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Old 11 Oct 2017, 14:22 (Ref:3773669)   #46
bjohnsonsmith
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Originally Posted by S griffin View Post
The fact he wasn’t good at setup
Is that a fact? It seems more like your opinion.
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Old 11 Oct 2017, 14:47 (Ref:3773677)   #47
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S griffin should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridS griffin should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridS griffin should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridS griffin should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
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Originally Posted by bjohnsonsmith View Post
Is that a fact? It seems more like your opinion.


Nope, Colin Chapman always said his feedback about how the car behaved was frustrating and that he would always copy Emmo’s setup. Ronnie mainly relied on his talent
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Old 11 Oct 2017, 15:00 (Ref:3773682)   #48
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Nope, Colin Chapman always said his feedback about how the car behaved was frustrating and that he would always copy Emmo’s setup. Ronnie mainly relied on his talent
For someone who couldn't set up a car, he was damn quick. A total of 14 poles and 9 fastest laps, compared to Emmo's total 6 poles and 6 fastest laps.
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Old 11 Oct 2017, 15:06 (Ref:3773683)   #49
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chunder should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridchunder should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridchunder should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
I think the term not being good on setup is a little vague anyway.

If the car is inherently good, who cares?

Ronnie could drive most things, he had natural ability but not a great idea about what he wanted in a car, he would just get in and drive. That is not being good with setup, I is simply not really knowing how. Being bad on setup is not the same thing.

That skill is the equal of a talent like Mario's or Lauda's who maybe knew what was wrong and how to fix it.

Equal you say? How is that? Well if you stick Ronnie in a crap car he would squeeze a result out of it. If you put Lauda in it he would realise its limits, set it up accordingly and get a result, but you tend to think Ronnie's results would be less frequent but better!!
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Old 11 Oct 2017, 16:05 (Ref:3773700)   #50
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S griffin should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridS griffin should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridS griffin should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridS griffin should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
Yes Ronnie tended to drive around problems. He certainly had the talent to be champion, but even he acknowledged the Lotus 79 wouldn’t have been as good without Mario’s development skills
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Old 11 Oct 2017, 18:47 (Ref:3773730)   #51
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Lol

You turn away Gilles, Ronnie and a few others who actually could have won championships driving in the ways you says they cant, but did not, mainly because of a sense of duty and team play.

Yet you pick a guy who only had one shot and blew it!

I do wonder about some peoples perceptions of what it takes to win a title or be a great I really do.

Do you like sportscars by any chance, that may explain the Ickx infatuation? Which is fair enough
No need to be sarky or rude my dear chap - I just have a different view to your own, and I think a sustainable one. I am not 'infatuated' by Ickx (nor any other driver ) nor am I an especial sports car fan. I think my argument is reasonable and informed a little by the fact that I saw all the drivers from trackside in Grands Prix except Moss and Elford.

I stand by my Villeneuve view - and that puts me in a minority I know. He made far too many mistakes and lived in the moment even if on his day he was sublime. The Jimi Hendrix of drivers .

But let's remember this is all just idle opinion expressed by one anorak to another , and not an assertion of fact. So lets play nicely eh ?
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Old 12 Oct 2017, 10:40 (Ref:3773834)   #52
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chunder should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridchunder should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridchunder should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
There was hardly anything nasty in there, merely a shock of rating one driver over another, when the tide is heavily not on your favour.

Gilles I think in the right car would have been perfectly boring and monotonous at winning!! But he never really had that privilege, not until 82, even in 79 he had to work like hell and those cars were evil anyway!

I think my views of Ickx have been tainted by his opinions I have seen in interviews, wasn't he very critical of Jackie on his safety crusade? Something I personally think is rather ill judged at best. When he probably benefitted from it in later years
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Old 12 Oct 2017, 10:58 (Ref:3773838)   #53
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S griffin should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridS griffin should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridS griffin should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridS griffin should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
Ickx admitted he didn't really think about racing away from the track and so that's probably why he never quite reached the highs he did early in his F1 career later on. Probably his best race was the 1974 Race of Champions, proving his wet weather skills again
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Old 12 Oct 2017, 13:04 (Ref:3773849)   #54
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I think that there are drivers who would certainly not have been unworthy champions if the luck had run their way - off the top of my head, Ickx, Peterson, Reutemann, Pironi, Barrichello. Maybe Alboreto. But I will go in to bat for Tony Brooks, a genuinely world-class driver with talent to spare.
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Old 13 Oct 2017, 00:49 (Ref:3773936)   #55
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Ickx admitted he didn't really think about racing away from the track and so that's probably why he never quite reached the highs he did early in his F1 career later on. Probably his best race was the 1974 Race of Champions, proving his wet weather skills again
That was my third ever F1 race and remember it pretty well, especially Ickx overtaking Lauda round the outside of Paddock, which I saw as my seat was in the main stand. That's got to be one of the best moves ever.

I found these b/w highlights, with French commentary; prendre plaisir!

https://youtu.be/AVCM8lu5eow
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