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Old 24 Aug 2016, 17:06 (Ref:3667386)   #926
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I'm curious - do constructors in NASCAR start from the ground up, or do they source anything - rollcage, shell, body panels - from the manufacturer?
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Old 24 Aug 2016, 17:44 (Ref:3667392)   #927
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Panels have to be bought through manufactures.
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Old 24 Aug 2016, 18:01 (Ref:3667394)   #928
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I'm curious - do constructors in NASCAR start from the ground up, or do they source anything - rollcage, shell, body panels - from the manufacturer?
Manufacturers license the bodies to companies that produce stock car bodies and the team hang them themselves. I don't think any teams produce them themselves. Manufacturers design/develop the engines and they may still cast the block for the engine builders, I'm not sure. They are tube frame chassis and only a handful of teams build them.
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Old 26 Aug 2016, 00:43 (Ref:3667585)   #929
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Haas' stock car team has been very successful, whilst the technology is totally different, the same principles for racing success are transferable. Previously they purchased their chassis and motors from Hendrick, but next year with a switch to Ford, they will also be building their own chassis.
The Haas NASCAR operation arguably struggled for consistency of performance until Mr Stewart combined his resources with that operation.

Then it took off!

That squad are clearly confident that they can transition from customer to constructor in that space, and have geared up resources accordingly

Perhaps a precursor for the F1 arrangement.. although the resourcing requirement is on a completely different level as compared to NASCAR..
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Old 29 Aug 2016, 23:18 (Ref:3668511)   #930
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I'm curious - do constructors in NASCAR start from the ground up, or do they source anything - rollcage, shell, body panels - from the manufacturer?
There are three bodies allowed in NASCAR. Chevrolet SS (Vauxhall Monaro), Ford Fusion, and Toyota Camry. All cars in the field within makes are identical. They must pass a strict template and laser inspection.
Nose and bonnet are moulded carbon Kevlar. Rest of the body is pressed steel supplied by manufacturer. Chassis are hand made box section steel. Roll cage are tube section steel. Running gear is trapped in 1970's time warp, push rod motor, 4 speed dog box, solid axle with Detroit locker diff, 15" rims with 5 studs. They only just got into fuel injection a few years ago.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OC_jWuoWkQs
http://www.hotrod.com/articles/ctrp-...-gen-6-bodies/

Chevrolet teams : Motors and chassis are mostly built by Hendricks Motorsports and Richard Childress Racing, also Chip Ganassi builds fast cars.
Ford : Roush Yates build most motors and Roush build some chassis. Penske builds three fast chassis.
Toyota : Joe Gibbs Racing builds five fast Chassis and motors. Triad build other motors.

Whilst the rules and materials used in F1 and NASCAR are totally different, teams in both are spending huge sums looking for 1/10th second advantages. All the top NASCAR teams employ ex F1 staff working on the chassis, motor and aerodynamics. Jost Capito is going from VW rallying to McLaren F1, so maybe Haas stock car team can also give to his F1 team.
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Old 9 Feb 2017, 15:29 (Ref:3711232)   #931
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Things are very quiet with Haas. What I can find says there is no drama and that they are on schedule for 2017. They have passed crash tests and expect the 2017 car it to make its track debut a few days prior (filming days) to the start of official testing in Barcelona. No mention of a formal PR event to unveil the car yet. There have been a few shots on the team's Instragram account in which you can see bits of the 2017 car. It seems the photos are from K. Mag's seat fitting at the Dallara factory.

https://www.instagram.com/haasf1team/

I assume the suspension is still sourced from Ferrari. I wonder how much of the 2017 car was designed in house vs. Dallara. Given the info above (seat fitting at Dallara), I assume the 2017 car is being produced by Dallara for Haas.

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Old 9 Feb 2017, 16:57 (Ref:3711244)   #932
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good timing on the bump of this thread...came across this article on reddit this morning written by one of the people who worked on the Haas team branding and livery and wasnt sure where to share it.

its more of a personal story/journey but some interesting bits about the process that i found both interesting.

https://www.creativereview.co.uk/fro...mula-one-grid/

https://www.reddit.com/r/formula1/co...anding_livery/

Last edited by chillibowl; 9 Feb 2017 at 17:04.
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Old 9 Feb 2017, 19:10 (Ref:3711265)   #933
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Thats a great read. I generally liked the Haas livery, but actually haven't put much thought into it. Some of the photos from the top look better than the sides. This one photo from the article to me really shows how it all came together. The car, the uniforms, the equipment, the markings on the floor. Simple, clean and all very well done IMHO...



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Old 9 Feb 2017, 19:18 (Ref:3711267)   #934
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I have to say it's simplicity makes it the best looking car on the grid behind the Martini Williams
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Old 9 Feb 2017, 19:54 (Ref:3711274)   #935
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obviously the Martini Williams comes first!

but yeah, it really was a good read. i like how it highlights how an 'outsider' can bring in fresh ideas into a sport that can be, at times, far too insulated for its own good.

changing the fonts on the pit board so its easier for drivers to read at speed and borrowing an idea from Nascar to put the names of the mechanics on their uniforms are simple but great ideas to bring into F1.

im overstating my praise, but in its own way, this article makes an excellent case why small and new teams with new ideas belong on the grid.
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Old 16 May 2019, 00:07 (Ref:3904055)   #936
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Bump. Another team thread.

A quick refresh:

YearWCCPointsBest finish
20168th295th place
20178th476th place
20185th934th place
20196th156th place
2019 so far...

Since the last race they have overtaken Alfa Romeo in the championship.

Decent peddlers, but not outstanding. Decent car, but not outstanding. 5th last year, currently 6th. Is this team destined to be the median? Perhaps their model will always lead to that?
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Old 16 May 2019, 14:15 (Ref:3904131)   #937
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Much better performance in Spain, although not quite the RBR challenging pace they were promising us
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Old 17 May 2019, 00:00 (Ref:3904246)   #938
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Did they say that? Crikey! That was optimistic.
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Old 18 May 2019, 03:05 (Ref:3904441)   #939
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It’s luck whether you are quick or not.

https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/14...t-racing--haas
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Old 1 Aug 2019, 12:57 (Ref:3920657)   #940
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Time for a bump I think.

Early season form - Disappeared. Race Pace - Gone. Still OK in qualifying. The "upgrades" to the car seem to have done absolutely nothing for their race pace. Cant get the tyres into the right operating window it seems.

Drivers who have hit each other more often than not in recent races. Embarrassing radio spat with Magnussen. Grosjean still has no spacial awareness and even crashed in the pit lane.

Lead sponsor drops out with ridiculous online parting comments.

It certainly has been an eventful season so far. In the early rounds it looked like Haas would be in the running for 4th best team. Now it looks like Williams might be the only team that they will beat.

Ocon is the obvious choice if they wanted to replace one of their drivers, but he was often colliding with Perez when they were teammates. Problems obviously run deeper than the drivers, but having a pairing that do not collide with each other would at least be a step in the right direction.
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Old 1 Aug 2019, 13:50 (Ref:3920671)   #941
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Early season form - Disappeared. Race Pace - Gone. Still OK in qualifying. The "upgrades" to the car seem to have done absolutely nothing for their race pace. Cant get the tyres into the right operating window it seems.
Trouble in staying within the narrow tire operating windows seems to be the thinking at Haas...

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/s...t-car/4504906/

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Old 1 Aug 2019, 14:02 (Ref:3920674)   #942
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David should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Simple - they are having a Ferrari kind of season.
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Old 1 Aug 2019, 20:11 (Ref:3920722)   #943
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I think at times they would trade Ferrari’s woes for theirs
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Old 5 Aug 2019, 21:53 (Ref:3921593)   #944
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Figthing with a sponsor, drivers fighting each other, showing fight over 14th spot, colourfully angry team boss...its borderline disfunctional but i like it.
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Old 3 Feb 2022, 06:12 (Ref:4097198)   #945
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Franz Tost is a genius - "can't be competitive running two rookies."

Wonder how long it will take him to work out running a two year old dodgy car without any updates doesn't help either?

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/t...ance-/7822413/
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Old 3 Feb 2022, 14:49 (Ref:4097247)   #946
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I am reviving a bit of an old thread, but I think this is the closest thing to a generic Haas F1 thread.

I have generally gotten the feeling that for the most part, Haas has been going through the motions. Junior drivers with no F1 experience. Little or no development to a car that was known to have issues. That it was all just a holding pattern with minimal budget until they can get to the 2022 season and have a fresh new start with a new technical spec as well as the financial cost caps. That in a way, this is what they wanted F1 to be back when they jumped in with the 2016 seasons. I assume they have been concentrating on 2022 for awhile now.

There have been many rumors about a sale of the team (including to Mazepin). And I also wonder if they are holding on until 2022, is that to see how the team does before making a decision (go forward, or sell)? Even then, with two junior drivers, do they expect to set the F1 world on fire in 2022 even if they do have at the least an average car? Someone will always have to be at the tail end of the grid. What if all they do is close the gap to those in front of them?

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Old 3 Feb 2022, 14:58 (Ref:4097249)   #947
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Yeah, felt like they had the right idea early on with Grosjean and Mags in the car, but now they have 2 juniors in it. Last year did seem like well we can't use this next year so why bother. Now developing the 22 car during the year?? Well I guess they will know how easy it spins but can they get any development done without having the experience to know what it could be. I do wonder when Haas decides he has met his goal and gotten the Automation side of the business out there enough to sell, or if he gets a good enough offer to sell out.
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Old 3 Feb 2022, 15:34 (Ref:4097254)   #948
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surely they will still operate with not only the smallest budget but also one well below the budget cap maximum?

i also think capital investments are not part of the budget cap but doubtful Haas are making much in the way of facility/equipment improvements.

that said, maybe they find more success in operating at a leaner level and punch above their weight class? not holding out hope though.
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Old 9 Feb 2022, 12:01 (Ref:4097926)   #949
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surely they will still operate with not only the smallest budget but also one well below the budget cap maximum?

i also think capital investments are not part of the budget cap but doubtful Haas are making much in the way of facility/equipment improvements.

that said, maybe they find more success in operating at a leaner level and punch above their weight class? not holding out hope though.
They are in F1... their weight class is their 9 other competitors...
There is nothing stopping them from emulating the success of these other 9 teams...
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Old 9 Feb 2022, 19:22 (Ref:4097981)   #950
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There is nothing stopping them from emulating the success of these other 9 teams...
Apart from HAAS having no facilities to design or manufacture a car? (Despite HAAS' prowess in CNC milling machines.)

It's all outsourced and HAAS is just a workshop where they assemble the bits and go racing, which is fine, but obviously a limitation compared to being a constructor.

Customer teams with no fabrication in V8 Supercars have the same problems of being locked into uncompetitiveness (e.g., Team 18), whereas teams that design & fabricate (e.g., Erebus) can design and build their own go-fast bits.

HAAS are similarly racing against Ferrari who now design the car for them (formerly Dallara) so it's unlikely the car will be faster than the actual Ferrari car. Even if in theory, the design contracted by HAAS is done by a self-contained entity in a different office on the Ferrari campus.
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