced. In the end, it didn't matter as Sunday's rain meant few of the seats were used. A charitable guess would put the race day crowd at about 10,000.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/globe...ticle24955947/

[rwintle]

Originally Posted by David A Scott

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/globe...ticle24955947/

That's the Globe and Mail pi$$ing on an event that is now sponsored by their main rival, the Toronto Star.

Also, the reason the main grandstand is shrunken is because there is now a whacking great hotel where pit out was. Pit out was completely reconfigured, necessitating moving the grandstand west. This in turn left little room for pit lane hospitality suites, some of which were moved across to the north side of the track. Net result - smaller main grandstand as there just wasn't room. I'll bet they didn't bother to go through all that detail in the article though.

Sure, it's true attendance is not 75k like it was in the salad days of ChampCar or CART or whatever. That's not Toronto, that's motorsport (with the exception of a few banner events like Le Mans). Also, it was June (when kids are still in school and nobody's on vacation at the race) and raining. What are they expecting?

/rant

[icemachine]

There is a large group of Torontonians, some close to Mayor Tory, that would like to see the race ended after the current deal expires (2017?). Add in the thousands of new residents in Liberty Village just north of the Exhibition station and there will be quite a bit of pressure to move this race.

[rwintle]

I did like this quote from Monsieur Bourdais, elsewhere in the article:

"“The concrete here is not very textured. If the sun is at the right angle, it shines. Shows you how slick it is. When you throw some water on it, it's definitely quite exciting.”



It was quite interesting to watch, early in the race, how some drivers were taking a very wide line around the concrete patches (Rahal for example), whereas others were just driving right across it (Kanaan).

Originally Posted by rwintle

That's the Globe and Mail pi$$ing on an event that is now sponsored by their main rival, the Toronto Star.

Also, the reason the main grandstand is shrunken is because there is now a whacking great hotel where pit out was. Pit out was completely reconfigured, necessitating moving the grandstand west. This in turn left little room for pit lane hospitality suites, some of which were moved across to the north side of the track. Net result - smaller main grandstand as there just wasn't room. I'll bet they didn't bother to go through all that detail in the article though.

Sure, it's true attendance is not 75k like it was in the salad days of ChampCar or CART or whatever. That's not Toronto, that's motorsport (with the exception of a few banner events like Le Mans). Also, it was June (when kids are still in school and nobody's on vacation at the race) and raining. What are they expecting?

/rant

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by icemachine

There is a large group of Torontonians, some close to Mayor Tory, that would like to see the race ended after the current deal expires (2017?). Add in the thousands of new residents in Liberty Village just north of the Exhibition station and there will be quite a bit of pressure to move this race.

That would be a real shame if the race ended. Apart from 2008, it's been a perennial and one race on the calendar I always look forward to.

[David A Scott]

Originally Posted by rwintle

That's the Globe and Mail pi$$ing on an event that is now sponsored by their main rival, the Toronto Star.

Also, the reason the main grandstand is shrunken is because there is now a whacking great hotel where pit out was. Pit out was completely reconfigured, necessitating moving the grandstand west. This in turn left little room for pit lane hospitality suites, some of which were moved across to the north side of the track. Net result - smaller main grandstand as there just wasn't room. I'll bet they didn't bother to go through all that detail in the article though.

Sure, it's true attendance is not 75k like it was in the salad days of ChampCar or CART or whatever. That's not Toronto, that's motorsport (with the exception of a few banner events like Le Mans). Also, it was June (when kids are still in school and nobody's on vacation at the race) and raining. What are they expecting?

/rant

Whistling past the graveyard. They started removing grandstands long before that hotel started being built. As for the article written by a competitor of a race sponsor. Talk about spin. You MIGHT have a point if it was written by the Sun. Truth be told is that there was NO buzz leading up to this event. NONE. Other than the traffic reports informing us of the road closures on Strachan being "due to the Indy" there was nothing on the news until Friday.

A lot of casual fans who used to flock to the race when CART ran it don't go anymore. After the first year or two of the Dallara Honda series turned them off in droves. Also not having PT in the field hurts. No offense to the Mayor of Hinchtown (I like him) he isn't PT. PT is a racer who beat the likes of Mansell, Fittipaldi, Unser and Zanardi. Hinch occasionally beat a bunch of no names, at best mid-fielders during the CART era.

IndyCar is dying. Tony George won the war. At what cost though? A phyrric victory. Every reason he claimed in starting the war turned out to be lies. He may have the body but there is no soul. Emotion, along with the crowds and sponsors, are gone and never coming back.

I apologize for this rant but I will never forgive Tony George did to the best open wheel racing on the planet just to satisfy his own ego and to hell with the fans.

[rwintle]

Originally Posted by David A Scott

Whistling past the graveyard. They started removing grandstands long before that hotel started being built. As for the article written by a competitor of a race sponsor. Talk about spin. You MIGHT have a point if it was written by the Sun. Truth be told is that there was NO buzz leading up to this event. NONE. Other than the traffic reports informing us of the road closures on Strachan being "due to the Indy" there was nothing on the news until Friday.

A lot of casual fans who used to flock to the race when CART ran it don't go anymore. After the first year or two of the Dallara Honda series turned them off in droves. Also not having PT in the field hurts. No offense to the Mayor of Hinchtown (I like him) he isn't PT. PT is a racer who beat the likes of Mansell, Fittipaldi, Unser and Zanardi. Hinch occasionally beat a bunch of no names, at best mid-fielders during the CART era.

IndyCar is dying. Tony George won the war. At what cost though? A phyrric victory. Every reason he claimed in starting the war turned out to be lies. He may have the body but there is no soul. Emotion, along with the crowds and sponsors, are gone and never coming back.

I apologize for this rant but I will never forgive Tony George did to the best open wheel racing on the planet just to satisfy his own ego and to hell with the fans.

And here we go again. It's done, can't we all leave the "IndyCar war" where it Rests In Peace (Pieces?) and move on?

The Sun reporter I spoke to pointed out that the Sun would put the race on the front page, whereas the Star will bury it in the "Wheels" automotive section... which seems a valid statement. To their credit the Sun is still covering it well.

There was a winky smiley after my Globe and Mail comment in case you didn't notice it.

Agree re: buzz. I didn't see any billboards, print ads, etc. Did see ads on TV but only during previous IndyCar races. Not much if anything local though, but I may not have been looking in the right places.