The ASM/Hamilton domination has tarnished the credibility of the F3-Euroseries.

[Frank_White]

I think that especially because of ASM, one wonders whether driver skill is so significant in the Euroseries. I doubt that Senna could join the Euroseries in car other than ASM and beat Hamilton.

Because of this the series is not providing a true indication of driver skill.

I dont know much about Adrian Sutil but before this year there is no indicator that I have seen which suggested that he is an incredibly gifted driver. I am inclined to believe that Rossiter is superior to Sutil. However, because Sutil in in ASM he consistantly beats everyone other than Hamilton.

[Mekola]

Me too. And I wonder what Esteban Guerrieri could do if he was in a better team (Prema, Signature-Plus for example). Despite Kolles/Midland Euroseries is, for the moment, his unique chance to remain in European racing scene.
ASM F3 -> ART GP2 -> Ferrari F1??? It seems to have the same line.

[Russfeld]

It'd be better if it was still a three car team with 3 good drivers.

[strider]

Presumably they dropped down to two cars because of the ART GP2 involvement.

[BootsOntheSide]

Teams finishing 1-2 in jonior championships is nothing new, and doesn't neccessarily discredit the drivers or the championship. Both Anthony Davidson and Jamie Green came 2nd to their team-mates as British F3 rookies, and nobody suggests that they aren't as good as those results show. Everyone's working within teh same parameters in a series in which money isn't the biggest issue, so well done to ASM and Lewis for getting the job done, and good luck to everyone else in trying to close the gap.

[flor]

well they also dominate the international races like zandvoort and macau, so does that tarnish the credibility of F3?

[SFonseca]

Originally Posted by Frank_White

I am inclined to believe that Rossiter is superior to Sutil. However, because Sutil in in ASM he consistantly beats everyone other than Hamilton.

You can't forget that James Rossiter lost many points in accidents and Adrian Sutil is far from a bad driver.

ASM Team is winning everything because they are really the best!
We have to accept...

[Kicking-back]

Credibility is not damaged.

When you have an open formula this can happen.

[Suze]

A dominant team is simply a dominant team. It's up to the other teams to develop their cars to a higher standard to be more competitive. It's not ASM's fault they're much quicker than everyone else!

[Russfeld]

I think Mercedes are to be blamed for a good portion of it.

[Suze]

How can you "blame" anyone? Fact is they've got a better car than anyone else. End of.

[Frank_White]

All that was said above is true. My point is that the series has lost credibility as a indicator of driver talent.

In fact there has been a marked lost of interest in the f3-euroseries since the ASM/Hamilton domination has become apparent. The races come and go and often there is not even a thread to mark their passing. for ASM to have such a significant advantage over its rivals is causing the Euroseries to suffer.

[BootsOntheSide]

A championship's role as "an indicator of driver talent" is much more compex than simply looking at the results and deciding that the guy who finsihed 4th is better than the guy who finished 5th. Plenty of drivers have got noticed while driving mediocre machinery in the past - Mansell and Damon for a start. Suggesting that Mercedes are rigging the championship is a little extreme.

[Chucky]

No, Mercedes can't be accused of rigging anyhting. They can be accused of providing overwhelming support to the "chosen ones" in order to ensure that the 3 pointed star continues winning.

Remember, they don't go racing unless they know they can win.

Let this be a lesson for all you out there that wish for big manufacturer support as this is the most likely outcome.

[runshaw]

Well IMO we are witnessing the birth of a true superstar in the form of Lewis Hamilton. Of course, ASM probably have the best car, but the domination could also be down to the sheer speed and brilliance of Hamilton!

Even though there are other good drivers in the euroseries like Rossiter, I think it is clear that Lewis is just streets ahead of him and everyone else! Remember that he also dominated British FRenault in 2003 with 10 victories from the 15 races he contested, missing the last 2 races. In that year, Rossiter won one race. He then went on to get pole at the Korean F3 Superprix in only his 3rd outing or something in F3!

IMO F3 isn't losing credibility because of Hamilton's domination, it is just a joy to see someone with bags of talent. Jamie Green was fairly dominant with ASM last year, but he only won 6 races, Hamilton has 9 (I think) from 12 races. This just portrays it is Hamilton doing the goods, along with ASM.

[Russfeld]

Hamilton is good, no question, but is Sutil really that close to him? Green at least had Salignon and Premat to contend with, and the odd Opel challenges. I think F3 should be more like a Formula Ford setup. One tire, one engine, lots of different chassis. You dont learn much as a driver with different engine packages.

[JJ Jet Plane]

How about looking at this in another way?

Everyone (except Carbone) is using the brand new Dallara F305 this year, so all drivers and teams had to suss out the new car. Many of them are probably still doing that (eg Mucke Motorsport and Vettel - with Mercedes engines and off the pace all year - suddenly bouncing up to take a second at Norisring).

Shouldn't we accept that ASM and Hamilton have done a brilliant job? And shouldn't we acknowledge that it's due to the brilliance of both ASM/Hamilton in testing, understanding and engineering the car that Sutil is right behind his team leader? In other words, Hamilton has not only done a great job for himself but also for Sutil.

OK this is only a theory but quite a plausible one I think.

[mcurtis26]

The ASM domination has certainly put some drivers off as they feel if they cannot raise the budget for a seat with ASM they may as well not bother.

[bella]

asm have done an absolutely brilliant job with the cars. word from someone that tested them is that they're easy to drive, there's no fighting with the handling, they're on rails. hamilton is a great driver, but he is definitely flattered by his car. then again, at noris, he seemed to have quite a lot in reserve during the race, while sutil wasn't that far away.

and finally : someone give carbone a medal. the slc car isn't anywhere near as good as a dallara clearly, yet he manages to thrash it to silly positions in qualifying and the race. that's a bit off topic, but it needs to be said.

[fantasytoca]

Is this really very different to the domination Carlin used to have in British F3 or Fortec / Manor used to have in Formula Renault - its the way it goes, the best team with the best driver romps away from the rest.

I dont see it has done anything to harm the credibility of the series at all - stick a good driver in a good car and they will deliver the goods - stick a mediocre driver in a good car, or a good driver in a mediocre car and they will struggle or fail to deliver.

It is for the other teams to engineer their cars as well as ASM - if they cant do that then IMHO its a case of put up or shut up.

[BootsOntheSide]

The only way to guarantee that a junior championship is a 100% reliable barometer of driver skill is for all the cars to be provided form a central factory and racn in identical conditions rather than by teams. Even then, you would lose the aspect of a driver's setup skill being an advantage (and deny them a chance to master this area of a racing driver's armoury), and would still have a situation where experienced guys have an advantage.

[Russfeld]

No one's asking for Utopia, but the current Euro F3 situation is rubbish. Especially with all the talk from McLaren about how grand F3 is and how amateur GP2 is.

[karimbo]

ASM: a Formula 3 team with a McLaren Mercedes structure. ASM is probably a better team than Minardi, despite they race in two different championships. Last year in the same car, Kubica was faster than Hamilton, and Sutil an unknown driver. This year, Hamilton is the most dominant driver in autosport. Sutil will have an easy 2nd place in the championship. But Sebastian Vettel and Max Gotz are much better driver than Adrian...

[bella]

of course mclaren think f3 is grand. they're spanking everyone at the moment...

[littleman]

There is much more to the ASM/Hamilton/Mercedes/McLaren domination of F3 than most people seem to realise.Given that Renault now control EVERY recognised junior formula that leads to F1 (and the talented young drivers who come with it!), it should come as no surprise that McLaren/Mercedes have identified F3 as the one door left open to them and champion it's merits accordingly. I think it's quite plausible for F3 to become Formula Mercedes by stealth, with ASM,Manor,Mucke etc either knowingly or unknowingly contributing to this domination.It's been Formula Dallara on the chassis front for many years so why not engine domination too.Everybody will want a Merc engine next year that's for sure!