Home  
Site Partners: SpotterGuides Veloce Books  
Related Sites: Baltic Touring Car Championship Your Link Here  

Go Back   TenTenths Motorsport Forum > Saloon & Sportscar Racing > Touring Car Racing

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 18 Oct 2016, 11:42 (Ref:3681080)   #51
Bramzel
Veteran
 
Bramzel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Netherlands
Apeldoorn, The Netherlands
Posts: 3,153
Bramzel should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridBramzel should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridBramzel should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ralle View Post
I don't know how you got that conclusion from that article, but WTCC won't go anywhere but TCN1 for the near future. The article mentions TCN2 as platform for ETCC, which would make sense in their 'touringcar-pyramid' (their words ).
Bramzel is offline  
Quote
Old 18 Oct 2016, 12:39 (Ref:3681089)   #52
Ralle
Rookie
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Posts: 19
Ralle should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
New WTCC

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bramzel View Post
I don't know how you got that conclusion from that article, but WTCC won't go anywhere but TCN1 for the near future. The article mentions TCN2 as platform for ETCC, which would make sense in their 'touringcar-pyramid' (their words ).
For 2017 there are 3 manufactures ( Honda, Lada, Volvo) in WTCC. The trend is that independent team are looking to TCN2/TCR. FIA must do something, for 2017 they talk about cost reductions.

http://www.motorsport.com/wtcc/news/wtcc-targets-major-cost-reduction-programme-for-2017-692191/

But the independent/privateers team are looking for a better way to race to a lower cost than FIA are talking about. The choice is TCN2/TCR as a second class in the WTCC.

Look whats happning in TCR Macau 2016 race a lot of new cars from CTCC (China Touring Car Championship). Totally 35 cars on the grid. Small modifications in the rules makes a new future.

http://www.touringcartimes.com/2016/10/06/35-car-macau-entry-list-of-ctcc-and-tcr-cars-released/
Ralle is offline  
Quote
Old 18 Oct 2016, 14:29 (Ref:3681119)   #53
thlbtcc
Veteran
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 1,269
thlbtcc should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by kurski View Post
Finland included in preliminary 2017 STCC calendar.
Nice!
thlbtcc is offline  
Quote
Old 18 Oct 2016, 15:39 (Ref:3681132)   #54
Mr Pink
Veteran
 
Mr Pink's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Sweden
Sweden
Posts: 798
Mr Pink should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Haven't seen this posted here, Lestrup rumored to field a Golf for a young driver in 2017.

http://www.touringcartimes.com/2016/...r-2017-season/
Mr Pink is offline  
Quote
Old 18 Oct 2016, 17:04 (Ref:3681147)   #55
FIRE
Race Official
Veteran
 
FIRE's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Netherlands
Posts: 18,739
FIRE is going for a new world record!FIRE is going for a new world record!FIRE is going for a new world record!FIRE is going for a new world record!FIRE is going for a new world record!FIRE is going for a new world record!FIRE is going for a new world record!
Quote:
Originally Posted by kurski View Post
Finland included in preliminary 2017 STCC calendar.
I assume LMS Racing will enter?
FIRE is offline  
Quote
Old 18 Oct 2016, 19:18 (Ref:3681181)   #56
kurski
Veteran
 
kurski's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Finland
Posts: 1,507
kurski should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridkurski should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by FIRE View Post
I assume LMS Racing will enter?
Yes.
kurski is offline  
__________________
“Fernando Alonso has revealed that he would like to contest the 24 Hours of Le Mans, the world’s oldest and most famous sports car race"
Quote
Old 19 Oct 2016, 05:19 (Ref:3681283)   #57
Racing Harz
Veteran
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Germany
Herzberg am Harz
Posts: 1,998
Racing Harz should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridRacing Harz should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by FIRE View Post
I assume LMS Racing will enter?
Antti Buri has said, they will onky enter, then it don´t clash with ADAC TCR.
Racing Harz is offline  
Quote
Old 19 Oct 2016, 05:59 (Ref:3681292)   #58
Lando
Rookie
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Posts: 41
Lando should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Pink View Post
Haven't seen this posted here, Lestrup rumored to field a Golf for a young driver in 2017.

http://www.touringcartimes.com/2016/...r-2017-season/
Albin Warnelow from Clio in a Golf. Lestrups team will run the car.
Lando is offline  
Quote
Old 19 Oct 2016, 11:56 (Ref:3681354)   #59
Mr Pink
Veteran
 
Mr Pink's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Sweden
Sweden
Posts: 798
Mr Pink should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lando View Post
Albin Warnelow from Clio in a Golf. Lestrups team will run the car.
Good to hear!
Mr Pink is offline  
Quote
Old 19 Oct 2016, 14:53 (Ref:3681391)   #60
FIRE
Race Official
Veteran
 
FIRE's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Netherlands
Posts: 18,739
FIRE is going for a new world record!FIRE is going for a new world record!FIRE is going for a new world record!FIRE is going for a new world record!FIRE is going for a new world record!FIRE is going for a new world record!FIRE is going for a new world record!
And Lestrup himself?
FIRE is offline  
Quote
Old 19 Oct 2016, 15:13 (Ref:3681394)   #61
Lando
Rookie
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Posts: 41
Lando should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by FIRE View Post
And Lestrup himself?
Not driving. He runs an Endurance team in Sweden that will also run the Golf for Warnelow in STCC next year.

Likely looking at:

3 SEAT from PWR
1 Golf from Warnelow driven by Warnelow and run by Lestrup Racing
2 Seat from Finnish LMS pending schedule conflicts with German TCR

Shaky rumors:
3 additional Seat from PWR
1 Opel from Nika Racing

Last edited by Lando; 19 Oct 2016 at 15:18.
Lando is offline  
Quote
Old 21 Oct 2016, 23:38 (Ref:3681827)   #62
Valker
Veteran
 
Valker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Finland
Tampere, Finland
Posts: 1,208
Valker should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
I wish all the best to STCC Finnish adventure but I'm a bit skeptic.

Most Finns are only aware of F1 and WRC... and some more limited audience also knows about national rallying and maybe even Rallycross... but in general, Finns are not interested in motor sports at all.

So, it will be hard to make a Finnish round of STCC (witch is completely unknown here) profitable.

As said, I still wish all the best for the project, but I'm sure this will be the first and only STCC round ever in Finland.
Valker is offline  
Quote
Old 22 Oct 2016, 08:38 (Ref:3681873)   #63
Mr Pink
Veteran
 
Mr Pink's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Sweden
Sweden
Posts: 798
Mr Pink should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by Valker View Post
I wish all the best to STCC Finnish adventure but I'm a bit skeptic.

Most Finns are only aware of F1 and WRC... and some more limited audience also knows about national rallying and maybe even Rallycross... but in general, Finns are not interested in motor sports at all.

So, it will be hard to make a Finnish round of STCC (witch is completely unknown here) profitable.

As said, I still wish all the best for the project, but I'm sure this will be the first and only STCC round ever in Finland.
That's what I was thinking too, have you had any big circuit racing events since FIA GT in Helsinki?

Maybe some well thought out promotion work can help but that hasn't really been the strong suit of the STCC organisation in the past.
Mr Pink is offline  
Quote
Old 22 Oct 2016, 14:45 (Ref:3681925)   #64
Mark0994
Veteran
 
Mark0994's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Serbia
Belgrade
Posts: 1,018
Mark0994 should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Maybe in future there will be race at Arctic Circle Raceway.
Mark0994 is offline  
Quote
Old 22 Oct 2016, 16:21 (Ref:3681940)   #65
Matt
Veteran
 
Matt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
United States
Connecticut
Posts: 7,175
Matt is going for a new lap record!Matt is going for a new lap record!Matt is going for a new lap record!Matt is going for a new lap record!Matt is going for a new lap record!Matt is going for a new lap record!
I'd really like to see a race at Ahvenisto.
Matt is offline  
Quote
Old 22 Oct 2016, 18:08 (Ref:3681962)   #66
Lando
Rookie
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Posts: 41
Lando should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by Valker View Post
I wish all the best to STCC Finnish adventure but I'm a bit skeptic.

Most Finns are only aware of F1 and WRC... and some more limited audience also knows about national rallying and maybe even Rallycross... but in general, Finns are not interested in motor sports at all.

So, it will be hard to make a Finnish round of STCC (witch is completely unknown here) profitable.

As said, I still wish all the best for the project, but I'm sure this will be the first and only STCC round ever in Finland.
The only reason there is a Finnish race on the STCC calendar next year is because LMS Racing demanded it if they were to enter, and STCC needs every team and car they can get.
Lando is offline  
Quote
Old 25 Oct 2016, 13:18 (Ref:3682740)   #67
Ralle
Rookie
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Posts: 19
Ralle should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Volvo, BMW STCC 2017?

STCC AB CEO J. Lundin wants Cyan Racing (Volvo Cars/Polestar motorsport partner) to take part in STCC TCR Scandinavia 2017. STCC AB also wants West Coast racing to bring back BMW dealer team Sweden to STCC TCR Scandinavia 2017.

But the rules by promotor World Sporting Consulting, LTD don´t allow factory teams, and rear wheel drive cars to take part. This is one of the terms in the franchise agreement.

FIA art. 263 TCN2 rules allows factory teams and rear wheel cars.

These two car brands (Volvo and BMW) are cars that have taken a major in STCC heritage. This two car brands have bring about 8 cars to the STCC starting filed every year.
Ralle is offline  
Quote
Old 25 Oct 2016, 14:46 (Ref:3682761)   #68
Quintin03
Veteran
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Netherlands
Posts: 569
Quintin03 should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Ralle, I don't know how you can be so confident of TCN2 regulations and what they do and do not permit as I cannot find the TCN2 technical regulations published anywhere. Also, how do you have personal knowledge of the contents of the franchise agreement?

I can however find the TCR technical regulations which specify what cars are eligible:
Quote:
Eligibility criteria for TCR Touring Car:
- The model of car is on the list of TCR eligible cars for 2016 published by the WSC (only front-wheel drive cars).
- The cars correspond to FIA Homologation Criteria for Touring Cars (FIA Group A).
- The model of car is produced by an OEM and belongs to a mass produced family.
- 4/5 doors
- Minimum length 4.2m
- Mono turbo charged 4-stroke petrol mass production Engines with cylinder capacity from 1750cm³ to maximum
2000cm³.
- Hybrid propulsion is not allowed.

WSC reserves the right to accept other cars, when the general characteristics match with the TCR concept. WSC reserves
also the right to approve or to refuse applications which might not be in compliance with the above criteria.


Without a WSC authorization only one Technical Form per car model will be accepted. The Technical Form Number and
the certificating manufacturer, importer or tuner will be documented on the WSC List.

For certification the minimum race car production will be 10 units in 12 consecutive months starting with the date of the
application. After the certification the cars have to be offered on the market with maximum 3 months delivery time.
Emphasis mine.

As you can see, any car differing from the eligibility criteria may nevertheless be allowed at the discretion of WSC, one example of this being the Peugeot 308 Racing Cup TCR, which with an engine displacement of 1598cm³ does not fit the above criteria. Arguably the criteria do not even specify that rear-wheel drive cars are not allowed, just that only front-wheel-driver cars are on the list of eligible cars. Nothing is holding back BMW from building a TCR car, besides the discretion of WSC, and it seems inconceivable that WSC would not certify a suitably balanced 125i because it would

Finally, while the TCR regulations require certified cars to be available for purchase to third parties, thus prohibiting manufacturers from limiting the supply of cars to only the teams of their choosing, I could not find any regulation specifically prohibiting manufacturer-associated teams from competing. Indeed in ADAC TCR Germany a Honda-backed team has already competed in every round and has managed to take 2nd in the teams championship and 3rd and 11th in the drivers championship, far from not being allowed. Cyan racing is of course independent from Volvo though associating voluntarily and should have no trouble competing in any TCR series. Also, Volvo should be able to convert its S60 into a TCR car according to the exact criteria specified above.

In other words, you're wrong.
Quintin03 is offline  
Quote
Old 25 Oct 2016, 14:53 (Ref:3682763)   #69
Bramzel
Veteran
 
Bramzel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Netherlands
Apeldoorn, The Netherlands
Posts: 3,153
Bramzel should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridBramzel should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridBramzel should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
Not only wrong, but also starting to get annoying with the whole TCN2 whining. You've made your point and nobody is interested, so get over it.
Bramzel is offline  
Quote
Old 25 Oct 2016, 16:17 (Ref:3682776)   #70
FIRE
Race Official
Veteran
 
FIRE's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Netherlands
Posts: 18,739
FIRE is going for a new world record!FIRE is going for a new world record!FIRE is going for a new world record!FIRE is going for a new world record!FIRE is going for a new world record!FIRE is going for a new world record!FIRE is going for a new world record!
Yep let the TCN2 talk behind us now.
FIRE is offline  
Quote
Old 25 Oct 2016, 17:42 (Ref:3682799)   #71
GM10
Veteran
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Italy
Mantua
Posts: 573
GM10 should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
@Quintin Honda ADAC is not an official team, it has a bit of support from Honda Germany (or Honda Sachsen, I don't remember very well) but it's formally Fugel Motorsport.
GM10 is offline  
Quote
Old 25 Oct 2016, 18:37 (Ref:3682814)   #72
Ralle
Rookie
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Posts: 19
Ralle should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Dealer team

Rules by promotor World Sporting Consulting, LTD; Factory-backed teams are not allowed in the TCR. The manufacturers offer their vehicles to the customers but are not involved in the action on the track.

Are a Dealer team a factory backed team? Team PWR racing in STCC are Seat Dealer team Sweden? http://pwrracingteam.com/
Ralle is offline  
Quote
Old 25 Oct 2016, 18:58 (Ref:3682819)   #73
Mr Pink
Veteran
 
Mr Pink's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Sweden
Sweden
Posts: 798
Mr Pink should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Grasping at straws
Mr Pink is offline  
Quote
Old 25 Oct 2016, 19:54 (Ref:3682832)   #74
Ralle
Rookie
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Posts: 19
Ralle should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Everything change´s

2015; The TCR Series – a Concept of the Time http://www.opel-motorsport.com/en/rundstrecke/opel-astra-tcr/news/article/news/detail/News/the-tcr-series-a-concept-of-the-time/


Tuner team like TCR Team FRD Motorsport (Ford Focus TCR), TCR Team Top RUN Motorsport (Subaru WRX TCR) build their own racing cars and are involved in the action on track and race.

TCR Team Kisslinger Motorsport a partner to Opel Motorsport;
"The competition version of the new Astra K TCR generation has been developed in association with Opel’s long-term technical partner, Kissling Motorsport“ http://www.opel-motorsport.com/en/rundstrecke/opel-astra-tcr/the-vehicle/

TCR Team Kisslinger are involved in the action on the track and race!

The promoptor World Sporting Consulting LTD philosophy 2015 ; Factory-backed teams are not allowed in the TCR. The manufacturers offer their vehicles to the customers but are not involved in the action on the track. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Factory-backed
Ralle is offline  
Quote
Old 25 Oct 2016, 20:15 (Ref:3682838)   #75
Quintin03
Veteran
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Netherlands
Posts: 569
Quintin03 should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ralle View Post
Rules by promotor World Sporting Consulting, LTD; Factory-backed teams are not allowed in the TCR. The manufacturers offer their vehicles to the customers but are not involved in the action on the track.

Are a Dealer team a factory backed team? Team PWR racing in STCC are Seat Dealer team Sweden? http://pwrracingteam.com/
Ralle, I would like a direct quote from the TCR regulations, similar to what I provided. I searched for the quote you provided in both the technical and sporting regulations of the TCR International series and found no match. A search on Google provided only this article by Opel Motorsport from where you seem to have copied it verbatim. (I see you have posted this yourself while I was typing this)

Also, I still want to see where you seem to be getting your information on TCN2 regulations and TCR franchise agreements, seeing as I cannot find these published. You seem to know everything, so don't ask me what sort of teams can and cannot participate in STCC under TCR regulations.

As far as I can tell, TCN2 regulations are exactly identical to TCR. Adopting TCN2 over TCR won't result in more manufacturers taking part because the manufacturer will have to build cars to the exact same regulations. Nationally homologated cars are already allowed under TCR regulations as shown by the Citroën C3 Max in the Italian Touring Car Championship's TCR class and the Renault Mégane RS in the TCR Russian Series. Moving to TCN2 regulations as opposed to TCR would do nothing but sever ties with TCR championships in surrounding countries.
Quintin03 is offline  
Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
2017 TCR International Series News & Rumours Racing Harz Touring Car Racing 527 10 Nov 2017 15:36
2016-2017 TCR Las Americas Madkart Touring Car Racing 10 3 Dec 2016 22:21
Formula Renault Scandinavia 2.0? Jimmy Magnusson National & International Single Seaters 9 6 Feb 2007 15:28
Auto Racing History In Scandinavia 1900s Yogalaura Motorsport History 1 14 Jan 2007 09:22
Kristensen sportsman of the year in Scandinavia SALEEN S7R Sportscar & GT Racing 4 30 Nov 2002 23:48


All times are GMT. The time now is 10:34.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Original Website Copyright © 1998-2003 Craig Antil. All Rights Reserved.
Ten-Tenths Motorsport Forums Copyright © 2004-2021 Royalridge Computing. All Rights Reserved.
Ten-Tenths Motorsport Forums Copyright © 2021-2022 Grant MacDonald. All Rights Reserved.