[Official] Chinese Grand Prix 2016: Grand Prix Weekend Thread

[stripedcat]

It looks like Ferrari are fast here. Maybe the Mercs are sandbagging. Anyway, another Nico win? He has won in the past. Or maybe a Ferrari win? Either way - it looks unlikely that Lewis will win at this rate.

[MCWB]

Is this NASCAR? Use inters, close the DRS, go easy on the throttle... how many options are there? Let's get on with it!

[Mike Harte]

I don't think that anyone will be surprised that Rosberg is on pole, yet again.

What is interesting is that his Mercedes is one tyre compound plus quicker than the opposition. Whilst Ricciardo joins him on the front row, he did so because he was using the super-softs to set his time, whilst Rosberg was able to better him by about half a second but on the softs.

This pretty well re-affirms my conviction the Mercedes are dominating F1 presently not just because they have a far superior PU, but because they have produced a vastly better overall package that the rest of the pit lane; this would include the chassis, the aero and the power-unit at a minimum.

[Razor]

Originally Posted by Mike Harte

I don't think that anyone will be surprised that Rosberg is on pole, yet again.

What is interesting is that his Mercedes is one tyre compound plus quicker than the opposition. Whilst Ricciardo joins him on the front row, he did so because he was using the super-softs to set his time, whilst Rosberg was able to better him by about half a second but on the softs.

This pretty well re-affirms my conviction the Mercedes are dominating F1 presently not just because they have a far superior PU, but because they have produced a vastly better overall package that the rest of the pit lane; this would include the chassis, the aero and the power-unit at a minimum.

IMO, I think Red Bull have a better chassis/areo than Mercedes but that TAG/Renault power plant is still woefully down on Mercedes.

[Mike Harte]

Originally Posted by Razor

IMO, I think Red Bull have a better chassis/areo than Mercedes but that TAG/Renault power plant is still woefully down on Mercedes.

I don't, for even one millisecond, deny that the Mercedes power-unit is superior, but that does not account for the fact that the Mercedes can still beat the opposition using harder rubber. The car obviously sticks to the track better than all the rest, which is not a benefit derived from it's power-unit; it comes from it's chassis, etc.

Unless, of course, you believe that the Mercedes is around 1.5-2 seconds quicker along just the straight bits of the circuit.

[bjohnsonsmith]

Nico's on pole and Lewis is 22nd at the back of the grid; seems to be an ERS issue. Otherwise Ricciardo is on the front row, keeping the Ferraris at bey on the 2nd row. Good to see the Toro-Rossos, in 8th and 9th, should mix things up a bit. Not such a good performance from Haas.

Glad to see Alonso back.

[wdave0]

Originally Posted by Mike Harte

I don't, for even one millisecond, deny that the Mercedes power-unit is superior, but that does not account for the fact that the Mercedes can still beat the opposition using harder rubber. The car obviously sticks to the track better than all the rest, which is not a benefit derived from it's power-unit; it comes from it's chassis, etc.

Unless, of course, you believe that the Mercedes is around 1.5-2 seconds quicker along just the straight bits of the circuit.

Don't forget that more power allows the car to carry more downforce (drag), affecting the entire performance envelope.

[canamman]

Sign of a true champion is how they can
come from the back . Go get em Lew!

[Beryl]

Originally Posted by Mike Harte

I don't think that anyone will be surprised that Rosberg is on pole, yet again.

What is interesting is that his Mercedes is one tyre compound plus quicker than the opposition. Whilst Ricciardo joins him on the front row, he did so because he was using the super-softs to set his time, whilst Rosberg was able to better him by about half a second but on the softs.

This pretty well re-affirms my conviction the Mercedes are dominating F1 presently not just because they have a far superior PU, but because they have produced a vastly better overall package that the rest of the pit lane; this would include the chassis, the aero and the power-unit at a minimum.

What are you on about? Did you even watch qualifying?

Rosberg set pole on the super softs, not on the softs. He used the softs in Q2 and he was slower than the Ferraris during that session. Though Rosberg was ominously close to the Ferraris with the slower tire, the delta between the two compounds during qualifying was likely far less than what was expected due to cold track conditions; the super softs were degrading demonstrably over a single flying lap while the softs held up far better. This is backed by Raikkonen more-or-less matching Rosberg in Q3 on the same tire. Raikkonen was quicker than Rosberg through the first two sectors on the last qualifying run, before Kimi cocked it up in the hairpin. Perhaps Kimi wouldn't have supplanted Rosberg from pole, but he would have been right there without the error.

And all of the aforementioned regards qualifying pace; Ferrari looked really strong on Friday long runs, they could be right there with Mercedes on race day.

I would not dispute that Mercedes still have the best overall package, but Ferrari are right there and are increasingly threatening to Mercedes.

[ozrevhead]

Originally Posted by Mike Harte

Yep, bella, just looked at Sky. It would seem as though Hamilton disagrees with the team's own briefing, even though he doesn't think that it matters what was the cause of the problem. Personally, I would put my money on the team; I would imagine that they would have a better understanding of the cause, unless, of course, they are covering for a problem that might have been caused by Hamilton.

Why would they want to do that?

Onto quali - I'm glad they went back to 2015. There is nothing wrong with it. I also acted like Danny won the race when he ended up on the front row. probably will get swamped by Ferrari

Rosberg is in the zone right now, may that continue

[bjohnsonsmith]

Not a good start for the Ferraris, as Kimi goes off and Lewis loses his front wing.

[bjohnsonsmith]

Ricciardo's left rear is punctured, probably all that carbonfibre from the start and now they bring out the SC.

[Reload]

Hamilton comms to team " I think that we should try the alternate strategy, have a think about it", team responds " we're already on the alternate strategy "

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by Reload

Hamilton comms to team " I think that we should try the alternate strategy, have a think about it", team responds " we're already on the alternate strategy "

I thought that was Hulkenberg?

[bjohnsonsmith]

Great move by Ricciardo on Hamilton.

[bjohnsonsmith]

Congrats to Nico, though it might well have been a different story if Ricciardo hadn't got that puncture. The Rosberg juggernaut rolls on. It didn't really happen for Haas this weekend.

[Adam43]

I like how they wanted to finish even if there are advantages to not doing so.

[Mike Harte]

Originally Posted by Beryl

What are you on about? Did you even watch qualifying?

Rosberg set pole on the super softs, not on the softs. He used the softs in Q2 and he was slower than the Ferraris during that session.

No, I no longer bother to watch F1.

But to answer the part about the tyres. Reporting on the tyres in the media is sketchy, but a couple of the reports seem to suggest that Rosberg went out on super-softs at the beginning of Q3, but apparently changed back to softs for his final pole qualification. This seems to be confirmed by further reports that stated that he was starting on softs, whilst his fellow front row sitter, Ricciardo, would have to start on super-softs.

This is one of the reasons that the rules in F1 are so ridiculous; there is/are no definitive website/s that is/are easy and free to access that can explain the stupid regulations so that a person without a PhD in Formula 1 can understand them, and then lay out in an easy to understand format what approach each driver took.

[F J Nedos]

I think ze kraut whinged too much about Mr Kyvats move... Thought it was good.

[wdave0]

Originally Posted by Mike Harte

No, I no longer bother to watch F1.

But to answer the part about the tyres. Reporting on the tyres in the media is sketchy, but a couple of the reports seem to suggest that Rosberg went out on super-softs at the beginning of Q3, but apparently changed back to softs for his final pole qualification. This seems to be confirmed by further reports that stated that he was starting on softs, whilst his fellow front row sitter, Ricciardo, would have to start on super-softs.

This is one of the reasons that the rules in F1 are so ridiculous; there is/are no definitive website/s that is/are easy and free to access that can explain the stupid regulations so that a person without a PhD in Formula 1 can understand them, and then lay out in an easy to understand format what approach each driver took.

The cars start on the tires they use for their fastest Q2 lap, not Q3. So Rosberg only had to set a top 10 time on softs in Q2 to get into Q3 where he could use the ss like everybody else. Still taking advantage of the MB speed but only a top ten time on harder tires, not pole.

[Mike Harte]

Originally Posted by wdave0

The cars start on the tires they use for their fastest Q2 lap, not Q3. So Rosberg only had to set a top 10 time on softs in Q2 to get into Q3 where he could use the ss like everybody else. Still taking advantage of the MB speed but only a top ten time on harder tires, not pole.

Thanks for that; I certainly seem to have lost the "plot". And this is indicative of what is wrong with F1 at the moment; the rules and regs are changing so often that it's hard to keep up.

And it makes me question why they have changed it. The rule that all Q3 participants had to start on the same compound as they used to qualify was set in place to try to give the other competitors an advantage that they could use either compound to start the race.

As I said, everything is getting too complex for a simpleton like me!

[Born Racer]

A very exciting race in Shanghai again.

Rosberg did everything he had to to take six on the bounce. He's been driving very well in 2016 but fortune has also smiled on him and some time soon he's not going to be gifted events like Ricciardo's puncture and Hamilton's issues (as I'm sure Nico himself is fully aware) and then it will be great to see if he can maintain the upper hand that he seems to have held since late last season.

Hamilton put in a characteristically battling drive and put a thrilling move on Bottas. There was also a move earlier in the race where he was close to getting two in two successive corners.

I think when Vettel takes a look at some replays, he'll see that Kvyat was simply really good into Turn 2. Turn 1 and Turn 2 is either one long corner or two depending on how you're driving it (around the outside line it's like one turn) but if you're coming up the inside on Lap 1, it can be two, and Daniil seized the initiative in that second part.

Ricciardo drove really well today and I would love to know how he would have done without the puncture. I want to know why there wasn't any yellow or safety car earlier with all the debris you could see around. I mean I'm not a big fan of too much safety car and I don't know if it was sent out solely to recover the Mercedes wing, but it was too late for him and put paid to a big opportunity for him.

As for Hulkenberg's antics, it's not good, although technically what was the crime? The report says something about driving unnecessarily slowly in the pitlane. Is that specifically written into the regulations?

Didn't Vettel overtake him with his wheels outside the track limits? That could constitute breaking the rules.

[TrapezeArtist]

Originally Posted by wdave0

The cars start on the tires they use for their fastest Q2 lap, not Q3. So Rosberg only had to set a top 10 time on softs in Q2 to get into Q3 where he could use the ss like everybody else. Still taking advantage of the MB speed but only a top ten time on harder tires, not pole.

A clever bit of strategy. Rather like stopping Hamilton twice under the pace car in order to "use" the compound that they didn't want to race on. Two fine bits of Chapmanesque thinking.

Circumstances prevented us seeing if Rosberg's strategy worked, and clearly Hamilton's didn't. But probably only because his aero damage was knocking out even the Softs too quickly.

[TrapezeArtist]

Originally Posted by Mike Harte

And it makes me question why they have changed it. The rule that all Q3 participants had to start on the same compound as they used to qualify was set in place to try to give the other competitors an advantage that they could use either compound to start the race.

As I said, everything is getting too complex for a simpleton like me!

Unfortunately the people who make the rules are not as clever as the people who have to work with the rules. The change to starting on Q2 tyres instead of Q3 tyres was a tweak because too many drivers were sitting out Q3 knowing that there was more advantage in saving tyres than in chasing around and still getting the P9 or P10 that was the best they could ever hope for.

[TrapezeArtist]

Originally Posted by Born Racer

I think when Vettel takes a look at some replays, he'll see that Kvyat was simply really good into Turn 2. Turn 1 and Turn 2 is either one long corner or two depending on how you're driving it (around the outside line it's like one turn) but if you're coming up the inside on Lap 1, it can be two, and Daniil seized the initiative in that second part.

As for Hulkenberg's antics, it's not good, although technically what was the crime? The report says something about driving unnecessarily slowly in the pitlane. Is that specifically written into the regulations?

Didn't Vettel overtake him with his wheels outside the track limits? That could constitute breaking the rules.

I think Vettel was way out of order. If he had complained about Kimi running wide and then cutting back across him, he might have had a better case. But far from that, in trying to backtrack from what he said about Kvyat, he has now apologised to Raikkonen.

Regulation 27.5: "At no time may a car be driven unnecessarily slowly, erratically or in a manner which could be deemed potentially dangerous to other drivers or any other person. This will apply whether any such car is being driven on the track, the pit entry or the pit lane."

And Regulation 27.4: "Drivers must make every reasonable effort to use the track at all times and may not deliberately leave the track without a justifiable reason.

Drivers will be judged to have left the track if no part of the car remains in contact with it and, for the avoidance of doubt, any white lines defining the track edges are considered to be part of the track but the kerbs are not.

Should a car leave the track the driver may re-join, however, this may only be done when it is safe to do so and without gaining any lasting advantage. At the absolute discretion of the race director a driver may be given the opportunity to give back the whole of any advantage he gained by leaving the track."

So it seems that Vettel was entitled to overtake in the pitlane entry provided he didn't have all four wheels off the track (and he only put two off).