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Old 29 May 2015, 15:12 (Ref:3542559)   #51
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imo its odd for me to think that placing that kind of pressure on a 10 year old makes their life easier.
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Old 29 May 2015, 20:08 (Ref:3542658)   #52
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imo its odd for me to think that placing that kind of pressure on a 10 year old makes their life easier.
And to be fair, every single season I think has justified the support McLaren gave him.

Clearly they got it right with him. I don't really understand the argument.

If he was useless and still had all of that backing, fair enough. But he's hardly a walking money bag of uselessness, is he?

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Old 29 May 2015, 23:05 (Ref:3542700)   #53
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And to be fair, every single season I think has justified the support McLaren gave him.

Clearly they got it right with him. I don't really understand the argument.

If he was useless and still had all of that backing, fair enough. But he's hardly a walking money bag of uselessness, is he?

Selby
I really do agree with Selby here, I simply do not understand the antipathy shown by some to Hamilton. True, from the day as a 10 year old he persuaded Ron Denis to back him he has had the best equipment but he really has put it to good use every season. He was never the only one with the latest chassis or engine and I know many drivers who have had no compromise budgets that have simply failed to deliver

How many 10 year old kids would have had the brass neck to try that anyway?

He has been good value most of his career and like Senna and Schumaker before him will, of course, cash in. I have no particular axe to grind here I just find it strange how hostile some can be
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Old 30 May 2015, 06:19 (Ref:3542736)   #54
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I think that some of the responses miss the point in relation, not to his talent, but his way in to Formula 1.

I doubt if any driver since 1895 has had such a streamlined journey into Grands Prix racing as Hamilton.

Personally I am happy to recognise his ability as a driver, BUT I do not like his character as a man, and I suspect that I am not alone in that view, hence the criticism that annoys his fans. It's the singer not the song.
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Old 30 May 2015, 10:29 (Ref:3542791)   #55
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I think that some of the responses miss the point in relation, not to his talent, but his way in to Formula 1.

I doubt if any driver since 1895 has had such a streamlined journey into Grands Prix racing as Hamilton.

Personally I am happy to recognise his ability as a driver, BUT I do not like his character as a man, and I suspect that I am not alone in that view, hence the criticism that annoys his fans. It's the singer not the song.
Exactly the point I was trying to get across as a driver wow!! He is something else but outside the car is where I am not a huge fan
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Old 30 May 2015, 12:30 (Ref:3542824)   #56
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Exactly the point I was trying to get across as a driver wow!! He is something else but outside the car is where I am not a huge fan
Funnily enough, that's exactly how I felt about Nigel Mansell.
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Old 30 May 2015, 12:39 (Ref:3542828)   #57
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Since joining McLaren as a nine year old Hamilton has been given every advantage possible, yet he persists in playing the victim, and blaming others for his failures!

He is a world champion, he should behave like a world champion, and he should acknowledge the help and support he was given to get there!
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Old 30 May 2015, 14:57 (Ref:3542901)   #58
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Errrr, I thought thats what he did with the more mature comments post race instead of the surly one word answers. Wonder if that was written into his contract too..surly is a no no...
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Old 30 May 2015, 19:03 (Ref:3543006)   #59
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Funnily enough, that's exactly how I felt about Nigel Mansell.
Again same here brilliant on track love watching footage of him, interviews and everything else not a fan
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Old 31 May 2015, 06:22 (Ref:3543146)   #60
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Again same here brilliant on track love watching footage of him, interviews and everything else not a fan
There are more than a few drivers, both past and present, to which that statement can apply. Same can apply to quite a few actors.
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Old 31 May 2015, 17:29 (Ref:3543476)   #61
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I doubt if any driver since 1895 has had such a streamlined journey into Grands Prix racing as Hamilton.
im all for using exaggeration to make my point but come on there are limits!

forget 120 years of history, if you really think LH's journey was so 'streamlined' then i would like to hear why you think the multitude of pay drivers on this years grid have by comparison had it so difficult?
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Old 31 May 2015, 19:06 (Ref:3543505)   #62
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im all for using exaggeration to make my point but come on there are limits!

forget 120 years of history, if you really think LH's journey was so 'streamlined' then i would like to hear why you think the multitude of pay drivers on this years grid have by comparison had it so difficult?
When McLaren (Ron Dennis) picked Hamilton as a future star ( and what, at such an early age made him stand out?) he was put into private education, and groomed for stardom. All of his racing paid for, always placed with the best possible team, carefully kept from the British Public's eye by racing in European series. (Why did he not contest the UK Formula 3 Championship, always regarded as one of the best proving grounds for future F1 drivers?).

From the age of 10 he was destined to drive for McLaren, a top team, in Grands Prix, and so it worked out, and when teamed with a double World Champion, was given his head to compete on an even basis.

I am happy to be proved wrong if you can name another driver with so many advantages, Rosberg with his father's background still had to fight his way up on merit. Privileged? Yes! But certainly not to the same extent.

Lewis Hamilton was never a pay driver, he has always been a paid driver.

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Old 31 May 2015, 22:51 (Ref:3543563)   #63
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There's a guy on the grid whose country's oil concern pays like 30mill a year for his place on the grid. How much easier does it get than that?

Anyways if you think living up too and surpassing Ron's expections since the age of ten made his path or life an easier one then I suppose we are at an impasse.
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Old 1 Jun 2015, 03:49 (Ref:3543636)   #64
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I'm thinking he hit the placard because he screwed up his braking distance. It's a pretty easy mistake to make when rage or ego is obscuring your vision.

I've always thought that professional drivers, being paid million dollar contracts, with tens of thousands of impressionable young fans, need to be held to a higher standard when it comes to their behaviour on the world stage. But I'll admit I'm a bit old fashioned on that one and today's celebrities... that's what F1 driver's are... know that their brand is more effected by lack of publicity, rather than an excess of it and that talent is not necessarily a measure of success.
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Old 1 Jun 2015, 07:07 (Ref:3543669)   #65
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I'm thinking he hit the placard because he screwed up his braking distance. It's a pretty easy mistake to make when rage or ego is obscuring your vision.

I've always thought that professional drivers, being paid million dollar contracts, with tens of thousands of impressionable young fans, need to be held to a higher standard when it comes to their behaviour on the world stage. But I'll admit I'm a bit old fashioned on that one and today's celebrities... that's what F1 driver's are... know that their brand is more effected by lack of publicity, rather than an excess of it and that talent is not necessarily a measure of success.
I think that running into the third place placard was the racing drivers version of going home from work after a bad day at the office and kicking the cat!
I also think it was a way of showing how peeved (not my initial choice of wording) he was for finishing in that position.
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Old 1 Jun 2015, 07:17 (Ref:3543672)   #66
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[QUOTE][Anyways if you think living up too and surpassing Ron's expections since the age of ten made his path or life an easier one then I suppose we are at an impasse. /QUOTE] Chillibowl.

Hi Chills, As you say we must agree to disagree on Ham's path into F1, I would take an issue with your comparison with the chap sponsored by the Peoples Dispensary (For) Very Sick Animals.

He has merely bought a drive in Formula 1, which is not quite the same thing as Lewis' being 'bought' at an early age by McL as a protégé.

Still don't worry, you can't always be right.

Kind regards,

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Old 1 Jun 2015, 07:23 (Ref:3543673)   #67
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I'm thinking he hit the placard because he screwed up his braking distance. It's a pretty easy mistake to make when rage or ego is obscuring your vision.

I've always thought that professional drivers, being paid million dollar contracts, with tens of thousands of impressionable young fans, need to be held to a higher standard when it comes to their behaviour on the world stage. But I'll admit I'm a bit old fashioned on that one and today's celebrities... that's what F1 driver's are... know that their brand is more effected by lack of publicity, rather than an excess of it and that talent is not necessarily a measure of success.
Most drivers away from the circuits lead a quiet life, but there is one who is constantly in the public eye, appearing on a regular basis in 'celebrity mags', newspaper gossip columns often with some glamorous escort on his arm. One who seems to court 'celebrity status'.

Bernie thinks this is good for the sport, raises the profile of Formula 1, so the example set should be exemplary ..... Shouldn't it?

Old Fashioned Man.
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Old 1 Jun 2015, 08:12 (Ref:3543690)   #68
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I doubt if any driver since 1895 has had such a streamlined journey into Grands Prix racing as Hamilton.
Last time I checked, Nico Hulkenberg, as an independent, had a pretty streamlined way to the top.

And of course there's Max Verstappen.
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Old 1 Jun 2015, 09:29 (Ref:3543706)   #69
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Last time I checked, Nico Hulkenberg, as an independent, had a pretty streamlined way to the top.

And of course there's Max Verstappen.
Let's face it very few drivers get in to Formula 1 on pure merit, and I agree that many are 'streamlined', however, I would still maintain that Lewis had it pretty much on a plate from a very early age.
I am not saying that it was necessarily easy, he must have worked hard to deserve the chance, and proved a well worthwhile investment for McLaren at the end of the day, but it was all laid on for him from day one.

Clearly having a famous Dad has helped a few people along, Nico, Max, today and Damon Hill and Jacques Villenueve yesteryear. Whether it be the name, money, or contacts it does make life easier.


Jenson has always been a mystery to me in that respect, he did not win the British F3 Championship, but still went straight in to F1 and is still there.

I am not aware of any big backers, and his Dad was never 'famous', although he was always totally supportive.

Then! What do I know?

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Old 1 Jun 2015, 10:00 (Ref:3543714)   #70
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Sometimes just being in the right place at the right time leads to appointments that others might query. For example, Damon Hill was a phenomenal test and development driver who has often been credited with the successful cars that the Williams team produced around that time. However, I am not aware that there were any teams trying to lure him into a race seat, and it was really only the tragic death of Senna that propelled him into the race car after Monza. It could be debated from here to eternity whether he would ever have given a race seat if circumstances had been different.

Just a few things about Button. He was very successful in his karting during his formative years, and that propelled him into the British Formula Ford series which he won in his first season. Next up to British F3, winning 3 races and Rookie of the Year. Won Autosport Young Driver of the year, and as a prize had a test drive in a McLaren. My guess is that Frank Williams and Patrick Head had been watching his progress, and thought highly enough of him that they gave him his chance. And 12 or so years later, he is still a safe pair of hands, as well as a thoroughly decent bloke.
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Old 1 Jun 2015, 11:25 (Ref:3543736)   #71
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When McLaren (Ron Dennis) picked Hamilton as a future star ( and what, at such an early age made him stand out?) he was put into private education, and groomed for stardom. All of his racing paid for, always placed with the best possible team, carefully kept from the British Public's eye by racing in European series. (Why did he not contest the UK Formula 3 Championship, always regarded as one of the best proving grounds for future F1 drivers?).

From the age of 10 he was destined to drive for McLaren, a top team, in Grands Prix, and so it worked out, and when teamed with a double World Champion, was given his head to compete on an even basis.

I am happy to be proved wrong if you can name another driver with so many advantages, Rosberg with his father's background still had to fight his way up on merit. Privileged? Yes! But certainly not to the same extent.

Lewis Hamilton was never a pay driver, he has always been a paid driver.

Cheers,

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What may I ask do you see as a problem with any of that? I suppose if his father was rich and paid for his racing that would be a problem as well? RD saw a talented driver and if anyone has spent time around someone talented in any sport it stands out like dogs whatsits. So what would have been the alternative, for RD to walk away and leave the family to their own resources and the world might not have seen his talent as it has done. There are plenty of drivers, some most probably better that Hamilton who have failed to rise through the ranks due to lack of money and everyone here missed out on seeing them perform their magic. I read recently, (was it here?) of Hamilton's team mate who was at least as good but fell by the wayside due to financial problems, it would have been awesome to have seen both of them in F1 together.
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Old 1 Jun 2015, 12:30 (Ref:3543762)   #72
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Although slightly off-topic according the thread title, this story does follow on from previous posts.
I attended the 1983 (I think) Formula Ford Festival at Brands Hatch, something that should have been a useful barometer of up & coming racing talent at the time.
From memory of looking through the race programme a few years ago, the only familiar name from then who had 'made it' further was Johnny Herbert.
Now, I have maybe missed a couple more competitors at that event who did make the big time, but the point I am making is that whereas there may be a number of highly talented youngsters around, but without the breaks and/or the backing, they will never make the big time.
(Although I'm not a soccer fan, I also bet that there are a few guys kicking a bag of wind around in a Sunday Club game who also have the talent & ability to be a professional, it's just that this hasn't been recognised).
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Old 1 Jun 2015, 12:56 (Ref:3543768)   #73
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it was really only the tragic death of Senna that propelled him into the race car after Monza. It could be debated from here to eternity whether he would ever have given a race seat if circumstances had been different.
You're getting him mixed up with David Coulthard there, Mike. Hill was promoted to a race seat after Mansell left.
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Old 1 Jun 2015, 14:05 (Ref:3543788)   #74
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[QUOTEWhat may I ask do you see as a problem with any of that?][/QUOTE]

Casper, I do not have a problem with this at all, I know that there were a lot of talented youngsters around at the same time as Lewis, Dan Wheldon, Anthony Davidson to name but two. Both achieving a great deal of success.

I am not trying to attack Hamilton or belittle his achievements here, I am simply stating my personal opinion that his passage through to the highest echelon of the sport, was easier than any of his contemporaries. I am fairly certain that he was probably the first youngster to be picked out from a crowd and groomed for the job, despite his lack of backing from sponsors or rich parents. I believe that his colour, and his obvious talent singled him out, (and there are no racist undertones intended)* just as some day it will be a female who gets the nod.

* It was Lewis himself who said; "It's because I'm black."


No I don't care for the guy as a person, but I am not so bigoted as to deny his ability or success.

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Old 1 Jun 2015, 14:29 (Ref:3543805)   #75
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Yeah, it was Coulthard that replaced Senna - and that after Imola not Monza.
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