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Old 24 Mar 2013, 06:40 (Ref:3223413)   #46
Langers
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Langers should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
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Originally Posted by Tourer View Post
Erebus: The engines are not competitive with the Chevrolet and Ford pushrod V8s.

AMG: Wie kann das sein? Wir sind viel weiter fortgeschritten ist, haben wir eine flache Ebene Kurbel und alle unsere Experten hier in Europa haben daran gearbeitet - wir sind die besten.

Erebus: Don't know what any of that means but we need a broader torque spread and a higher torque curve to get us out of corners better - peak power is OK but torque and flexibility is what we are lacking.

AMG: Wie kann das sein? Hier in Deutschland haben wir alles über Rennmotoren wissen, Mercedes in F1 und Sportwagen gewonnen, rasen wir in GT Serie - wir wissen alles über Macht und nachdem der Motor aufheulen schwer, mehr Macht zu bekommen.

Erebus: Don't know what any of that means but please be reminded that our cars weigh 1500 kilos, have narrow tyres and are only allowed to rev to 7,500 rpm so it is very important to deliver good torque to deal with the weight, go easy on the narrow tyres and work within the rev range. Our opposition are very experienced at this and very good, we will need to work hard to match or beat them.

AMG: Wie kann das sein? Ein Rennwagen, 1500 kg und nur revs wiegt um 7500rpm? Das ist Wahnsinn, wäre es nie in Europa zugelassen werden. Nein, wir sind Mercedes, das beste und wir erbringen müssen Motoren unserem Weg, so dass diejenigen, Kangaroo / Amerikaner den richtigen Weg, Dinge zu tun zu lernen und ändern ihre Regeln zu uns passen.

Sorry, had to be done.
PMSL
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Old 25 Mar 2013, 08:59 (Ref:3224223)   #47
ff s conscience
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ff s conscience should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridff s conscience should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridff s conscience should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
I started driving my Lancia Thema 8.32 again today.

It has a 90 degree crank version of a Ferrari 308QV engine.

Both identical 3.0 litre capacity and virtually identical camshaft profiles/other engine specs.

I also get to drive Ferrari 308 QVs on a regular basis, and am very familiar with them.

The Lancia is significantly more torquey. Incredibly so. Its engine just pulls so cleanly from low rpm around 1800 right through to 7000 or so where it kinda runs out of puff a little, although it will rev through to 7500 usable if you want to.. A 308 QV only gets going around 5000 rpm and only makes real torque/power at 7500 rpm +

Of course, there are myriad of other things to consider, but for me, flat plane crank is the root of Erebus engine deficiency, having had recent occasion to do very relevant back to back test.

I'd love them to get the FP engine going well enough to win though. Good luck to them.
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Old 25 Mar 2013, 14:40 (Ref:3224448)   #48
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I believe I read the merc runs twin throttle bodies vs the trumpet setup of everyone else. I reckon that is a bigger issue than the flat plane crank..
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Old 25 Mar 2013, 22:56 (Ref:3224731)   #49
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Somehow I dont think the AMG-SBR engine people will let this situation stay as it is for too long...

Of interest is the formation of the Erebus Acacdemy Here, with a return to F3, and karts and others...
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Old 25 Mar 2013, 23:15 (Ref:3224740)   #50
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Of course, there are myriad of other things to consider, but for me, flat plane crank is the root of Erebus engine deficiency, having had recent occasion to do very relevant back to back test.
Flat plane crank doesn't seem to make sense in a category with a 7500rpm limit and control gear and diff ratios. And it's not something Mercedes use in their cars either?

Love the sound though!

Last edited by rik; 25 Mar 2013 at 23:28.
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Old 26 Mar 2013, 08:15 (Ref:3224847)   #51
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I'm convinced the cars have been engineered to sound a certain way as part of the desired image the team wants - to position themselves as the more upmarket, sophisticated, high end outfit against the more low tech (perceived) Holden and Ford teams.
From a performance point of view it just makes no sense for them to sound as they do, especially when compared to their GT cars which sound angrier and gruntier than any other V8 on any race track in Australia and also sound much more like their road going counter parts. Given the smaller capacity the V8 Supercar engine is not going to match the GT3 version, but for such a radical difference, there has to be another outcome (image, marketing etc) involved.
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Old 26 Mar 2013, 19:46 (Ref:3225209)   #52
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I think,once again, that Mercedes and Erebus are getting confused by the spectators. Those perceptions you just voiced would probably set off alarm bells in the MB marketing lounge.
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Old 8 Apr 2013, 02:53 (Ref:3230664)   #53
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I believe I read the merc runs twin throttle bodies vs the trumpet setup of everyone else. I reckon that is a bigger issue than the flat plane crank..



Have ze Germans finally seen the light??

http://www.speedcafe.com/2013/04/06/...thurst-threat/

Quote:
...

At the heart of the team’s development schedule are two stages of engine upgrades, the first of which could be on track as soon as the fourth event of the championship at Barbagallo in May.

The car’s current induction system is understood to be the focal point of the first overhaul.

An eight-butterfly manifold, as seen throughout the remainder of the V8 Supercars paddock, will replace the current AMG SLS GT3-derived set-up, which has proven troublesome in the rapidly designed Australian cars.

A mechanical throttle is also under development after a V8 Supercars backflip on allowing AMG’s preferred fly-by-wire system.

...
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Old 12 Apr 2013, 02:24 (Ref:3232757)   #54
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Chappelli should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Maro cracks the Top 10 in P2 at Puke.... The times they are a changing?
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Old 12 Apr 2013, 02:41 (Ref:3232759)   #55
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Umai Naa should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridUmai Naa should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Leftover soft tyres?

Even Mr Moffat is up there.
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Old 12 Apr 2013, 05:07 (Ref:3232789)   #56
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Its still a good effort, with Mr Holdsworth near the front in P3.. the team seems to have had some issues with throttle response, engine driveability, boiling fuel (?) and some apparent issues with straight line handling

The various news sites seem to think the team's engines run ok in cold weather.. is it cold at Pukekohe?

Lets wait till Qualifying and see if they can patch a good result together. Here's hoping
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Old 12 Apr 2013, 06:59 (Ref:3232805)   #57
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The various news sites seem to think the team's engines run ok in cold weather.. is it cold at Pukekohe?
Wasn't what I'd call cold today... 18-19 degrees maybe?
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Old 12 Apr 2013, 07:03 (Ref:3232808)   #58
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Reload should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridReload should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
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Originally Posted by GTRMagic View Post
Its still a good effort, with Mr Holdsworth near the front in P3.. the team seems to have had some issues with throttle response, engine driveability, boiling fuel (?) and some apparent issues with straight line handling

The various news sites seem to think the team's engines run ok in cold weather.. is it cold at Pukekohe?

Lets wait till Qualifying and see if they can patch a good result together. Here's hoping
So Winton will be their Bathurst
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Old 12 Apr 2013, 07:47 (Ref:3232815)   #59
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So Winton will be their Bathurst
Qualifying is in the morning when it will be cooler. So will we see a strong result again for Lee again.
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Old 12 Apr 2013, 13:29 (Ref:3232925)   #60
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rich07 should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridrich07 should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridrich07 should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridrich07 should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
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So Winton will be their Bathurst
Next thing you know Erebus will be lobbying for an Antarctic round
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