Patch

[Groupc]

I was doing my grumpy old man act in the office; moaning at how the previously fantastc Formula Ford Festival had degenerated into 2 semis and a final. "In my day it was a proper event" etc etc - we all know that.

I mentioned that for a while the works Van Diemens had an engine (Minister??)which had been repaired and was known as Patch. My audience had never heard of this. I know 'it' won some Festivals in the 80's, but that's as far as my recollection goes. Can anyone add to this ?

[fausto]

I remember about it, Autosport (maybe Tiff Needell) published a piece about it some time ago.....if I'm not wrong Roberto Moreno was one of the users of that engine

[jminsh]

If you ask the same question in the club level single seater area you'll probabley get a better answer as it is full of FF1600 types.

Me included.!

[Aysedasi]

I certainly remember hearing of the famous "patch" FF1600 engine. Where it came from (and indeed, where it went to) I haven't a clue. I'd be interested to know the story, though.

[JNWRF01]

Patch is sat at Minister's, owned by Roberto Moreno - last seen in the back of Steve Robertsons FF1600 until he blew it to a million pieces...

[Aysedasi]

Any more of the full story JNWRFO1?

[JNWRF01]

Patch was a repaired Minister FF engine - when the repaired the hole black it went a lot better than previously - if I remember right Moreno won the Festival with it, as did Bailey and numerous others..Robertson was last to thave the engine (as he was hardly limited on budget) and blew the thing up...by then it had been in mainstream FF for 7 seasons and was prob going past its best..I think Moreno asked Graham Fuller to find it and keep it for his collect..I am sure there are people on the club section who will tell you all the races that it won..Lets not even get started on all the other engines with names..

[Fan]

I believe that it's living in the US now, perhaps in Moreno's garage...

[Andrew Kitson]

My theory.
I believe, as do many others, that Patch was built originally by Trevor Van Rooyen in 1977, but Graham Fuller would probably deny it.

Trev built two motors and won 33 races that year including the RAC British FF Championship in his semi-works SDC Royale RP24. They were badged as Ministers. TvR built them on the bench at Royale, used Ministers dyno and Dave Minister loaned the blocks/heads and provided the parts.In return he had results - Minister beating Scholar and Trevor had free DIY engines. I was gofer for Trevor in 77. Ralph Firman and Scholar protested Trev's engines so many times. Always legal.

TvR went back to ZA to a paid drive in Atlantics for '78 for Team Gunston, so the engines stayed with The Royale team and were used in the works RMC RP24, then RP26 of Kenny Acheson. Kenny blew up one of the motors in testing. It went back to Minister and was not seen again...for a year or two.

David Minister admitted in an MN interview that Trevor was the best engine builder he had ever known and he didn't really understand how he made the power he did. TvR told me once it all came from his days racing bikes, trying to eek out as much power as possible from 125cc.

Well I reckon that Graham & David inspected that block, tried to work out what was so special and realised they could probably patch it and try to run it again. No other Minister at the time was as quick, apart from Trevor's second engine so why bother patching a run of the mill motor?
Moreno used it,so did Senna, Bailey, Gilbert-Scott, Blundell etc etc. Chances are it WAS Trev's blown motor, but even Trevor is not 100%. Minister after all would naturally want the credit as they always owned it and it was always badged as a 'Minister'.

[Groupc]

Andrew, what an interesting and knowledgeable reply. Thank you very much.

Incidentally 1977 was my first year as a 'fan' and I hardly ever missed a meeting at Silverstone. TvR was THE FF driver that year - my first non F1 hero. Next year it was Marc Smith - you must remember him with your Royale connections - he lived not far from me and fueled his van/car/truck at my father's petrol station one day early in 78 and so I followed his fortunes in the Esso and European championships - I was a very impressionable young man !

IIRC the European championship came down to a decider at Donington and (really pushing my memory now !) Marc Smith (or Kenny Acheson) spun off on the warm up lap ? Didn't John Village win it ?

Good times.

[Andrew Kitson]

Marc Smith!! He was a boy... always had us in stitches as did James Weaver.
Royale was always a busy place in those days. A production line of 4 or 5 cars being built up at any one time. Lots of other manufactururers doing the same FF thing - Hawke, Crossle, Van Diemen, Image, Lola etc etc.
Look at FF now - 2 manufacturers, possibly 3. Sad.

[Aysedasi]

Great stuff. Thanks for the info

[wheadon]

Does anyone know where the famous Minster engine (although I do believe it was actually a Trevor Van Rooyen built engine badged as a Minster) otherwise known as "Patch"?

I'd like to know a bit more about "Patch's" history as I'm only 24 but have heard that this certain engine has a bit of a myth about it back in the day! Sounds like a brilliant story!

David.

[Alan Morgan]

One story I've heard is that Roberto Moreno bought it for old times sake. Another story is that the engine eventually blew up again comprehensively and was scrapped...

[Alan Raine]

Old info

[chunterer]

Excellent little thread, I love stuff like this, it's what makes the section so interesting and enjoyable!!!

[wheadon]

Thanks for bringing up the info! Much appriciated

[Alan Raine]

I have my own "Patch", legacy of a snapped crank. The con rod punching a hole in the side before disappearing through the sump!



Unfortunately it didn't improve the performance and it's still just an average FFord engine

[Suze]

Interesting thread to read the history, thanks One of my childhood teddies / bears was named Patch after the engine....named by my Dad, of course, not named by my Mum!

[Chris Wilson]

I read an article mentioning "Patch" recently, it was either Racecar Engineering or Race Engine Technology. They went into some detail about it.

[wheadon]

if you can find out what magazine it was then it would be great!

[wheadon]

Infact, I've found this! A picture of "Patch" is at the botton!

http://www.thekentlives.com/rebuilds.htm