Home  
Site Partners: Veloce Books OldRacingCars.com  

Go Back   TenTenths Motorsport Forum > Historic Racing & Motorsport History > The Chassis History Archive

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 24 Mar 2006, 20:19 (Ref:1559889)   #26
allenbrown
OldRacingCars.com
Veteran
 
allenbrown's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location:
Farnborough, Hampshire, England
Posts: 3,942
allenbrown should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridallenbrown should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Steve

This will interest you. Irvin Zwicker, who was chief crew on the Invaders that started this thread, told me today that:
Quote:
Ebby purchased both March 802's from an outfit in the U.K. who had obtained them from Ron Dennis. Both were used for hill climbs at the time. Ebby purchased them both in the late fall/early winter of 1981/1982.
Any idea who this "outfit" could be? I can't see any 802s hill climbing in 1981 except the Crompton and Lane cars and we already know about them.

Allen

PS I forgot to mention that I'd found an advert for Crompton's 802 late 1982 so it can't be his car.
allenbrown is offline  
Quote
Old 25 Mar 2006, 11:27 (Ref:1560293)   #27
Steve Wilkinson
Veteran
 
Steve Wilkinson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
United Kingdom
Southport
Posts: 2,493
Steve Wilkinson is a back marker
Quote:
Originally Posted by allenbrown
Steve

This will interest you. Irvin Zwicker, who was chief crew on the Invaders that started this thread, told me today that:Any idea who this "outfit" could be? I can't see any 802s hill climbing in 1981 except the Crompton and Lane cars and we already know about them.

Allen

PS I forgot to mention that I'd found an advert for Crompton's 802 late 1982 so it can't be his car.
I just wonder if Crompton bought all the 802s from Ron Dennis, kept one and sold the rest on? He was a bit of a wheeler dealer!
Steve Wilkinson is offline  
Quote
Old 26 Mar 2006, 12:39 (Ref:1561315)   #28
allenbrown
OldRacingCars.com
Veteran
 
allenbrown's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location:
Farnborough, Hampshire, England
Posts: 3,942
allenbrown should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridallenbrown should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
I just love it when this happens! Look what I found with the absolute minimum of effort:



Allen
allenbrown is offline  
Quote
Old 26 Mar 2006, 13:11 (Ref:1561338)   #29
allenbrown
OldRacingCars.com
Veteran
 
allenbrown's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location:
Farnborough, Hampshire, England
Posts: 3,942
allenbrown should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridallenbrown should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
So here's an update:

802-1 Ron Dennis 1980 - Japan 1981
802-2 Ron Dennis 1980
802-3 works 1980 - Japan 1981
802-4 works 1980 - loaned to Japan 1981
802-5 ICI/Fabi 1980 - Japan 1981
802-6 ICI/Thackwell 1980 - Daw, South Africa 1981 - Van Rooyen, Charlton, Goddard ... tub used to repair 802-7 mid '84.
802-7 works/Winkelhock 1980 - Krottenberger, South Africa 1981 - Hart, Scheckter, Taylor, Baker, Critchfield, Bryan, to the UK 1987 ... Roy Woodhouse (Rover turbo; destroyed).
802-8 Hotz/Studer 1980 - Hotz/rentacar 1981 ... Interserie 1983-1986
802-9 Japan 1980
802-10 Japan 1980
802-11 Hotz/Mader 1980 (did not appear in F2)
802-12 Hotz/Lienhard 1980 - Lista/Lienhard/Rottengatter 1981
802-13 Project Four Racing 1980 - Douglas & Gavin 1981 - EB Lunken 1982 - Lou Infante (Can-Am) 1982 - Jerry Molnar 1983-84 ... NZ 2006
802-14 Hotz/Hotz (- Lista/Straehl) 1980
802-15 Hotz/Schnarwiler 1980 - Harald Brutschin 1981 - Konrad T-car 1982
802-16 Ron Dennis 1980
802-17 Ron Dennis 1980 - Paul Smith 1981 ... for sale 2006
802-18 Ron Dennis 1980 - Douglas & Gavin 1981 - EB Lunken (Can-Am) 1982-83
802-19 Hotz 1980 - Lienhard T-car 1981 - Konrad 1982
802-20 Mike Earle Racing 1980 - March Racing T-car 1981
802-21 Japan 1980
802-22 Kim Mather 1980 - Roy Baker 1981 - Andy Barton 1982-1984 (as AC 3000ME GT car) - Bill Paul 1985-86
802-23 Japan 1980
802-24 Crompton 1980-1981
802-25 Lane 1980-1981 - Roger Philpott 1981-82

Odd that 802-16 vanishes so early. French hillclimbs perhaps? Or a large crash in 1980 that I haven't spotted yet?

What varied lives these cars led: hillclimbs, Can-Am, South African F/Atlantic, Japanese F/Pacific, Interserie and even GTs.

Allen
allenbrown is offline  
Quote
Old 27 Mar 2006, 09:42 (Ref:1562122)   #30
Dan Rear
Veteran
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location:
West Lancs
Posts: 2,026
Dan Rear should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
So Dennis had 6 802s, blimey, I know he had de Crasheris that year, but thats a lot of cars !
Dan Rear is offline  
Quote
Old 19 Jul 2006, 07:47 (Ref:1659747)   #31
Chris Townsend
Veteran
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
United Kingdom
London
Posts: 2,176
Chris Townsend should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Any thoughts on the likely origin of Gene Griesel's March 802 in ECAR Atlantic races in the US in 1985? It could be an 80A, but I'm surprised by the different description as there were other 80As running in that series, so identified.

chris
Chris Townsend is offline  
__________________
'Some days you eat the bear, some days the bear eats you.'
Quote
Old 6 Aug 2006, 13:40 (Ref:1675252)   #32
driftwood
Veteran
 
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 4,230
driftwood has a lot of promise if they can keep it on the circuit!
802-6 came back to Uk via Brannigan ( he brought back 2 832 cars as well form ZA 1 becamea GT car the other ran with mazda in libre then converted to F2 engine) hillclimbed in Uk then did 2 circuit races and sold to a road car trader in a part ex deal who then sold it to a racer who took the bmw for his sports car
chassis ended up in goodwood auction and bought by a non racer but he has fitted f2 bmw to the car

Andy Bartons 802 was the AC3000 Gt car sold to the hotelier then it went to Ron Cummins and not used since

Roy woodhouse car is 822 ian sheckter car from ZA
802-12 is in UK restored3 years ago and has empty engine gbox on it and been sold to a car owner ( may be on display in Brooklands museum? ) who had it for sale via Jester racing last year

the kiwi 802 is expensive for what it is needing full rebuild and with no real sereis to race these great cars in they are hard to justify owning ( i know a si have 1 as well ! )
UK HSCC cut off at 79 EEC F2 at 78 Oz have opened up to 85 and usa are really at 1980 cut off but do relax the rules for the odd entry to run
driftwood is offline  
Quote
Old 25 Oct 2006, 22:25 (Ref:1749441)   #33
Nickgoj
Rookie
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 3
Nickgoj should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
802-3

I've recently purchased the 802-3. I beleive it was living in Japan for the last 26 years. but I have no other history, although I beleive it was last driven by Hoshino. Does anyone have any more info on this car or photos. It would be highly appreciated.
Nickgoj is offline  
Quote
Old 25 Oct 2006, 22:34 (Ref:1749446)   #34
Davhut
Racer
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 378
Davhut should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Welcome to the site Nick!
We'll have plenty of photos after your first race!!
Davhut is offline  
Quote
Old 25 Oct 2006, 22:57 (Ref:1749458)   #35
Adam Ferrington
Racer
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location:
Stoke-on-Trent, UK
Posts: 143
Adam Ferrington should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Nick,

From the March works records :-

802-3 March Racing (works) Prototype/Test Car
Sold to Le Mans Co. (March Japanese agent)
Delivered 19 Dec 1979
Colour Red/White
Monocoque No. 802 M1

Hope this helps.
Adam Ferrington is offline  
__________________
ADAM
Quote
Old 25 Oct 2006, 23:08 (Ref:1749462)   #36
driftwood
Veteran
 
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 4,230
driftwood has a lot of promise if they can keep it on the circuit!
I will get my man to find photos of Hoshino in the car
what livery is on the car now?
did u get it as a roller or with bimmer fitted
driftwood is offline  
Quote
Old 2 Nov 2006, 04:29 (Ref:1755865)   #37
Nickgoj
Rookie
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 3
Nickgoj should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
802-3

Driftwood,
That would be great to get a few photos. It came as a roller and we've looked but can't find a good BMW motor for a decent price so I'll put a BDG in it. If you have them in digitals you can send them to me at nickg@collisionplus.com. THis site is great, thanks everyone!
Nickgoj is offline  
Quote
Old 2 Nov 2006, 07:34 (Ref:1755937)   #38
driftwood
Veteran
 
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 4,230
driftwood has a lot of promise if they can keep it on the circuit!
willask my man to find photos for u
putting BDG into car is sacrilege like sticking a chevy into a ferrari
They are all the same cost to buy run rebuild and maintain
The Bimmer is far better motor and it will drop straight into the car

When you go to fit the ford you will need to make new mounts brackets drill holes make new water oil lines rewire etc that will cost extra $$ and time
when you come to sell the car you will have a mongrel

These cars are not yet Hisoric but they should be -USA mono 70 and UK HSCC DBT are still stuck in the dark ages with cut off date at 1979 its been way too long at this and they should all move forward to 1985 like the Australians have done
driftwood is offline  
Quote
Old 3 Nov 2006, 05:09 (Ref:1756794)   #39
Nickgoj
Rookie
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 3
Nickgoj should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
802-3

Driftwood,
I agree with everything you said and was very concerned about the conversion and the mongrel moniker. But I have had no luck in finding a BMW engine. It seemed to me that there must be some of them around but it has not shown much promise. Suggestions? THanks for the guidance and any photos will be of great value to me.
Nick
Nickgoj is offline  
Quote
Old 4 May 2007, 08:14 (Ref:1906342)   #40
allenbrown
OldRacingCars.com
Veteran
 
allenbrown's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location:
Farnborough, Hampshire, England
Posts: 3,942
allenbrown should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridallenbrown should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by allenbrown
802-16 Ron Dennis 1980

Odd that 802-16 vanishes so early. French hillclimbs perhaps? Or a large crash in 1980 that I haven't spotted yet?
To satisfy my curiosity, I just scanned 1981 and 1982 French hillclimb results. No 802. Bernard Delage had a 812 in 1982, the old 792 was running way down the field and there were still a pair of 782s but no 802.

Checking the Black Books, F1R have it was the De Cesaris car, right up to his Misano win. So I'd guess it was actually wrecked by De C at some point and F1R have extrapolated.

Allen

Last edited by allenbrown; 4 May 2007 at 08:17.
allenbrown is offline  
Quote
Old 5 May 2007, 12:36 (Ref:1907092)   #41
driftwood
Veteran
 
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 4,230
driftwood has a lot of promise if they can keep it on the circuit!
when did de crasharis not write a car off?
there is a P4 march in NZ for sale at la la money
cant recall the number
driftwood is offline  
Quote
Old 21 May 2007, 03:07 (Ref:1917602)   #42
SeanLoh
Rookie
 
Join Date: May 2007
United States
Posts: 5
SeanLoh should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid

my father has a can-am car that is believe to be a 802, it has no i.d. plate and is running a Mazda 13B rotary, we got the car from Japan in a bunch of crates and it used to be blue. the car currently resides in southern california and we know of one that is very simular in the pacific north west. Anyone have any idea of the history of this car? or perhaps the series it ran in?
SeanLoh is offline  
Quote
Old 21 May 2007, 08:07 (Ref:1917718)   #43
allenbrown
OldRacingCars.com
Veteran
 
allenbrown's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location:
Farnborough, Hampshire, England
Posts: 3,942
allenbrown should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridallenbrown should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
I think we'll need a few more clues. Could you post some pictures? (or send them to me at allen@allenbrown.co.uk and I'll post them)

Pictures of the bodywork and of the bare chassis would be helpful.
allenbrown is offline  
Quote
Old 22 May 2007, 03:07 (Ref:1918470)   #44
SeanLoh
Rookie
 
Join Date: May 2007
United States
Posts: 5
SeanLoh should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
I don't have any pictures of the old paint work handy right now, but this is how it currently looks. We run in in HSR West and Vara. From what I understand it was run in some series in Japan supposidly called The Kimono Series. Where the cars were fitted with Mazda Peripheal port race motors.




SeanLoh is offline  
Quote
Old 22 May 2007, 08:06 (Ref:1918538)   #45
allenbrown
OldRacingCars.com
Veteran
 
allenbrown's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location:
Farnborough, Hampshire, England
Posts: 3,942
allenbrown should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridallenbrown should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
That's a fine looking car. The bodywork is quite different to anything that I've seen in the US Can-Am series.

Quite a few 802s went to Japan. You need to find the tub number and then we can look that up in March records and find out which chassis it was. The problem is that I don't know where to find the tub number on a 802.

Anyone??
allenbrown is offline  
Quote
Old 23 May 2007, 04:23 (Ref:1919233)   #46
SeanLoh
Rookie
 
Join Date: May 2007
United States
Posts: 5
SeanLoh should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
That's just the thing. The I.D. plates are missing for some odd reason. There is another car that is very much like this one, also an 802, in Washington. My father has spoken to the people over at March and it being an 802 is pretty much as far as we've narrowed it down to. What cars that went to Japan are totally unaccounted for? This car was sitting in Vallejo Califonia for several years before we bought it.
SeanLoh is offline  
Quote
Old 23 May 2007, 06:50 (Ref:1919283)   #47
allenbrown
OldRacingCars.com
Veteran
 
allenbrown's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location:
Farnborough, Hampshire, England
Posts: 3,942
allenbrown should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridallenbrown should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
A March has two numbers, one on a chassis plate and one (tub number) stamped onto the tub. Although the chassis plate can be removed, the stamped number would have to be ground off and it is highly unusual for that to happen. So that tub number will still be on the car somewhere.

Until 1978 it was found underneath the rollover hoop but then the construction methods changed and I don't know where it is on an 802.

Also, bear in mind the numbers are different. March 802-3 was built on tub M802/1 for example. If you can find the tub number, we have to use March records to work backwards and find out the number that would have been on that missing chassis plate.

Four 802s went to Japan in 1980 and another three followed in 1981.
allenbrown is offline  
Quote
Old 23 May 2007, 08:53 (Ref:1919368)   #48
driftwood
Veteran
 
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 4,230
driftwood has a lot of promise if they can keep it on the circuit!
The car is a car that raced in the Grand champion series
they where F2 cars with mooncraft bodies
the fact that this now has mazda fitted may mean it later ran in another domestic series
I will end the fotos and info to my japanese race fan

It would be useful to know who bought the car from japan and took to usa a sthat may tie back i will warn u it is hard to get minor details form these guys unless u have exact names team names etc
They are not intereste din old race cars and info is hard to come by
If 1 man ha sanswers they willnot call a team or mechanic to ask if they do not know them
Very strict cultural thing- we are probably too informal hence these threads i doubt the japanese will have threads like this

In usa there was 1 can am 802 car
1 822 allegedly a 2nd 822 car but i think its not true then i recall
2 832 cars
am i correct allen?
driftwood is offline  
Quote
Old 23 May 2007, 09:31 (Ref:1919403)   #49
allenbrown
OldRacingCars.com
Veteran
 
allenbrown's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location:
Farnborough, Hampshire, England
Posts: 3,942
allenbrown should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridallenbrown should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
In US Can-Am there were two or three 802s, one 812, one or two 822s, about 2 832s, etc, etc.
allenbrown is offline  
Quote
Old 23 May 2007, 11:11 (Ref:1919464)   #50
Dan Rear
Veteran
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location:
West Lancs
Posts: 2,026
Dan Rear should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Were any of these cars sold to the US from new as 2-Litre CanAms, or imported after a season or 2 of F2 over here. I seem to recall about 1981 there was some talk of March and Toleman/Lola selling 'new' F2s as such to the States.
Dan Rear is offline  
Quote
Reply
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
March 783 Dan Rear The Chassis History Archive 54 10 Jul 2022 01:15
March 703 - 713 RAP The Chassis History Archive 54 12 Dec 2020 18:48
March 723 Chris Townsend The Chassis History Archive 10 6 Apr 2007 15:34
March 702 robrace Motorsport History 10 11 Sep 2006 23:29


All times are GMT. The time now is 15:58.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Original Website Copyright © 1998-2003 Craig Antil. All Rights Reserved.
Ten-Tenths Motorsport Forums Copyright © 2004-2021 Royalridge Computing. All Rights Reserved.
Ten-Tenths Motorsport Forums Copyright © 2021-2022 Grant MacDonald. All Rights Reserved.