Official Round 15: Japanese Grand Prix - Page 2

CTD · 7 Oct 2012, 07:02 (Ref:3147421)

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Knowlesy · 7 Oct 2012, 07:27 (Ref:3147434)

Come on Kamui!

**bjohnsonsmith** · 7 Oct 2012, 07:29 (Ref:3147436)

Alonso out on lap 1. I said it might take a dnf to do it.

Knowlesy · 7 Oct 2012, 07:33 (Ref:3147437)

Kobayashi on the podium! Great stuff!

And Massa too. Somehow.

The absolute state of the coverage then though. Yeah, let's watch Vettel and Massa cross the line miles apart from anyone else.

Car crash directing.

Knowlesy · 7 Oct 2012, 07:43 (Ref:3147441)

Not too bad for Hamilton either really, it looked grim early on and even a points finish looked doubtful.

Typical though. His record when Alonso retires is a DNF and a fifth. And now Red Bull are starting to look dominant again.

Sigh.

formerf1champ · 7 Oct 2012, 08:14 (Ref:3147452)

Quote:

Originally Posted by bjohnsonsmith

Alonso out on lap 1. I said it might take a dnf to do it.

Don't say it again!

CTD · 7 Oct 2012, 08:19 (Ref:3147455)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Knowlesy

Not too bad for Hamilton either really, it looked grim early on and even a points finish looked doubtful.

Typical though. His record when Alonso retires is a DNF and a fifth. And now Red Bull are starting to look dominant again.

Sigh.

Indeed! - what started out as an amazing season for McLaren and Hamilton, is crashed and burned.
I'm starting to wonder what it is there is wrong with McLaren since they always throw everything away when they have the better car!
Red Bull can dominate, Ferrari can dominate, but McLaren can't...

Tom Kristensen explained why Grojean got the 10sec S&G, with the reason that FIA is getting worried about the "playstation generation" who spends more time in a simulator than in the actual car, and therefor lacks the respect of the older generation.
Something I find understandable seeing Grojeans accidents this year!

Pingguest · 7 Oct 2012, 10:47 (Ref:3147523)

I believe Fernando Alonso lost the title today. As Red Bull seem to have regained their 2011 form, Ferrari loses ground. Because the Scuderia have issues with their wind tunnel, major improvements should not be expected.

aneesh99 · 7 Oct 2012, 15:09 (Ref:3147616)

Quote:

Originally Posted by CTD

Tom Kristensen explained why Grojean got the 10sec S&G, with the reason that FIA is getting worried about the "playstation generation" who spends more time in a simulator than in the actual car, and therefor lacks the respect of the older generation.
Something I find understandable seeing Grojeans accidents this year!

Isn't it the FIA that threw down the in season testing ban? Perhaps they can tell me how a young driver in F1 is supposed to get experience without a simulator...

**Aysedasi** · 7 Oct 2012, 15:20 (Ref:3147626)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aysedasi

I gave it a 7.

What do you mean I'm too early???

And man was I over-optimistic.........

Spritle · 7 Oct 2012, 15:39 (Ref:3147641)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pingguest

I believe Fernando Alonso lost the title today. As Red Bull seem to have regained their 2011 form, Ferrari loses ground. Because the Scuderia have issues with their wind tunnel, major improvements should not be expected.

As much as it pains me...I agree 100%.

CTD · 7 Oct 2012, 16:15 (Ref:3147671)

Quote:

Originally Posted by aneesh99

Isn't it the FIA that threw down the in season testing ban? Perhaps they can tell me how a young driver in F1 is supposed to get experience without a simulator...

The problem isn't the testing ban, it's the "over" use of simulators which are to easy to reset when you crash...

djinvicta · 7 Oct 2012, 16:53 (Ref:3147693)

Quote:

Originally Posted by djinvicta

Pehaps McClaren dont want the No1 and No2 numbers to go on a Mercedes next year...
Tongue in cheek
After his news of the move came out, it must affect the attitude of Lewis side of the garage surely?

Yes, its true..No way will Lewis win this year now. Ronspeak, and the silence is deafening

**Peter Mallett** · 7 Oct 2012, 18:32 (Ref:3147758)

Interesting to note that now he's trying to behave, Maldonado is nowhere. I sense the same result for Grosjean.

It does tend to support the the lack of testing as being the problem. However, I suspect there's more to it hand just that.

**bella** · 7 Oct 2012, 18:36 (Ref:3147761)

do you think a lack of familiarity with the car is a distraction and not just a "i don't know how wide it is" thing for example? if you know *exactly* what the car will do under set circumstances, then surely it allows you more brain time to actually think about getting past the fella in front?

Icebaby · 7 Oct 2012, 19:04 (Ref:3147772)

Why does Vettel change his crash helmet every race, does he have shares in a helmet company or an undecided mind....

NPP · 7 Oct 2012, 19:19 (Ref:3147778)

Quote:

Originally Posted by bella

do you think a lack of familiarity with the car is a distraction and not just a "i don't know how wide it is" thing for example? if you know *exactly* what the car will do under set circumstances, then surely it allows you more brain time to actually think about getting past the fella in front?

this sounds very plausible - on the other hand, today the first guys to tangle in a rather avoidable manner were Alonso and Raikkonen

**Aysedasi** · 7 Oct 2012, 19:26 (Ref:3147784)

As a matter of interest, was there any stewards investigation of their (admittedly minor) contretemps?

frostie · 7 Oct 2012, 19:39 (Ref:3147793)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter Mallett

Interesting to note that now he's trying to behave, Maldonado is nowhere. I sense the same result for Grosjean.

It does tend to support the the lack of testing as being the problem. However, I suspect there's more to it hand just that.

Maldonado qualified third in Singapore and had a very strong opening stint and would have finished comfortably in the points if not for a mechanical failure. This weekend the Williams wasnt as strong as I had expected but Pastor still came out with 8th place and some points so it's a bit unfair to say that he's nowhere. He's clearly trying to calm down and stop making mistakes and obviously he's probably losing a little bit of speed but finding the balance between speed/aggression/consistency is difficult. I think that we'll see how well be is adapted to finding this balance next season

beau1 · 7 Oct 2012, 20:29 (Ref:3147818)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter Mallett

Interesting to note that now he's trying to behave, Maldonado is nowhere. I sense the same result for Grosjean.

It does tend to support the the lack of testing as being the problem. However, I suspect there's more to it hand just that.

I don't see this at all, in the last two races Maldonado has been well ahead of where the Williams 'should be'. He had a pretty good chance of getting a podium at Singapore before the car gave up on him. Today the Williams was well behind the Red Bull, Mclaren, Sauber and Ferrari on overall pace.

It seems a shame that some people seem to have something against Maldonado even if he quietly does well.

**Peter Mallett** · 7 Oct 2012, 21:23 (Ref:3147849)

Frostie, Beau1. As you wish. I tend to disagree though, he's suddenly just a points scorer rather than a winner. The tide is turning?

As to putting a car beyond where it should be?

beau1 · 7 Oct 2012, 21:38 (Ref:3147865)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter Mallett

Frostie, Beau1. As you wish. I tend to disagree though, he's suddenly just a points scorer rather than a winner. The tide is turning?

As to putting a car beyond where it should be?

You never know where these cars have been

.

The problem I have with your point is that it assumes that we saw Pastor as a potential winner in the Williams before he won; I don't think anyone really predicted him to win a race in that car did they? Even at the start of the season we could all see the improvement but the best we could have hoped for was maybe a lucky podium.

At Spain the car simply suited the track and Williams haven't found a track to match it since then even though Pastor has managed to show some good pace.
His season has been very much like Rosberg's, one fairly comprehensive victory at a track where the car just worked but has been unable to get near to that point again. I'd argue that Maldonado has had a better season on pace than Rosberg but has obviously got involved in far too many incidents.

**bjohnsonsmith** · 7 Oct 2012, 23:19 (Ref:3147911)

I haven't actually watched the whole race; I got home at 8ish in the a.m. to catch the end so I know the result, just want to see if it was good one so the rerun of BBC highlights will help but highlights are never quite the same.

QnickFTW · 8 Oct 2012, 00:51 (Ref:3147940)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter Mallett

Interesting to note that now he's trying to behave, Maldonado is nowhere. .

Interesting to call his ridiculously fast front-row lap in Singapore "nowhere".... He does exactly what he needs to, over achieve on Saturdays and plays the invisible man (albeit baskets some points) on Sunday.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Icebaby

Why does Vettel change his crash helmet every race, does he have shares in a helmet company or an undecided mind....

Most of his helmets are auctioned for charity. Besides, all thru his junior years he wasnt allowed to use anything other than a standard Red Bull can looking desing, now he goes to town and have fun with it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by djinvicta

Pehaps McClaren dont want the No1 and No2 numbers to go on a Mercedes next year...
Tongue in cheek
After his news of the move came out, it must affect the attitude of Lewis side of the garage surely?

Thats an interesting point.

JB and him finished 4th and 5th, with JB clearly out of the hunt, its a bit curious.

It's also been reported (and Withmarsh was quoted as saying) that Lewis is out of the loop as far as updates go. He can have them on his car, but he will know as little detail about them as possible and is no longer involved in the development of the car (as it slowly but surely shifts towards next year's projects too) It might have been the reason behind Lewis' saturday set-up issues (which were not standard I didnt think, he is more than capable of setting up a car for a hotlap 10 out of 10 times usually)

Tough times for Lewis for the last few races I think, but the runner-up spot is still very much up for grabs.

**bjohnsonsmith** · 8 Oct 2012, 00:58 (Ref:3147942)

Quote:

Originally Posted by QnickFTW

It's also been reported (and Withmarsh was quoted as saying) that Lewis is out of the loop as far as updates go. He can have them on his car, but he will know as little detail about them as possible and is no longer involved in the development of the car (as it slowly but surely shifts towards next year's projects too) It might have been the reason behind Lewis' saturday set-up issues (which were not standard I didnt think, he is more than capable of setting up a car for a hotlap 10 out of 10 times usually)

Tough times for Lewis for the last few races I think, but the runner-up spot is still very much up for grabs.

That's going to require a couple of DNFs or very low finishes on behalf of Alonso and Vettel and we saw that with Alonso today. Then again Hamilton might have a DNF or two.

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