Ford Escort MK1 Roll Cage FIA HTP

[Motorheadache]

Cheers Guys!


I have a question regarding my plans building up my 1300 Sport Escort for Regularity Rallyes.

I do know that actually owning the FIA regularity papers would give me the possibility to participate @ Regularity Rallyes organized by the FIA.

Anyway I was also thinking about building it up for the FIA HTP

therfore I ordered the Homologation Sheets.

Now, my actual Problem is following: I actually do not understand what the FIA attachments K and J mean in this context.

I surely know, the car would be homologated according to K (as it was built in 1973. )

Furthermore I am planning to build in a OMP, which is built according to attachment J.

I talked to the guys from HEIGO, also for the Roll Cage, and they told me, they could build me a Cage for K or for J.

As from what I read, for the Regularity Passport, I actually do not Need a Roll Cage, so i think having it homologated would not be necessary.

But instead, if i wanted to build the Escort up to FIA Homologation Group 1, i indeed would Need a homologated Cage.

Now, what I would like to know: For obtaining the FIA HTP, do I Need a Cage built up according to attachment K or would a Cage built up according to J also ok?

Can anybody tell me the difference of These two attachment Groups.

Thank your VERY much for your answers

Best regards
Motorheadache

[Greg Cozier]

I just went through all this misery with a Gp2 RS1600 build for an FIA HTP. The HTP general regs require the Mk1 Escort rollcage only touch the bodyshell at 6 points and the rear legs have to be mounted to the inner wheel arches (cannot touch the shock turrets like a Mk2 if turrets are fitted). What is more confusing is that the HRCR HVIF allows 14 points of contact so my cage is a Custom cages job with bolt/tab contacts in 8 additional places that can be removed for FIA events.

http://www.customcages.co.uk/Rollcag...&type=Historic

[Motorheadache]

thank you very much.

I found an Attachment J new built OMP Roll Cage, which touches the Car a 6 Points.
It clearly has a FIA admittance.

So you think It would be possible to build in a Cage like that and getting the HTP?

Even if the Cage is built up according to J and the cars are built up according attachment K?

Or am I understanding sth. completely different?

Cheers

[Greg Cozier]

Look here for some more info, this is my car.

http://www.britishrally.co.uk/forum/...p?f=28&t=50929

[Motorheadache]

ok,

thank you!
Just saw, i can't log in with my E-Mail adress.

Anyway, I seem to know what Problem you're talking about.

Unfortunately, even if it might Sound ridiculous,

my question is, if I can build in a roll Cage, which is built up to J conformance, even if I have a car homologated to attachment k.


Can anybody please tell me what the difference between those two attachments is, please?


Thanks

[Greg Cozier]

Which section of App. J are you referring to?

This is the list:

http://argent.fia.com/web/fia-public...penform&lang=a

[Motorheadache]

Ok

Before talking bout my Problem, I'd like to ask a General question:

Which Group would the Escort be ? Group T,ct?,GT? Which time period?

My Problem is. I do not know which Roll Cage to build in!

I do not know which Roll Cage specs this Escort model, which was homologated 5442, Needs.

What I actually know, is that getting the FIA HRCP won't Need me to build in a homologated Cage.

If I want to get the FIA HTP, I think I'd clearly Need a FIA homologated Cage.

So my actual question is:

I found this OMP Cage, which is fixed on 6 Points, http://www.isa-racing.com/index.php/...E45-Stahl.html
would I get the HTP by building in this Cage?

I see ist built according the appendix J, Article 253.

The Problem that I have is that i don't know, if a J-Cage can be built in a car from Appendix K. Or are These two assumptions Independent from each other, what would mean that it would not be a Point of interest if a Cage from J for the Escort (homologated from 1971) would be built in a car from K.

I'm sorry if I come up with such "stupid" questions, but I was actually wondering if Appendix K is talking about the state of a Cage, or if only J does.


Thank you very much for your Patience and for your answers!

Best regards
MH

[terence]

Possibly Sonny Howard of SHP Littleport,cambridgeshire could advise you? What he doesn't know about Escorts & cages could be written on a stamp.Cages come with the homologation sticker attached.

[Motorheadache]

morning!

Ok, Problem solved !
I talked to the responsibles, and they told me I'll have to have a Cage built up according to Appendix K and Period G2

While I was reading the advices to compile the application, on page 11 I found out, that the car must comply with the technical regulations for Group ? of Appendix J ? of period.

What does this mean?
Are the Groups for technical regulations in Appendix J mentioned in the Homologation paper (which unfortunately hasn't still arried )

?

Or does somebody by Chance know the Group of Appendix J the car has to meet?

Thank you verry much

Best regards

[Greg Cozier]

MH, you're getting yourself confused. Think progressively.

Historic cars have to be built to:

1. modern safety regs with rollcage period limitations
2. homologation papers
3. period App J
4. may only be modified 'as in period' in the case where App. J states total freedom.

So, for instance, if your Mk1 Escort RS1600 is entered in the pre-'72 class it must have:

1. a rollcage that meets current safety regs/homologation but only touches the bodyshell at 6 points (as in period).
2. Homologation number 1605 for mechanical and body parts offered by the factory.
3. 1971 App J for modification freedoms
4. BUT only freedom of parts used in period such as compression struts and rear axle links exactly as used in period and not a new design that would have been allowed back then under the complete floorpan freedom.

If you are still confused it would probably be easier to list the specifics of the car and seek advice on what you can and can't do.

Personally I wouldn't fit the rollcage in the link. An Escort rollcage at least should have double rear diagonal with seatbelt bars, double crossed doorbars, a diagonal roof bar and a bar crossing below the dashboard to mount the steering column. The roof and b-pillar tabs are also not allowed by the FIA.

Where is the car located?

[Motorheadache]

OK!
After having read your message, I talked to the ones in town, who do the FIA HTP work

And they told me what I wanted to know^^.
They told me how to read the Appendix K properly, and now I know, how I'll have to have built a proper save Escort Cage!

I'll have the car homologated to Period G2, as a "normal" touring car T.
The car is left pretty original, apart from other carburettors (Weber 40 DCOE), and other suspensions (from Bilstein), so I think getting the HTP won't cause me big Problems.

As you said, the Cage will have 2 diagonal bars (with belt), and also 2 door bars on each side.

As I am not from the UK and not a native Speaker, I'd be verry interested in knowing what you mean with "the Roof" and with the b-pillar Tabs.

thank you very much

Best regards

[Greg Cozier]

You want a diagonal bar over the driver/co-driver heads (the roof).

You want a bar under the dashboard with a heavy plate to mount the steering column on, this will also lower the steering column 20mm for better driving position.

The rollcage cannot touch the bodyshell anywhere except the 6 points on the floor.

Make sure you leave room on the rear rollcage legs to fit damper turrets at a later date without cutting the cage.

If you send me an e-mail I'll send some pictures greg @ barbados rally carnival dot com