Interesting Item on New Chassis in Indy Star (Merged)

[mountainstar]

Originally Posted by JagtechOhio

"We have to keep this a surprise, to explode it out into the industry," Bernard said Sunday at an impromptu press conference at Watkins Glen International. "Anybody who tells you they know what's been decided is not telling the truth".

Yes, sure.

[JagtechOhio]

Hey Star, show me that cartoon with the hot tub. It looks familiar.

[JagtechOhio]

Maybe I have been looking at this deal the wrong way. Bolting a screamer 4 cyl turbo into a Dallara could be done...but it's still a little old school, isn't it?

Here's another idea:

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/4...c-voltage-drop

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by JagtechOhio

Maybe I have been looking at this deal the wrong way. Bolting a screamer 4 cyl turbo into a Dallara could be done...but it's still a little old school, isn't it?

Here's another idea:

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/4...c-voltage-drop

I read the Gordon Kirby interview with Mario Ilien of Ilmor fame and he said the 4cyl lacked the rigidity, if it came to an accident and thought the V6 2.4 turbo would be much better.

[JagtechOhio]

Thanks, he's not alone in that philosophy. The lack of rigidity proved to be a problem with the AER MZR-R, although the current block has been recast to better handle the torque loading from the chassis of the Dyson Lola ALMS car.

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by JagtechOhio

Thanks, he's not alone in that philosophy. The lack of rigidity proved to be a problem with the AER MZR-R, although the current block has been recast to better handle the torque loading from the chassis of the Dyson Lola ALMS car.

Is that the Mazda engine?

[JagtechOhio]

Yep. With a stressed engine, or a semi-stressed engine like the Mazda installation, the disaster is the block flexing from the chassis loads. All sorts of bad things happen inside the engine at that point. Crank centerline moves, bores move, bearings and pistons get wiped out.

So the block has to be strong enough, and the reinforcements in the engine bay (Lola A frames) do too. I never said it would be easy, but believe it achievable.

That could make me dead wrong: Ilien and one of the new chassis designers think the link cannot be sufficiently strengthened. That means a full chassis and the installation of a non-stressed unit. Or a stressed V6 like the Honda proposal.

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by JagtechOhio

Yep. With a stressed engine, or a semi-stressed engine like the Mazda installation, the disaster is the block flexing from the chassis loads. All sorts of bad things happen inside the engine at that point. Crank centerline moves, bores move, bearings and pistons get wiped out.

So the block has to be strong enough, and the reinforcements in the engine bay (Lola A frames) do too. I never said it would be easy, but believe it achievable.

That could make me dead wrong: Ilien and one of the new chassis designers think the link cannot be sufficiently strengthened. That means a full chassis and the installation of a non-stressed unit. Or a stressed V6 like the Honda proposal.

I remember this being part of your proposal and it is a valid proposal. However, in the light of the the Gordon Kirby/Ilien interview I'd be inclined to go the way of the 2.4 thurbo as used by the ACO and if rumours abound that the AAA is going to leave the FIA, that might be very favorable.

[Whosyermon]

Block flexing... like table tipping... it's a Jersey thang.

[Tim Northcutt]

BTW...

In the past, IndyCar has given the Indy Star a "heads-up" on announcements like this, provided the Star couches it with a phrase like "IndyCar is expected to announce ________ at a news conference today...."


They did it in the morning edition of the Star the morning of the IZOD Title Sponsor announcement news conference....

If they do it again, you might get an early peak ast the basics before the event itself is streamed at 12:30 p.m. EDT tomorrow.

Robin Miller said on local sports radio here yestrday that we "could see 2-3 different chassis and 2-3 different engines by 2012"

Remember, they are announcing the "Chassis Strategy" tomorrow...not necessarily a chassis that they have picked, if you really read those words literally...

Maybe they will do the "common tub/undertray" route with a series of specs for the outer portions of the car that manufacturers can design suspension parts, body panels, etc. around within those specs and mount them onto the common platform?

Who really knows until they actually spit it out tomorrow?

[JagtechOhio]

Berkman of HPD about an IndyLights motor:
"It's a production engine that's a fully-stressed member because we've done some work to strengthen the exo-skeleton but it's still a stock block, stock head."

In Jersey, you don't need an exo-skeleton. That's what the chip on your shoulder is for.

[JagtechOhio]

HPD estimated $700K for the new engine lease.

Even if a complete new chassis is only $300K, That means a chassis, T car, spares package and one engine lease is $1.5M before you bought one tire or hired one grunt to mount it.

The "cheap car" rumor is going to be about a 20% reduction in team budget. The only way to change that picture is to announce the participation of some engine manufacturer who is going to undersell Honda to the point that the whole idea won't be worth their while.

And no manufacturer has said they will participate. Tomorrow is of no import to the casual observer, who will hear that new cars won't be on track for at least another year and a half, and will remember that fact the next time he turns on an IRL race.

Completely open specs invite a host of constructors to participate. That doesn't mean they will. Unless teams are going to prepay for the design concept, constructors have no market.

[Tim Northcutt]

Miller also claimed on the radio Monday that there are auto manufacturers interested, and said RB is heading to Europe to meet with one that is "Huge"

VAG???

Fiat???

Miller has his sources, but sometimes he blows smoke.

BTW...The Indy Star had a brief items that noted that ICS will videotape the "vote" at 10 a.m. by ICONIC to be shown during the 12:30 streaming announcement...Guess they have to create some drama for this event...There is no way that they haven't voted already...

Cavin noted that at least Dallara and Lola are likely to be selected.

[JagtechOhio]

Big news on ESPN Sports Center:

Tiger is using a new putter for the Open.

[JagtechOhio]

By the way Tim, either Baretzky from Audi is a liar or Miller is completely misinformed and doesn't care to know what the truth is.

[Tim Northcutt]

Originally Posted by JagtechOhio

By the way Tim, either Baretzky from Audi is a liar or Miller is completely misinformed and doesn't care to know what the truth is.

I'm not a guy who would call someone a "liar," but the head of Audi's racing division, Dr. Ullrich, said two years ago at the ALMS Championship banquet that they "welcomed the competition from other manufacturers and to 'bring it on' with reference to Honda's LMP1 effort for 2009"

So...just how many ALMS races did Audi run last year?

Sebring and Petit...two...out of a full season...

Yeah...I'll take Audi's word to the bank...

[JagtechOhio]

I'd love to know what the "You're too late" clan is up to today. Partel wouldn't answer his mail.

[ptclaus98]

Originally Posted by JagtechOhio

Big news on ESPN Sports Center:

Tiger is using a new putter for the Open.

Exactly, anyone expecting this car to open IndyCar up to new fans on it's own, even when it does hit the track, will be disappointed. The new car is only a means to an end.

[Tim Northcutt]

Originally Posted by ptclaus98

Exactly, anyone expecting this car to open IndyCar up to new fans on it's own, even when it does hit the track, will be disappointed. The new car is only a means to an end.

Agreed...Boy, the Panoz DP01 really brought tons of fans to Champ Car, didn't it?

Now those chassis are merely hot tubs sitting on the back patios of those car owners.

This announcement is just one small piece of a bigger puzzle that needs to be solved.

[ptclaus98]

Originally Posted by Tim Northcutt

Agreed...Boy, the Panoz DP01 really brought tons of fans to Champ Car, didn't it?

Now those chassis are merely hot tubs sitting on the back patios of those car owners.

This announcement is just one small piece of a bigger puzzle that needs to be solved.

Hot tub? Pssh, I'd do some sim racing in one.

[icemachine]

Originally Posted by Tim Northcutt

Agreed...Boy, the Panoz DP01 really brought tons of fans to Champ Car, didn't it?

Now those chassis are merely hot tubs sitting on the back patios of those car owners.

This announcement is just one small piece of a bigger puzzle that needs to be solved.

Well one is being raced in the BOSS GP series and still looks fantastic

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by Tim Northcutt

I'm not a guy who would call someone a "liar," but the head of Audi's racing division, Dr. Ullrich, said two years ago at the ALMS Championship banquet that they "welcomed the competition from other manufacturers and to 'bring it on' with reference to Honda's LMP1 effort for 2009"

So...just how many ALMS races did Audi run last year?

Sebring and Petit...two...out of a full season...

Yeah...I'll take Audi's word to the bank...

They did win Le Mans this year, 1st, 2nd and 3rd and it ws helped by the Peugeots catching fire but attrition is part of motorsport.

[ptclaus98]

LOL sponsor placement

[NeilB]

Fingers crossed Dallara manage to put a good car together that produces good racing.

[DanicaFan]

Well, Dallara will be designing the new chassis for 2012. Different manufacturers will make body parts called "aerokits" on these chassis.