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Old 8 Jun 2017, 16:34 (Ref:3739497)   #26
Gerard C
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We all agree upon the fact that an accurate and well documented scrutineering is a must. This should be done in a polite way imho not turn to a king of boxing match or hide and seek game. Last year, I had my car checked several times and got different notifications about the roll bar and the side windows for instance, always under Grp1 appendix.
Mixing cars on the same grid is usual. But when it comes to merge different levels of tuning into the same class then yes, its quite tricky (Grp 1 and 1,5 for instance).
Nick, just for the smile, we had a really genuine GTA down here but it has been a hassle to have it recognized as such. But OK, with polite, open and constructive discussions we can have the thing moving smoothly in the right way. Lets hope!
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Old 9 Jun 2017, 04:39 (Ref:3739592)   #27
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356sc should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Pleased to report that there were no issues at scrutineering, and seemed to be the same for most cars

It's going to be busy out on track , there are more than 60 entries.Ffree practice first thing this morning and then Quali late afternoon.

Forecast is rain for most of the day...could be interesting!!!
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Old 9 Jun 2017, 05:21 (Ref:3739601)   #28
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We haven't been scrut-ed yet so still time for it go wrong! Both cars out on track yesterday and no issues, Morgan out again at 0830. First of 4 sessions for us today.......

And NO RAIN yet!
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Old 9 Jun 2017, 08:12 (Ref:3739627)   #29
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delta has a real shot at the podium!delta has a real shot at the podium!delta has a real shot at the podium!delta has a real shot at the podium!delta has a real shot at the podium!
All good so far in Delta camp . First time this year I have met up with my old mate Mike complete with four bee stings . We have had some rain but it's ok now. Great to be back at Dijon . Just a fantastic place track totally unchanged just the way It was way back in the 70's Happy days . 😀
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Old 9 Jun 2017, 10:44 (Ref:3739661)   #30
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We've got a Howmet in CER1! Not the same car that raced previously with PA, but same owner. Get ready for paraffin fumes......
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Old 9 Jun 2017, 13:29 (Ref:3739692)   #31
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356sc should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Just seen the Howmet...fabulous!
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Old 9 Jun 2017, 17:40 (Ref:3739749)   #32
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grantp should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridgrantp should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridgrantp should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
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We've got a Howmet in CER1! Not the same car that raced previously with PA, but same owner. Get ready for paraffin fumes......

Er, Howmany are there?


Wiki suggests 2 were built, at some point a spare was built of an owner .... and then mentions a 4th owned by McKee where they were built.

Wrong turbines though .... how do they get papers?




http://www.racingsportscars.com/phot...04-07-035a.jpg

Last edited by grantp; 9 Jun 2017 at 17:54. Reason: Added photo link
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Old 9 Jun 2017, 18:14 (Ref:3739763)   #33
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The one Mike refers to has been modified by Crubilé Sports in France. The main thing was to have some "idle" from the chopper turbine to help when cornering and to avoid burning the brake pads too soon. Not a piece of cake, the work has been done by a former army mechanic if my memory serves. Papers? Whatzat? And noise…*
Mike, congrats to your SLR boys, as fast as a well known E Type if my reading is good. The 356 has been really fast too. Have fun.
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Old 9 Jun 2017, 19:37 (Ref:3739781)   #34
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The one Mike refers to has been modified by Crubilé Sports in France. The main thing was to have some "idle" from the chopper turbine to help when cornering and to avoid burning the brake pads too soon. Not a piece of cake, the work has been done by a former army mechanic if my memory serves. Papers? Whatzat? And noise…*
Mike, congrats to your SLR boys, as fast as a well known E Type if my reading is good. The 356 has been really fast too. Have fun.

According to Wiki the Wastegate was intended to to offer some sort of balance of power for handling issues.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Howmet_TX


From what the article says the re-turbined cars may not have the feature.
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Old 9 Jun 2017, 20:43 (Ref:3739801)   #35
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I'll ask for you, Grant, if you like it. I use to race with Crubilé's father in the '80 and know quite well his son Sebastien and one of his mechanics. I do remember discussions about this particular car and they always said it was quite a challenge to bring drivability at a decent level for a "normal" driver using it on european type tracks. Thanks for the Wiki link, this one is well documented.
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Old 10 Jun 2017, 05:54 (Ref:3739867)   #36
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Interesting, thanks Gerard! Any info would be good to receive, as I'm sure lots of tenthers like to know about such rare cars.

Meanwhile......
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Old 10 Jun 2017, 06:24 (Ref:3739871)   #37
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Mike, congrats to your SLR boys, as fast as a well known E Type if my reading is good. The 356 has been really fast too. Have fun.
Think a lot of us had a good day yesterday. The early rain was soon dried up and threatened showers later missed us. Supper in our favourite little Auberge out in the sticks was the icing on the cake!

Congratulations to Mr Ruston's mob who got the Elva GT160 right up the sharp end in qualifying for 60s Endurance. Sure that put a few noses out of joint! For the Morgan to finish P2 in the class behind it was also impressive, over a second ahead of the the fastest 911 time set by Olly Bryant. Let's hope the race is as good for both British cars!

The Stephens family were also going well in their 356, but seemed like it was the Scrutineers day for targeting that model of Porsche! After qualifying they were having the full monte along with at least one other. Hope it didn't upset any evening supper reservation, Will!

2nd qualifying for CER1 after lunch and 2hr race for 60s at 1700hrs. Fingers crossed.....
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Old 10 Jun 2017, 07:53 (Ref:3739888)   #38
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As told during winter, the scrutineers got new toys to play with, even an hydraulic lift and endoscopes. They are looking for dog engagement and when present the synchromesh system must operate when applicable. From Mister "de Polyester" words easy to spot. I wonder when they will check some 911'S wheelbase though. There is as much to improve in the chassis section as in the engine.

Anyway, have fun all and bring the cars with no damage!
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Old 10 Jun 2017, 11:05 (Ref:3739930)   #39
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John Elwin should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridJohn Elwin should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
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Interesting, thanks Gerard! Any info would be good to receive, as I'm sure lots of tenthers like to know about such rare cars.

Meanwhile......
Damn it! Should've been there - sounds like the story I am looking for...

A Howmet ran at FoS a few years ago - wonder if it's the same one?

Glad it's going well so far, Mike - I trust you are avoiding the busy little bees!
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Old 10 Jun 2017, 12:13 (Ref:3739940)   #40
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Interesting, thanks Gerard! Any info would be good to receive, as I'm sure lots of tenthers like to know about such rare cars.

Meanwhile......
Interesting photo.

Comparing to the Wiki page photos it looks like it has the same three pipes, the smaller one in the middle rather than to the nearside as per the Wiki snaps.

Here is an article with what looks like possibly a period photo of the turbine installation.

http://www.petestowe.talktalk.net/p_howmet.htm

And if this works, a photo that certainly looks like it is period from a blog.

http://flaviendachet.blogspot.co.uk/2010/05/

Quite a few more handy pics collected there as well.
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Old 10 Jun 2017, 12:44 (Ref:3739945)   #41
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I'll ask for you, Grant, if you like it. I use to race with Crubilé's father in the '80 and know quite well his son Sebastien and one of his mechanics. I do remember discussions about this particular car and they always said it was quite a challenge to bring drivability at a decent level for a "normal" driver using it on european type tracks. Thanks for the Wiki link, this one is well documented.
Gerard, from what I have read the Howmet was tricky to drive even in the relatively wide open spaces of US circuits and when fitted with a working wastegate. A track like Brands Hatch and non-working wastegate must have been impossible - hence the accident after 7 laps.

That said they qualified it 7th and there were the 3 works Porsches ahead of them plus some other useful cars so not a bad showing all things considered.

Indeed at the start they were up to 5th going into Paddock Hill Bend.

http://www.racingsportscars.com/phot...-04-07-gp2.jpg
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Old 10 Jun 2017, 15:28 (Ref:3739980)   #42
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I can't believe you both have such an interest and knowledge about this car.
OK, lets go for it! John, you got a reply to your PM.
Grant, I think the same driver owns or at least use to own 2 cars. Grant again, I tried with no success so far to contact Olivier, former helicopter pilot/mechanic who took care of the adjustment of the wastegate from the auxiliary turbine. Sorry for the bad joke about "papers" and thanks not taking it in count…
I think I can arrange a visit to the garage at least for John, because its the place I'll bring one of my cars to have it dyno tested. The rolling road is probably not fantastic but the guy has the know how. Crubilé has been chosen by La Sarthe museum to refurbish and ex Le Mans Porsche.
Please always bear in mind that historic racing in France has nothing to see with what you know in UK. I said to Mike we are underdeveloped…
The race just started, lets see what they can do!!
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Old 10 Jun 2017, 17:16 (Ref:3740006)   #43
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If I can read my computer right, I would say the SLR has been playing a lot with Biehler's leading 911 then took advantage just before the pit stop. Seems they won the GTS 11 and finished 13 overall out of 56, with a 5 laps gap with the winner (small gap for a 2 H race at Prenois).
The 356 could finish 29th.
Mike ? Champagne n'est-ce pas ?
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Old 10 Jun 2017, 17:29 (Ref:3740012)   #44
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Hi Gerard,

It seems the car(s) have been more active after their season and a bit of racing (and then the speed records) than they might have expected to be after a relatively short official racing career.

I came across this shot just now.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/smuckatelli/7743584820


Incredible hi-tech period correct support equipment deployed and I much admire the simplicity of the pit design and build.

It's interesting to consider how much potential company brand awareness Howmet may have obtained from a short but novel period of racing involvement.

The name still appears as part of Alcoa with facilities in North America and Europe.

The Howmet, Alan Mann Ford P68 ( a simply fabulous looking car ) and the Chaparrals of the period added some special interest to the meetings, in my opinion.
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Old 10 Jun 2017, 18:06 (Ref:3740016)   #45
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Correct- P13 and class win!

Luck was on our side as we were in middle of our 5'.19" pit stop when there was a short SC period. At that point there was a 911 just ahead of us but it had to do two or three slow laps behind SC, and we emerged nearly 30secs in front. For the rest of the race we matched their lap times and finished with a similar margin. Makes all the pain early in the week worthwhile!

Cold beer just consumed- hopefully podium champagne at the do tonight!
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Old 10 Jun 2017, 18:14 (Ref:3740020)   #46
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I can't believe you both have such an interest and knowledge about this car.
OK, lets go for it! John, you got a reply to your PM.
Grant, I think the same driver owns or at least use to own 2 cars. Grant again, I tried with no success so far to contact Olivier, former helicopter pilot/mechanic who took care of the adjustment of the wastegate from the auxiliary turbine. Sorry for the bad joke about "papers" and thanks not taking it in count…
I think I can arrange a visit to the garage at least for John, because its the place I'll bring one of my cars to have it dyno tested. The rolling road is probably not fantastic but the guy has the know how. Crubilé has been chosen by La Sarthe museum to refurbish and ex Le Mans Porsche.
Please always bear in mind that historic racing in France has nothing to see with what you know in UK. I said to Mike we are underdeveloped…
The race just started, lets see what they can do!!
Merci beaucoup, Gerard! I'll be in touch.

As to French historic racing, up until about three years ago we used to have a wonderful annual meeting at Croix called Grand Prix Historique, actually headed by Group A saloons, also with Maxi 1000 & 1300, FF, F Renault etc. In 2013 we also had the 500cc F3's, for which the circuit was perfectly suited. It was like being transported back to Mallory Park in about 1973, a real time warp. One or two competitors even had monkey bikes!
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Old 10 Jun 2017, 19:12 (Ref:3740033)   #47
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John, quite right, Croix en Ternois is a good place for historics. The track could be improved but the ambiance is fantastic and the spectators have a good view because they are standing above the track. Thanks to you, Bauble knows we have sheeps and monkeys down here!!
Hi, Grant, I know its not really the place but find the Chaparral was wonderful too. The Howmet is great looking, simple and clean design very compact too, like the first Lola coupés.
In period Le Mans inspired some fascinating machine. You can find the pictures of the AM ford, posted by Mike in the Jarama thread.
Because Le Mans is within one week, may be James could find interesting to open a thread about fantastic (or strange or funny or ugly of course!) machines we saw during this race. Or during the week before… I vote for Ecosse Ford (so tiny) and Sigma (Mazda too noisy, drivers too slow)!
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Old 10 Jun 2017, 19:38 (Ref:3740041)   #48
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Hmm. Lola Mk6.

https://www.supercars.net/blog/1963-lola-mk6-gt/

http://silodrome.com/lola-mk6/


I seem to recall I had a model of the Mk6 - it might well have been a slot car model - when a much much younger person. A delightful thing and the overall design - straight roof line from the top of the windscreen and the tail with the Mk1 Cortina lights seems to be echoed in the Howmet to some degree.

I had not realised that Eric Broadley made 3 Mk.6s


But we digress .....
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Old 10 Jun 2017, 19:44 (Ref:3740043)   #49
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John, quite right, Croix en Ternois is a good place for historics. The track could be improved but the ambiance is fantastic and the spectators have a good view because they are standing above the track. Thanks to you, Bauble knows we have sheeps and monkeys down here!!
Hi, Grant, I know its not really the place but find the Chaparral was wonderful too. The Howmet is great looking, simple and clean design very compact too, like the first Lola coupés.
In period Le Mans inspired some fascinating machine. You can find the pictures of the AM ford, posted by Mike in the Jarama thread.
Because Le Mans is within one week, may be James could find interesting to open a thread about fantastic (or strange or funny or ugly of course!) machines we saw during this race. Or during the week before… I vote for Ecosse Ford (so tiny) and Sigma (Mazda too noisy, drivers too slow)!
Croix en Ternois has had a few upgrades in the last two or three years - I believe it is even a few metres longer after some alterations to the third hairpin.

You're right about the ambience though; the people who run the circuit are a good bunch too & the new circuit manager is a former F3 racer.
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Old 10 Jun 2017, 22:35 (Ref:3740077)   #50
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One more digression.

I stumbled across this article about the original prototype Lola Mk.6 GT - the really smooth and simple body shape I remember best.

Some nice photos here.

http://owenauto.ca/1963-lola-mk6-gt-...-lenos-garage/

Also there's a link in the blog post to a Jay Leno's garage video about the car and its owner which, I rather suspect, will be interesting to anyone who has not already seen it.
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