anti brake system in f1 cars

[rahul]

hi ,

hey can anyone please tell me something about anti braking system used in f1 cars. all about it. send an email.

see u,

rahul

[Dave Brand]

If you mean anti-lock braking systems, there's nothing to tell - they are illegal in F1.

[Langers]

Anti-Braking = accelerator pedal attached to 850HP worth of V10

[Jukebox]

I copied and paste from FIA site....

Brakes

- All cars must have one braking system using two hydraulic circuits, one circuit operating the front brakes, and the other the rears, in order to cope in the event of a failure.

- Any power braking system or anti-lock system is banned.

- No more than one brake calibre, with a maximum of six pistons, can be used per wheel.

- No more than one brake disc per wheel can be used. These discs must have a maximum of thickness of 28mm and a maximum outer diameter of 278mm.

[wayjag]

Why not fit Anti lock braking to F1 cars to make it even easier for teams with the big budgets. The dam sport is getting so predictable now, with Traction control , Launch systems, Semi and auto Trans. If technology keeps sticking its ugly head into the sport Kimi, Davis and those guys in the red cars will be in the stands each sporting a 6 channel remote control, and after the race the winner With his control unit will go to the rostrum to pick up his spoils. They will have to wrap their control units in Plastic Bags though....

[Adam43]

Williams (and others) dabbled with ABS back in 1993 (when it was legal). Damon Hill tried it a few times in the race IIRC.

[RWC]

I wonder why they have a maximum disc width?
the way all the teams fret about having dangerous failures at heavy wear circuits and all...

[Adam43]

They do! They can only be 28mm thick.

[Adam43]

oops

Originally posted by Jukebox
- No more than one brake disc per wheel can be used. These discs must have a maximum of thickness of 28mm and a maximum outer diameter of 278mm.

I think they quite often run thinner disks at some races and in qualifying. Drivers often have to be careful on teh slowing down lap to cool them properly.

[avsfan733]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Jukebox


- Any power braking system or anti-lock system is banned.

so this would eliminate any possibility of automatically pulsing brakes without regard for the actual locking. Or would it? If the system didn't actually look for wheel lockup but just pulsed the system automatically would that still be antilock? It wouold be a reasonable thing to try if legal because the brakes should be on to the point of lock anyways

[Lee Janotta]

Good threshold braking has got to be better than pulsing all the time, which would also put quite a strain on the rest of the car.

[avsfan733]

nope major magazines have tested this point to exhaustion and have consistently shown that antilocks are faster and shorter but what truly defines an "anti-lock" the recognition of lock or the response?

[boyracer]

I would have to question the validity of such tests.
If the system is being "pulsed" then the brake system pressure is being "pulsed", correct?
Now lets say (for example only) that the pulse resembles a sine wave (of course not going into the negative side of its form) it's mean average of such a form is still naturally well below the peak value that it "pulses" to.
Even if the wave form is square, the average will be lower than the peak value.
The advantage with ABS comes with people who don't know how to drive properly (ie just jumping on the pedal in a big hurry) and in sensing the change in grip for different road surfaces. If you are on a consistent surface (such as a racetrack) and you have enough pedal "feel" to hold the tyres right at the limit of adhesion, I fail to see how ABS could be any better.
So come on people come and shoot me down, or back me up ?

[avsfan733]

because a computer can pulse the pressure hundreds of times a second....could u?

[boyracer]

You miss my point AVSFAN733, the computer could pulse the pedal as many times per second as it wants, the mean average of a pulse will still be less than a constant pressure right at the threshold of braking.

[avsfan733]

but if the wheel were to lock even for an instant it takes several feet to start rolling again and the computers are also pulseing the pedal but not fully releasing brake pressure. The computer functions just as your foot would just much quicker

[boyracer]

Agreed but I still believe the computer pulsing would result in a lower 'mean' pressure than a driver can 'feel' and thus be losing braking time. I continue with this argument as I know of at least one quick drive in W.A. who was using A.B.S. while attempting sprint circuits and the such, who is now going much quicker without the A.B.S.
You would know as well as I do that a lot of racing is about how the driver 'feels' the car. If they don't like the response the car is giving them, they can't be confident and thus fast with it. The human brain is a complex thing and I believe that it's modulation of the pressure of the drivers foot on the pedal would be more consistent than that of a computer, even if the computer is sensing yaw, roll and all the rest of it by one hundred different sensors.

[Thanatos]

I'd be intersted to know how this guys ABS was set up. I occasionally drive a Comodore S with Traction Control. It's more dangerous than not using because it's set to take a huge chunk of power of as soon as the wheel starts to slip. My point is in F1 when a driver plants foot and the wheel starts to spin the electronics take off just enough power to stop the spin and still allow maximum acceleration. The same would be said for ABS. If a F1 crew fitted it to a car it would react like nothing on the road today. And as for your comment about 'feeling' the breaking point the electronics they use would be way more sensitive.